A64Pilot

Flutter is usually pretty destructive or if your lucky enough to survive flutter it’s usually at least very damaging. The way flutter is controlled is by those weights, that’s why they exist on most aircraft, if you ever repaint flight control surfaces or repair them, it’s very important to check their balance, the more nose heavy a flight control surface is, the more resistant to flutter it is, so within limits, being nose heavy is a good thing, so if you have to rebalance, do so towards the nose heavy limit. Installing a tail mounted ADSB tail beacon could put the rudder out of limits, depending on how heavy the stock light was. If God forbid a flight control weight were to separate at higher speed, that ought to guarantee flutter. Another thing that can start flutter is worn Heim joints in the flight control system or mounting points of the flight control, it seems for whatever reason trim tabs have the most wear, not a concern for us as we don’t have them, I don’t miss them personally. the variable incidence horizontal is a better design. In my opinion. ‘Most that have flown higher performance RC models have seen flutter, often what happens is you see something come off of the aircraft, then hear a buzz sound. May as well set the radio down, cause it’s all over before you even heard it.

I believe just an A&P can obtain a ferry permit, IA not necessary, it may save a few bucks. https://resources.savvyaviation.com/wp-content/uploads/articles_eaa/EAA_2014-04_ferry-permits.pdf personally I’d borscope the cylinders, pull two jugs to inspect cam and pre-oil liberally before starting. I’d then run it for a few minutes cycling prop, mag checks etc. then drain the old oil and cut open and inspect the filter to ensure no metal, then do the ferry flight. Of course if possible it’s best to delay purchase until successful completion of pre-buy/ annual if possible, maybe a large sum in escrow may help there and you purchasing ferry insurence, so your going to have some money into this, but be careful of the sunk cost fallacy, because it is a fallacy. ‘I’ve seen both astonishing great buys and of course the opposite, it’s corrosion that is the real aircraft killer, paint, windows, interior, avionics etc can be dealt with at your leisure or as you can afford it.

I believe someone posted earlier in the thread, and I know someone here on this forum installed a vapor cycle airconditioner in their baggage compt, there is a thread on it, but I don’t know if it is the same brand name, but a BTU ought to be a BTU. I guess try searching for that thread?

The ice chest coolers don’t work off of evaporation, they aren’t swamp coolers. so they will work even in very high humidity. I know I had one for doing test flights in a dark colored airplane is S Ga during Summer, it worked great, until the ice melted which didn’t take as long as I thought it would. I had one hose blowing down on me from above.

Some aircraft, the T-6 Texan and the P-51 and all Thrush crop dusters have locking tail wheels, to unlock them the stick is released and allowed to fall full forward, so you taxi without touching the stick, then before takeoff you pull the stick back, this locks the tail wheel and you go. All of those aircraft were North American / Rockwell designs and an automatic locking tail wheel was considered desirable, other aircraft the tail wheel has to be locked prior to takeoff On smaller and lighter tailwheel aircraft that have Mr Maule’s tailwheel design, (steerable tailwheel was a Maule invention) it’s common to taxi with the stick aft to help prevent nose over and stick into the wind just like you do all small aircraft. I can’t imagine why anyone would be moving the stick around during taxi? But I concede your point that anyone should notice control locks engaged, but for some reason many haven’t. ‘I know nothing about this aircraft and have been wondering what turbine is only 400 HP? sort of small for most turbines. Even the -21 Bill Hatfield uses on his 206 conversions is 550 SHP, but you can derate anything.

Even a .25 bolt in shear between three pieces has its shear load over two points, and the force to shear a .25” bolt between two tight fitting lugs is huge. ‘If it had even been a close thing, it woud have been child’s play to upsize the bolts, but they weren’t because they didn’t need to be. I assume they are AN bolts not even NAS? NAS are stronger of course

I thought the gear were down in the pictures? I’m looking at them on an Ipad so I don’t see things as well as if I had a big monitor. ‘Even gear up, I’, not so sure a Mooney can get over 300 kts in less than 2,000 ft, that’s only a few seconds to double your airspeed. But yes if he could get to over 300 kts, it’s likely to be shedding parts due to flutter.

This was a friend of mine and my mentor as a civilian test pilot, long story but Rockwell recreated the failure in the wind tunnel and from the onset to complete disintegration was less than 1 sec. https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/2731 The aircraft had been dove to VD several times in the past, what was different in this test flight was that Ralph had the trim tab driven to full down so that he didn’t have to hold so much control pressure, Rockwell in order to make manufacturing easier only had one trim tab on the tail, this along with the control doublet which was part of the test set up the flutter. The other person onboard was the Flutter Engineer who had been told if your so sure it’s safe, then you get on board for the flight, which he did. ‘I don’t know about then, but today you don’t take observers along on a high risk test flight like a dive to VD. On edit this is Ralph’s Book, he literally wrote the book on GA flights testing, he got his Doctorate in Aeronautical engineering from Aachen University in Germany and I believe was taught by one of the Horton brothers, but not sure about that. https://www.thriftbooks.com/a/ralph-d-kimberlin/1235913/

I don’t believe the rates of descent are possible. You just can’t go from level flight at what assumption is less than gear speed as his gear were down to over 300 kts in 2,000 of altitude? Remember the gear are down so their drag at those airspeeds are quite substantial. I doubt the aircraft could achieve those speeds from 10,000 ft. I accept you guys analysis on reported speeds, just believe the data is flawed ‘I also don’t believe the horizontal failed due to flutter, but from a tremendous overload, remember to pull the nose up at high G, the Horizontal has to develop a large downward force, I believe the wing and tail failed at about the same time, neither from flutter, failure modes are different so the investigation will be able to tell. I believe that because in other accidents where the tail has failed, the wing actually fails downward as after the tail failed there is a huge neg G load on the wings, but in this case it seems apparent that the wings failed from positive G.

Depending on things like color of aircraft, but probably not, then of course define cool. ‘However what I’m sure they can do is get the cockpit real cool siting in the hangar running off of shore power if you will, and then keep things cool enough for run up and climb to altitude, but an aircraft sting out side heat soaked? ‘It’s going to be awhile to cool off once you get to altitude. Most smaller auto’s are about 1 ton, SUV’s can easily go to three tons. 12,000 BTU per ton and the average house has a three ton AC unit give or take. So 7,000 BTU isn’t a whole lot, especially if your airplane like mine has a dark topside.

Yes, but I believe the tail bolts are in shear and the engine mounting tension, shear loading is much, much stronger than tension. The Wings on a U-21 which is a Beech Queen Air are held on by three bolts, two for lifting up. and only one for neg G’s, they are in tension as well. Many helicopter rotor systems are held on by one nut. ‘Just silly observations. Unless I’m mistaken but Va has nothing to do when something will break, it’s simply when a full, rapid control movement will exceed Certified G limits. Even G limits really don’t necessarily have anything to do when something will break, Normal category aircraft are if memory serves are Certified to +3.8 and -1.52, doesn’t mean anything happens at those G numbers, just that the aircraft can handle Ultimate load, which again by memory is 1.5 times that amount without failing, it is allowed to bend or deform at ultimate, just not break, for three seconds anyway. ‘Some aircraft are much stronger than min required, some just barely meet the requirement, but ALL meet it. Most are I’d say well exceed it as it’s real hard to design to barely pass, it’s much easier to design to be much stronger so that if your off a little, you still pass, redesigning is expensive, costs weight though. What is not accounted for, at least I’m sure what isn’t accounted for in CAR3 aircraft is aging and fatigue,so it’s prudent for a manufacturer to well exceed min requirements for new parts so that when they accumulate thousands of fatigue cycles and decades of aging, that they are still strong enough. Want to bump Va to a higher number? It’s simple just turn control authority down to min required, Va will go up as control authority goes down. Of course you can’t do that will all types of aircraft, some require more maneuverability than others.

I just popped into the last page of this. ‘But on the C02 thing, it only takes a little to kill you, ask any re-breather diver, it’s not that the CO2 displaces O2, it’s the CO2 causes loss of consciousness, seizures etc. which leads to a rebreather diver drowning of course and not so good for a pilot either. If memory serves less than 5% CO2 and your worthless, 7% or so and it’s lights out.

After about 10 years the age of a vehicle loses a lot of relevance, after that it becomes more of a condition than age thing, even boats. We just came off of living on an 1987 Island Packet sailboat for three years and cruising, other then normal maintenance that boat cost nothing. I spent a shed load of money on improvements like a watermaker. generator. solar, etc, etc. but an IP is known as a well built expensive boat and they hold up, if properly maintained. With larger more expensive boats you have what is called a Survey done, it takes a full day if done correctly and is a very in-depth inspection, the first boat we bought. busted the survey, it was a three year old Hunter and had hull structural problems. What I am saying is that there are airplanes made in the 60’s that are both corroded pieces of junk, and pristine nearly perfect airframes, as good or better than new. The trick is identifying which is which, and odds are the perfect ones don’t go cheap either. There are also aircraft less than 20 years old that are pretty much junk, it depends on how well they have been kept up. This is a picture of a couple of 1940’s aircraft both in great shape, the C-140 is mine, and she turned 75 years old this year, but she is kept in a climate controlled hangar where the humidity isn’t allowed to go over 65% RH, so she should last for longer than I will. For aircraft age is really just a number, condition is what’s important and unless your an expert only way to determine that is to hire one to inspect. Just like boats, a real expert can almost certainly pretty quickly tell you if in their opinion a true in depth inspection is warrantied or to keep looking,so you don’t have to pay for a full in-depth inspection if you will listen to them, move onto the next airframe. A survey and sea trial would have told you to keep looking with that boat you bought.

I used to always prefer a Timken myself, but I believe they have been mostly Chinese made for quite some time. ‘Hopefully not, I’d like to think they survived, but I’m afraid that the common wheel bearings aren’t US anymore, hopefully at least the high dollar special ones are still? I don’t know this, just one of those rumors you hear.

Youngest is 22, oldest is 36 but they are still our kids,and it’s just a saying. End of last year we moved off of the boat, sold it, bought a house and had to buy a whole lot of “stuff” for the house that we got rid of when we moved aboard, the plan was to cruise for five years, but my knees didn’t last that long and the Pandemic sort of killed cruising the Caribbean anyway, we we only got three years. May sound silly, but I miss the Nomadic lifestyle of waking up in the morning and deciding if you want to find a different anchorage or just go Lobstering where you are, or just go sailing for the heck of it. Bought the Mooney and of course it took some cash and work to get it where I wanted it, it will always be a work in progress, nature of the beast, but so was the boat. If my knees had held out I think we would have stayed on the boat, but I couldn’t see living aboard with knee surgeries as you have to climb onto and off of a boat. Besides living in a Marina just isn’t the same at all, all the disadvantages, but none of the advantages.

As a kid learning to fly string control line models that was a trick to de power the airplane for training, putting the prop on backwards makes the trailing edge. the leading edge. it will still develop thrust, just not as much. I had a Cox PT-19 that was held together with rubber bands and was pretty darn tough. ‘Anyone else fly control line models?

I’ve actually seen that done, I don’t know how well it worked though

Yeah, I think it takes a couple of seconds to realize there is a problem, then maybe a sec or so before you react, and first instinctive reaction of course is to push the nose down and by the time you realize that’s not going out work, it’s too late. ‘The Caribou and B-17 were of course big heavy airplanes, flown by test pilots and still they didn’t make it. ‘I had a friend now passed away that took off in his loaded crop duster with the Aileron gust lock installed and he made it around and landed using rudder and only ground looped at the end doing almost no damage. Another Friend had his elevator push pull tube break at the helm joint, and he got it down using elevator trim as that’s all he had, he cleaned the gear out, but walked away. Seems we can handle one axis maybe?

Imron is a very good, but very old paint, there are better paints now, but Imron is very, very good, tough paint. Be very diligent about respiratory protection when spraying Imron though, I would want a hood with an external air supply myself. ‘Imron is what was used on all of the Military VIP aircraft in the 80’s and likely prior to then too. It may have been one of the first polyurethane enamel paints? ‘Imron is very difficult to remove, because it’s so tough.

I don’t understand what you mean? My supposition is the pilot or passenger broke the thing, not that it broke in normal flight, failure of the Horizontal and main wing spar nearly simultaneously seems to indicate a huge overload of the structure, either by a thunderstorm or pilot inputs or maybe both. ‘I just hope they were unconscious for the families sake

Yes, unless the wings departed very soon after

If you could pull hard enough to fail the aircraft and it seems he did, then logically the horizontal would go first as it has in other aircraft. an enormous amount of downward force can be generated at high speed with full up elevator. ‘If the wings didn’t fail at about the same time, then loss of the horizontal would result in a nose down pitching moment as of course the horizontal is pushing down while the wings lift up in normal flight. ‘But if the wings broke at about the same time as the Horizontal, then they could hold the nose up attitude similar as to how I believe Virgin Galactic handle re-entry. ‘Although it’s said eye witnesses are very often incorrect, what this one says sounds plausible?

What confuses me is how do you build the vertical velocity that the data seems to show in a nose up attitude in 2,000 ft or less, or any attitude except nose straight down. ‘I can see how wings up may contribute to the nose up attitude, the shuttle cock thing, but it seems in the first frame that they weren’t up? Lose the horizontal and the nose will drop, not come up? What is the max velocity of a dense object dropped from 2,000 ft? Not that a aircraft is dense, they aren’t at all. How do you get to over 200 kts from 2,000 ft without being nose straight down and wide open, especially with the gear hanging out in the wind? I’m not throwing any theories because frankly what appears to have happened, doesn’t seem possible.

If you can find an Odyssey SBS J-16 battery, it’s a PMA battery approved for Piper Super Cubs I believe. Its not approved for a Mooney, but if your rules are like the US, you have a better chance of a field approval with a PMA battery approved for other aircraft than a straight car battery, but I don’t know if you can find one. Assuming of course if field approvals are even a thing there

If you choose to store your aircraft for awhile. I’d put a battery minder on it,or disconnect the battery, if it’s a Concorde AGM the self discharge rate is very low so they can be stored for quite a while if disconnected, There may be other sources of dark current