Fuel system set up

[NewMoon]

Just brought home a 2003 Ovation2 with 280hp. T/O FF is not set high enough and I want someone who is experienced to dial in the fuel set up.

Recommendations for the SE would be great. 

[mike_elliott]

not taking it to Fairhope like we talked about?

[NewMoon]

  On 7/20/2024 at 11:59 PM, mike_elliott said:

not taking it to Fairhope like we talked about?

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Can't get anyone there to take the request seriously.  Maybe I am not contacting the right department/person etc 

[Pinecone]

@jetdriven at KGAI

 

[kortopates]

https://continental.aero/continental-services/

Fairhope is a good choice but there is nothing complicated about setting up your fuel system; especially on an NA engine.
Often the real challenge is getting them to set the Max FF a full GPH or higher above the high TCM number for your engine; some tech’s are afraid to do that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[1980Mooney]

  On 7/21/2024 at 8:58 AM, NewMoon said:

Can't get anyone there to take the request seriously.  Maybe I am not contacting the right department/person etc 

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Any good A&P knowledgeable in Continental engines should be able to help you.

What is your T/O FF currently?

Has your engine been set per Continental SID-97 and M-16 already?

https://pceonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/SID97-3GFuelSysSetUp.pdf

http://softoutfit.com/static/refs/io550overhaul.pdf

 

[exM20K]

It’s a very simple to do, but it’s much easier with two people, one to run the airplane and the other to observe the readings. If there are any cirrus shops around you, they should be familiar with how to do this. For what it’s worth, the shop in Apalachicola has done mine very quickly and successfully.

-de

[dkkim73]

FWIW I've experienced some nuance in getting this done. 

E.g. one very experienced local A&P checked my setup (done at factory early this year), verified the low end unmetered fuel pressure toward the lower end of the setting. However I'd had episodes of the engine quitting on taxi, was advised by others to set it towards the high end (one Mooney A&P said slightly above the high end). It took some mild persuading of another local A&P to do that. So also for increasing the max FF empirically (recommended by Paul) targeting <= 1350F TIT on full power climb (in my plane, prob. different on the Ovation). This gives a higher nominal FF than TCM spec as was stated above. 

The first guy also set the idle mix a little richer, and the second intentionally maybe a bit leaner. 

So there does seem to be some body English, and recommended settings for the Mooney I am told may differ from the TCM specs. 

So it's probably worth making sure whatever is done is well-communicated in detail, esp. if you have the benefit of some Mooney gurus on call (I was fortunate to have Paul K. via Savvy and Brian Kendrick as advisors). 

HTH!

[dkkim73]

Here's pictures of the gauge box plumbed into the fuel lines: 

[Schllc]

Brian Kendrick. 
One very good reason is that he actually flies the plane while working through the setup, so when it’s done it is actually done!

[NewMoon]

  On 7/21/2024 at 5:44 PM, kortopates said:

https://continental.aero/continental-services/

Fairhope is a good choice but there is nothing complicated about setting up your fuel system; especially on an NA engine.
Often the real challenge is getting them to set the Max FF a full GPH or higher above the high TCM number for your engine; some tech’s are afraid to do that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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yep, already encountered that. book says at 2500rpm, FF 22.7. WAY to low.

looking to get 2550 rpm and 26.5 gph at sea level max power take off.

[NewMoon]

  On 7/21/2024 at 7:39 PM, dkkim73 said:

Here's pictures of the gauge box plumbed into the fuel lines: 

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that's the way to do it

[NewMoon]

  On 7/21/2024 at 7:37 PM, dkkim73 said:

FWIW I've experienced some nuance in getting this done. 

E.g. one very experienced local A&P checked my setup (done at factory early this year), verified the low end unmetered fuel pressure toward the lower end of the setting. However I'd had episodes of the engine quitting on taxi, was advised by others to set it towards the high end (one Mooney A&P said slightly above the high end). It took some mild persuading of another local A&P to do that. So also for increasing the max FF empirically (recommended by Paul) targeting <= 1350F TIT on full power climb (in my plane, prob. different on the Ovation). This gives a higher nominal FF than TCM spec as was stated above. 

The first guy also set the idle mix a little richer, and the second intentionally maybe a bit leaner. 

So there does seem to be some body English, and recommended settings for the Mooney I am told may differ from the TCM specs. 

So it's probably worth making sure whatever is done is well-communicated in detail, esp. if you have the benefit of some Mooney gurus on call (I was fortunate to have Paul K. via Savvy and Brian Kendrick as advisors). 

HTH!

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Yeh thx, I have Brian on retainer. Correct, definitely some art too it

[NewMoon]

  On 7/21/2024 at 8:03 PM, Schllc said:

Brian Kendrick. 
One very good reason is that he actually flies the plane while working through the setup, so when it’s done it is actually done!

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Yep, he has a benefit of flying it

[1980Mooney]

  On 7/21/2024 at 8:37 PM, NewMoon said:

yep, already encountered that. book says at 2500rpm, FF 22.7. WAY to low.

looking to get 2550 rpm and 26.5 gph at sea level max power take off.

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Why are you trying to set up your Continental IO-550 like a 300–310 hp variant running at 2700 RPM when you said you have a derated 280 hp model limited to 2500 RPM?  Did your plane get a screaming eagle 310 hp upgrade?  
 

If not, you’re asking mechanics to set it up ridiculously rich.  That may be why no one is listening to you.

Edited July 21, 2024 by 1980Mooney

[NewMoon]

  On 7/21/2024 at 9:54 PM, 1980Mooney said:

Why are you trying to set up your Continental IO-550 like a 300–310 hp variant running at 2700 RPM when you said you have a derated 280 hp model limited to 2500 RPM?  Did your plane get a screaming eagle 310 hp upgrade?  
 

If not, you’re asking mechanics to set it up ridiculously rich.  That may be why no one is listening to you.

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It's the 280hp, yeh most set it up from 25.0-27gph. Only way to keep CHT on #5 from getting dangerously hot. Like 430°. It's a common practice.  Book says 22.7gph just like book says you can run 460°CHT and TIT on turbo of 1690. Which we all know is ludicrous 

[1980Mooney]

  On 7/21/2024 at 10:45 PM, NewMoon said:

It's the 280hp, yeh most set it up from 25.0-27gph. Only way to keep CHT on #5 from getting dangerously hot. Like 430°. It's a common practice.  Book says 22.7gph just like book says you can run 460°CHT and TIT on turbo of 1690. Which we all know is ludicrous 

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Still seems on the high side.  @GeeBee 

with same plane/engine recommended 24-25 gph  for operational balance.  Also, as he highlighted  have you been able to determine if your onboard fuel flow meter is accurate?  

 

[NewMoon]

  On 7/21/2024 at 11:29 PM, 1980Mooney said:

Still seems on the high side.  @GeeBee 

with same plane/engine recommended 24-25 gph  for operational balance.  Also, as he highlighted  have you been able to determine if your onboard fuel flow meter is accurate?  

 

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No I have not been able to match up my on board fuel flow number versus what the test gauges show. that's my next step, it's an almost new GI-275 install displaying FF, doesn't mean it's perfect but at least it's new avionics and the install was done by Sarasota avionics. 

[201Mooniac]

  On 7/22/2024 at 1:40 AM, NewMoon said:

No I have not been able to match up my on board fuel flow number versus what the test gauges show. that's my next step, it's an almost new GI-275 install displaying FF, doesn't mean it's perfect but at least it's new avionics and the install was done by Sarasota avionics. 

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Have you checked it to make sure the fuel remaining matches up when you top off?  There is a calibration process for the fuel flow on the GI 275 where you can record fuel remaining and fuel used to top off on several flights and then compute the k-factor for the fuel flow transducer to fine tune the value.  It should be pretty accurate after that.