"Successful gear-up landing"

[Mooneymite]

.

 

Last weekend I witnessed a C-177 RG make a gear-up landing due to a gear malfunction.  The pilot, the tower, the crash crew, everyone knew the gear up landing was coming.  The guy didn't get hurt, so I guess it could be called a "successful gear-up landing".  The pilot elected to land in the grass between runways despite the tower instructing him to land on the runway and that got a lot of the on-lookers arguing about the best way to land gear-up.

 

Sounds kind of funny since most of the time we try to avoid landing in that configuration, but what do you think?  How would you make an intentional gear-up landing in your Mooney?

 

1.  Land on grass, asphalt, concrete, or "other"?

2.  Flaps up to minimize damage to the flaps, flaps down to touch down slower, or use partial flaps?

3.  Engine running, or shut down on short final?

4.  Prop pulled back, or not?

5.  Land where there are Mooney repair facilities, land where there's a fire/rescue crew assuming both can't be had at the same airport?  Home airport regardless?

6.  If the gear will come down partially, but not lock down, will you land with the gear fully retracted, or partially down?

7.  Other considerations?

 

Ideas?  Experience?

 

 

Let's all hope we never have to perform this maneuver, but maybe it's something to think about.

[KSMooniac]

Gear up vs. partially down, unless you knew you had full travel down but were missing the Gear Safe light.  

Flaps up 

On pavement

Engine running, prop control forward

(1) home drome, (2) repair facilities on field in order of preference

 

I don't care about emergency services if the only issue is gear-up as it is not dangerous if done on pavement.  I'd be more worried about getting proper recovery services to avoid further damage.

[Hector]

Same as above, but I may cut mixture off just before making contact

[Marauder]

Landing on grass can tear things up more if catch clumps of dirt are hit. Power on. If the prop does stop, the odds of you being able to bump the starter to get it horizontal while doing your best for a soft landing would be tough.

[201er]

Great questions. I don't know well enough but just my opinion:

 

1.  Land on grass, asphalt, concrete, or "other"?

If it's grass like a grass runway that I know is meant to be landed on. Otherwise runway. No "surprise" grass.

 

2.  Flaps up to minimize damage to the flaps, flaps down to touch down slower, or use partial flaps?

If airport is very long (which I'd try for), I'd land no flaps to minimize damage. If airport is short and that's where I gotta be, then heck yeah flaps.

 

3.  Engine running, or shut down on short final?

Depends on how many hours on the engine? jk

 

I'm a glider pilot, I'd shut it once I had it made. Who can tell me at what airspeed the prop will stop? My hope would be sooner than touch down speed.

 

4.  Prop pulled back, or not?

Full forward, more resistance so better chance of stopage?

 

5.  Land where there are Mooney repair facilities, land where there's a fire/rescue crew assuming both can't be had at the same airport?  Home airport regardless?

Not home field. Most likely would prefer Mooney repair facility but length of runway and preferability for landing would come first. So around me, although I'd prefer airmods at trenton-robinsville to do the work, I'd fly over to Lancaster because they have a tower and a much longer runway also with a reputable Mooney Service Center.

 

6.  If the gear will come down partially, but not lock down, will you land with the gear fully retracted, or partially down?

Never really thought of it that way. Is that even possible in a Mooney? Maybe anything's possible but I think it's terribly unlikely? Either it's all down and locked or it's all down but not over center and not locked. I guess if you knew for sure it wasn't locked, better with it up. But given that you probably don't know, it's better to take the gamble that it is locked enough not to collapse. Short of things getting insanely broken, I don't think you could come in with a Mooney with one wheel up but not the others.

 

7.  Other considerations?

It's the insurance's problem at that point, so safety first. I've heard about (and would do this) switching to the right seat and cracking the door open with your elbow in case the fuselage buckles and you're caught inside with a fire. Thus my ideal plan would be to go to a big airport with a Mooney Service Center. Burn off all but the last 10 gallons (if possible) but definitely land in daytime (if burning off fuel would take me into night). Switch to right seat. Crack door open on final. On quarter mile final shut the engine using mixture. If I don't like where that's going, I can put it back in to fire. If I'm happy with the glide, fuel cutoff (does that help if mixture is already idle??). No flaps. Land as smooth as possible bearing in mind it has to be lower than usual. As soon as it stops, get the heck out and away in case of fire.

[M016576]

Here's a better question: has anyone ever heard of a mooney that couldn't get the gear down? I know sometimes the motor burns out or electrical problems might inop the gear motor... But the manual backup pump system seems to be pretty darned reliable. Anyone ever heard of a mooney that couldn't get the gear down?

Oh, to add to the above about a partial extension, I'd try to G up the aircraft and Yaw it a bit to get the air loads to "help me" fully extend the gear... Again, never heard of this happening though.

[jetdriven]

.

 

Last weekend I witnessed a C-182RG make a gear-up landing due to a gear malfunction.  The pilot, the tower, the crash crew, everyone knew the gear up landing was coming.  The guy didn't get hurt, so I guess it could be called a "successful gear-up landing".  The pilot elected to land in the grass between runways despite the tower instructing him to land on the runway and that got a lot of the on-lookers arguing about the best way to land gear-up.

 

Sounds kind of funny since most of the time we try to avoid landing in that configuration, but what do you think?  How would you make an intentional gear-up landing in your Mooney?

 

1.  Land on grass, asphalt, concrete, or "other"?

2.  Flaps up to minimize damage to the flaps, flaps down to touch down slower, or use partial flaps?

3.  Engine running, or shut down on short final?

4.  Prop pulled back, or not?

5.  Land where there are Mooney repair facilities, land where there's a fire/rescue crew assuming both can't be had at the same airport?  Home airport regardless?

6.  If the gear will come down partially, but not lock down, will you land with the gear fully retracted, or partially down?

7.  Other considerations?

 

Ideas?  Experience?

 

 

Let's all hope we never have to perform this maneuver, but maybe it's something to think about.

1. Grass runway would be preferable as it tears the airplane skin up less. However, the likelihood of a qualified repair station being there to fix it is less, so probably a wash.

2. Half or full flaps to lower touchdown speed.

3. Engine running to allow a go-around for a botched attempt. I see many pilots try to hold it off too long, and either scrape the rear fuselage or slam it down. Level and slightly fast seems best.

4. No difference.

6. If I'm suspecting gear is down but not locked, I'm taking the chance and landing with it down. If it is confirmed one main is not down, land gear up. If the nose is not locked, land with the mains down.

7. Your objective is to survive. If you don't lose directional control or stall, you are going to be alright.

[Ned Gravel]

I am still in the "those that will" column of that balance sheet. My wife and I have practiced emergency procedures on long cross country's and even she knows that, whatever the bad thing, the airplane belongs to the insurance company from that moment on.

Saving bits of the airplane is a laudable idea, but not as important as other things (people).

Just my .02.

Sent from my iPad

[Mooneymite]

Here's a better question: has anyone ever heard of a mooney that couldn't get the gear down? I know sometimes the motor burns out or electrical problems might inop the gear motor... But the manual backup pump system seems to be pretty darned reliable. Anyone ever heard of a mooney that couldn't get the gear down?.

.

When my airplane was about 5 years old it was owned by three doctors. Doctor #1 was flying with doctor #2 who was having trouble getting the landing picture. They "smote-the-earth" on one attempt, went around and retracted the gear. On the next attempt, the gear would only partially extend....something had been bent; no amount of "backup procedures" would extend it. They landed gear-up on pavement and except for the normal collateral items, the damage was minimal. It can happen, even in a Mooney.

As to grass vs pavement, I know conventional wisdom says pavement, but not all grass fields are created equal. We had an intentional gear-up here on our grass home-drome by a C-177 RG, the belly was barely scratched except for a couple of antennae.

.

[Super Dave]

I would avoid grass, I read a study (can't find it now) that found that gear-up landings on hard surfaces do less damage to the occupants AND the airplane.The hard surface is more "slippery" to the metal belly of the airplane than grass, resulting in a longer skid and more gentle dissipation of the energy. I witnessed a Cessna Cardinal make an intentional gear-up landing on grass, and it made a carrier landing look gentle. The airplane was bent up enough that the doors would not close once they got it back on its gear. After asking the occupants if they were OK, I looked inside the airplane to make sure fuel, mags, and master were off, and noticed that the throttle control had been bent down 90 degrees by the pilots hand during the rapid deceleration.

[38Blackfin]

Interesting conversation.

 

When I did my complex upgrade in the late 70's (!), I was taught, take the grass beside the runway, kill the motor, bump the prop around to horizontal, fly as a soft field landing, as slowly as controllable-

 

Randy

[bd32322]

The prop will not stop until very close to stall speed. So its probably impossible to do when about to touch down, too much concentration required. Or you can be really high over the airport, stop the prop and bring it in for a landing.

[yvesg]

How about engaging the starter? (After pulling the mixture control) It would probably enable holding the prop back a little and if it is not horizontal, activate it and stop where you want it.

Yves

[Mooneymite]

.

.

 

After watching two intentional gear-up landings, I think the single most important factor for a minimal damage gear-up-landing is to fly the airplane carefully through the touchdown.

 

In the two cases I've seen (both C-177 RG's coincidentally), there was a huge difference in the actual touch-down and subsequent damage.  In the recent one (between the runways), the guy apparently was thrown off by the loss of thrust when he cut the engine and, it appeared to me, he really "plopped it on" with no gear to absorb the shock.  I'm just guessing the aircraft will be totaled-out by the insurance company.  In the earlier case (on grass) the guy entered the flare with plenty of speed and held it off, held it off, held it off and "milked it on to the ground.  We had that plane back up on it's gear in less than 15 minutes and he taxied the plane to his hangar for repairs.

 

"Fly the plane".  Sound familiar?

 

 

.

[marks]

Had a fire in my io-360 Beech Sierra when mechanic fixing hot mag failed to reconnect fuel pressure gauge and thin spray caught fire when exhaust manifold was hot.  The most important factor is to land into the wind.  Reduce forward speed as much as possible with flaps.  Don't give a shit about the plane, save yourself.  I landed on a golf course gear up and the plane stopped faster that way.  Went through the very top of an oak tree.  Glad the gear was up.  Sometimes you don't have a lot of choice.  -  BTW, if the jack screw on the landing gear gets a bad burr in it, all the pulling in the world won't get your Mooney gear down.  Switched out the old big screw and replaced most landing gear at about 5,000 hrs on my J.  The Sierra was toast.