ETA switch cover

[PeytonM]

My Radio Master switch cover broke this afternoon. It’s an E-T-A from an 89J. I’ve seen sets of Klixons, but none of the E-T-As. I’d appreciate any help. Thank you in advance. 

[jaylw314]

Here you go

http://shpws.me/PdjG

$5.49.  There are prior threads about how to sand and smooth it.  There may be other options available now too

[PT20J]

Interesting, my Radio Master broke in exactly the same way. Wonder if it's something about that particular switch. Anyway, I made a replacement from the Shapeways part and it has worked fine ever since.

[carusoam]

There is something about that mold and part design, combined with the process and the material used...  most likely injection molded ABS...

To get the polymer to flow through those tight channel shapes... the molecular weight of the polymer has to be pretty small.  Smaller or broken molecule chains are not very strong... compared to whole and longer chains...

The hint of the aging process... for this polymer is it’s yellowing...  The S part of ABS is susceptible to age related yellowing... this is generally just a surface related issue... the strength issue is missing down deep.  The yellowing may be able to innitiate a crack that then easily propagates the rest of the way...

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic... or styrene expert...

Best regards,

-a-

[PeytonM]

Does the CAD file used to create the part that Shapeways sells belong to a MSer, or to Shapeways? Another MSer who has created a Klixon switch, finished and laser etched, might be persuaded to make a finished switch cover for the ETA switch, IF he can get his hands on the file. 

Anyone know who has the file?

[carusoam]

Invite for @testwest and @NotarPilot who may have the shapeways experience in this area...

https://mooneyspace.com/search/?&q=Shapeways&page=2&search_and_or=or&sortby=relevancy

Best regards,

-a-

[Mooney in Oz]

On 12/11/2018 at 3:55 PM, carusoam said:

Invite for @testwest and @NotarPilot who may have the shapeways experience in this area...

https://mooneyspace.com/search/?&q=Shapeways&page=2&search_and_or=or&sortby=relevancy

Best regards,

-a-

All of my switch covers that were previously Klixon are from Shapeways, advertised as a 20TC (v0.6) smooth front.  At best the switches are only just satisfactory for the following reasons:

Quality Control - Although the switch covers are advertised as having a smooth surface, this is not true and it shows.  The overall quality varied from unsatisfactory to only just satisfactory. The rough surface also made engraving difficult.

A few of the switch covers were too loose after fitment and had to be altered by adding tape for a secure fit.  These are advertised as a direct replacement of the Klixon covers.

Other issues:

Although Shapeways has an impressive website, all it is are 2 sales staff that operate in an office to answer only email inquires and take orders.  Switch cover manufacture is outsourced to more than 1 manufacturer, hence the difference in quality amongst the covers and overall lack of QC.

Shapeways are only contactable via email.  There is no phone contact.

Shapeways have a strict policy of sending the switches to the credit card holder who then has to have them engraved.  They will not send them to your choice of engraver or anyone else due to a previous credit card fraud issue.  I virtually pleaded with the sales guy to provide me with a contact number to speak to a manager and plead my case from Australia to have them send the switch covers to Aircraft Engravers (engravers.net) in Connecticut, but they would not budge.  I ended up paying for them to be freighted to me half way across the world and then without opening the package, I freighted them to Aircraft Engravers half way across the world again. This is probably an easier process in the USA, but you would still be subject to the same freighting to and fro.  I sent the switch covers to Aircraft Engravers as I could not find a suitable engraver here in Australia due to 3D printing being a new concept and did not want to risk ruin. I also read good posts about them here on the forum.

The only good experience I had was dealing with Wayne Cahoon, the owner of Aircraft Engravers.  Very reputable, professional and humble man in my opinion.  He contacted me and sent photos of the finished product, stating the difficulty he had engraving the switch covers and he would be happy to order some more in and do it all again. I told him to send what he had as I could not fault the engraving.  Wayne also offered to contact me if a much better product came along to see if I was interested in a replacement set and further offered to order them himself to avoid the freight fiasco.  I felt compelled to ring him and profusely thank him for his service.  You folks are very fortunate to have a guy of his calibre to call upon for professional aircraft engraving in the USA.  I wish businesses operated like that here.

Having said all of the above the switch covers still look better than what was replaced.

I know the OP is inquiring about ETA covers, but I just wanted to share my experience with Shapeways.

I wish I had waited for  @Ah-1 Cobra Pilot to release his switch covers. You live and learn.

    

[PT20J]

I think Shapeways is pretty honest stating that the switches are not smooth and need sanding. I found it took quite a bit of sanding, so I can see if you sent them directly to an engraver that there would be issues since I wouldn't expect the engraver to spend the time sanding that I put in. The plastic is pretty hard and getting a reasonably smooth surface probably took me fifteen minutes for one cover -- but I'm picky. Also, the material seems a bit porous. Rather than engraving the legends, I found a font in MS Word that was a reasonably close match and then I printed it out on a clear Avery label sheet on a laser printer. Then I cut out the legends and stuck them on and sprayed the switch cover with several coats of semi-gloss clear Krylon. When I put it on the switch, it didn't seem like the fit was quite perfect, but it works great so far. I've attached the legend file I made.

RADIO MASTER.docx

[jaylw314]

I just printed the labels out on a Brother labelmaker.  It's good enough for government work, and from the pilot's seat, it's really not noticeable.  I painted the switches with white gloss spray paint, but that didn't make too much of a difference since the labels cover most of the surface area anyway.  I'll try to get a pic next time I'm in the plane...

[Mooney in Oz]

7 hours ago, PT20J said:

I think Shapeways is pretty honest stating that the switches are not smooth and need sanding.

I could not find that statement on their website, although I may have missed it. The following is why I had them sent around the world for engraving:

In large and bold font Smooth Front as advertised:

[PeytonM]

I sent this to Mooney Parts this morning. 

Hello. My name is Peyton and I’m the proud owner of a 1989 M20J, My rocker switch cover for the Radio Master broke. I’ve looked at the usual sources to no avail. I have reached out to LASAR, salvage companies, and 3D printing companies. 

I understand that the E-T-A switch covers are no longer available through Mooney, but they used to be. If E-T-A is out of business, maybe the molds still exist. A blank switch cover would be ideal. Given the number of airplanes with these switches, and the number of switches per plane, I believe there is a significant need and market opportunity. (Or maybe it’s just me looking for a solution, other than replacing the entire switch a$$embly!)

 

I spoke to a company that can lasar-etch and print, but they need a smooth surface to work with. 3D printers do not generate that surface, and because of the unusual shape of the rocker switch cover, it does not lend itself to post-manufacturing finish-sanding. 

 

Thank you for looking into this for me. 

 

Best regards, happy holidays and Merry Christmas! 

 

[jaylw314]

5 hours ago, PeytonM said:

I sent this to Mooney Parts this morning. 

Hello. My name is Peyton and I’m the proud owner of a 1989 M20J, My rocker switch cover for the Radio Master broke. I’ve looked at the usual sources to no avail. I have reached out to LASAR, salvage companies, and 3D printing companies. 

I understand that the E-T-A switch covers are no longer available through Mooney, but they used to be. If E-T-A is out of business, maybe the molds still exist. A blank switch cover would be ideal. Given the number of airplanes with these switches, and the number of switches per plane, I believe there is a significant need and market opportunity. (Or maybe it’s just me looking for a solution, other than replacing the entire switch a$$embly!)

 

I spoke to a company that can lasar-etch and print, but they need a smooth surface to work with. 3D printers do not generate that surface, and because of the unusual shape of the rocker switch cover, it does not lend itself to post-manufacturing finish-sanding. 

 

Thank you for looking into this for me. 

 

Best regards, happy holidays and Merry Christmas! 

 

There are previous threads about printing labels, then covering the labels with a gloss clearcoat.  Unless somebody can come up with 3D printed designs with valleys for the fonts and etching/engraving companies can't work on the switches after manufacture, we won't get engraved switch covers for ETA switches.

IIRC, the original switches are not engraved either, the type is just silkscreened on the plastic.

[AH-1 Cobra Pilot]

If someone can send me a CAD file of the E-T-A switch cover, and if there is enough interest, I can/will make them.

[PeytonM]

I wish we could get ahold of the CAD file. I’ll give Shapeways a call. 

[jaylw314]

1 hour ago, PeytonM said:

I wish we could get ahold of the CAD file. I’ll give Shapeways a call. 

The uploader of the file only ever uploaded one design, so I'm guessing he's long since moved past the project, but I think you can send a message through the Shapeways website

[Mooney in Oz]

1 hour ago, PeytonM said:

I’ll give Shapeways a call. 

Good luck with that.