What maximum amount of full crosswind do you land

[M20BE]

One of the myths is that Mooney has difficult landings,

I do not have a problem with the Mooney landing, i just need to get the SPEED right, but hey, aren't we all suppose to do that in every plane we fly ? 

But talking about rudder authority, the Mooney has not that big rudder authority as for say a PA28 for example, so i come to this question, what is your personal limit to land your Mooney in a full 90 degrees X-wind ?? 

Thanks

[DonMuncy]

I don't trust what the reported winds are.  I come in on final in a crab.  Somewhere on final, I apply rudder to see if I can allign with the runway.  If I can hold it in alignment, I land.  If I can't, I dont. 

[mooniac58]

Quote: DonMuncy

I don't trust what the reported winds are.  I come in on final in a crab.  Somewhere on final, I apply rudder to see if I can allign with the runway.  If I can hold it in alignment, I land.  If I can't, I dont. 

 That is basically my take too, with a little room for cushion since I might not be able to compensate for a shift further to the x-wind component or a gust.  However, I have made quite a few landings with a reported 12-13KT x-wind with no trouble and plenty of remaining rudder and wingtip clearance on the dipped wing.

I just picked up my high performance endorsement yesterday in a C-182 and I forgot just how easy those high wings are to land...I prefer the added challenge of landing the Mooney, since landing is definately the most exciting part of a flight.

[RobertoTohme]

With t/o flaps, speed at no less than 80 kts, speedbrakes deployed, one hell of a crab angle that gets kicked out on the flare, and when wheels positively down dump the flap...  The long body Mooneys have better rudder arm than the short body type so rudder is more effective.  It helps that I operate on really long and wide runways, because it'll sway towards the side the wind is coming from and I let it go a little before correcting to keep the side loads on the mains to a minimum.   Not pretty, but effective; and for passengers, nerve wrecking.

[M20BE]

Can you do a forward slip in a Mooney with full flaps ? Is that allowed ?  

[M20BE]

Great post Jim, thanks

[mooniac58]

Thank you for this!

[eaglebkh]

Quote: RobertoTohme

The long body Mooneys have better rudder arm than the short body type so rudder is more effective.

[mooniac227]

With high crosswinds, I don't like waiting until the flare to "kick it out".  I like to know in advance of the flare if I'm going to have enough rudder to straighten it out.  That way, I have more time to make a go-around decision and more room for execution if need be.

I'll also chime in that I think the Mooney has a bad rap for being difficult to land.  Although it might be "different" than other aircraft, it is certainly not difficult.  From my perspective, once one understands how to land a Mooney, it is actually quite easy and consistent.  Crosswinds are not difficult either.  Either you have enough rudder or you don't.  If she lines up, land it, if not, go around or go somewhere else.

[RobertoTohme]

Quote: eaglebkh

That's really hard to call. With regard to x-wind landings and given the same rudder (excluding the non-tailcone rudder models), the added moment arm of the longer body is almost cancelled out by the fact that the body is longer and has more weather-vein effects. In other words, the wind has a greater moment arm as well to match. Of course, this is just my judgement based on my recent aerodynamics/structures background in college.

As I have never flown a long body, I can't testify to it's x-wind landings ability compared to my E. Wasn't going to post here since it's a modern Mooney board, but since the short body issue got brought up, I'd thought I'd chime in.

Again, just my judgement and it's not based on any tests or experiences.

[deadbug]

For me, if I hear the current winds being called at a level that gives a crosswind component approaching 20 knots (including gusts) it gets my attention to prepare for a possible go-around situation.
Similar to other posters above, I fly down final in a crab, transitioning to the conventional side slip (smoothly adding rudder to align the airplane with the runway with coordinated aileron input as necessary to eliminate drift) on short final approaching the flare. 
If I could not hold the airplane aligned with the runway with up to full rudder, then I would execute a go-around, and if necessary, divert to my "wind" alternate.
Also, many times due to location of wind equipment, the actual conditions in the flare over the runway are far less challenging than the reported winds might indicate.  Of course the opposite may occur also...ya gotta be ready.  But, I would in most cases, give it a responsible look-see.

I think the discussion about forward slips is a bit of a red-herring here. Forward slips have never been recommended as a crosswind technique; and as Bob Kromer mentioned, the longer body Mooneys (K and higher)..can get you in trouble at slow speed/high angles-of-attack.
As a side note here, I have only utilized/taught forward slips during simulated/actual engine-out landings when EXCESSIVELY HIGH and all other drag options have been exhausted (full flaps, speed brakes) to get the airplane to touchdown and land successfully in the forced-landing site. Also, I emphasize "burying the nose" and keeping the speed up when accomplishing them in a M20J or earlier airframe (not K or later unless the alternative to not using the forward slip was unacceptable, ie. certain death)

Bill
CFII, ATP

[deadbug]

Quote: JimR

....but I see no reason to reserve the use of forward slips for life or death situations. They are just another tool in your aeronautical toolbox... 

Actually, Jim I agree wth you.  I didn't mean to imply that forward slips were only to be used in life or death situations--In my previous post, I was referring (toungue in cheek...but I guess it didn't come out that way) to the long-body Mooneys (K and higher)...in light of Bob Kromer's bottom line for those operators in general.

With that said, I have done many very aggressive and full forward slips in my J and earlier models both on my own (for fun making short approaches ;-) and while instructing without experiencing any unexpected negative aerodynamic behaviors.  However, I only routinely taught them for use in the excessively-high-energy-during-the forced-landing situation when there was no further drag available--and S-turning back and forth wasn't an option.

Bill

CFII, ATP

[67M20F]

I like to slip and slide! That said i landed in a 20+ gusting wind in logandale NV direct cross, i screwed up the first one and she took care of me on the second. I have noticed that i seems to me that at about 20 ft from the rny is seems to loose most of the crosswind, i mean i seems to almost go away. Anyone else see this in there mooney, i have done alot of crosswind work in my plane so i dont think its just in my head but who knows.

[Cruiser]

Quote: 67M20F

snip.... I have noticed that i seems to me that at about 20 ft from the rny is seems to loose most of the crosswind, i mean i seems to almost go away. ...........snip