Propeller Eddy Current Inspection

[jetdriven]

For everyone's information, I did contact Hartzell about performing the inspection and got the following response:

 

"Seth,

 

If your propeller is within our published TBO time frame, we can perform the ECI on the aircraft at our Hartzell Airfield.  The ECI charge is $200.00 and we ask that you allocate about a hour and a half to have this completed.  If your propeller is outside of our published TBO, we would require the propeller to be overhauled. Please contact me if you have any further questions or would like to schedule this service."

 

 

Unfortunately, even though my prop is very low time since overhaul, it is outside of Hartzell's calendar time BTW overhauls. Too bad, I was really liking that $200 figure.

Very few props escape a prop shop without getting overhauled, regardless of condition. I had a shop tell me my 10 year old McCauley prop was unairworthy when I asked them to balance it. Funny thing, two recently overhauled props from that same prop shop were sitting on the floor of our shop, leaking from the blades. Both of those didn't live long, sorry, they're ground to limits and now they both needed new props. Ten hours out of the esteemed prop shop.

[Hawth200]

I'll have to read it again, but I'm pretty sure the AD states that it can be performed by a Certified Repair Station or an appropriately rated A&P.

 

 

Jetdriven - That is what I'm afraid of... I have heard similar horror stories. I'm an A&P myself and know that there is nothing wrong with my prop.

[Cody Stallings]

It has to be a Repairstation or a Level 2 NDI tech who is certified under NAS410 testing standards

[Mooneymite]

It lived its life on a 74 E Model Mooney. It had a year long stint on a PA-28R while the Mooney was down.

Had around 5200 Hr TT on it.

The hub was showing indications with the Eddy Current between the red marks. Up on disassembly the upper case half more less fell apart.

Sometimes I listin to my customers spout off about how the AD was a sales Gimmic for Hartzell to sell their "B" hubs. Then I show them that hub, an they realize it's real.

While I don't doubt there are bad hubs out there, the question devolves into....

How many/what percentage?

Of the bad hubs, how many of the failures were due to a prop strike which was not properly addressed?

Even the new "non AD" hub can show a crack after a prop strike.

In other words, is it really a design issue, or a service issue?

[Cody Stallings]

That's something we will never know the answer too. Not everyone is going to tell you about a prop strike.

I think the issue is a casting problem an lack of service issue. Some props hang off the from of the plane for 20yrs, an the owner keeps saying it only has 300hrs on it, no need to send it in.....lol. Well corrosion has no idea what a Calender or Hobbs meter is.

[Andy95W]

It lived its life on a 74 E Model Mooney. It had a year long stint on a PA-28R while the Mooney was down.

Had around 5200 Hr TT on it.

The hub was showing indications with the Eddy Current between the red marks. Up on disassembly the upper case half more less fell apart.

Sometimes I listin to my customers spout off about how the AD was a sales Gimmic for Hartzell to sell their "B" hubs. Then I show them that hub, an they realize it's real.

Must have been the year on that Arrow that did it in.

[Cody Stallings]

That's what I'm thinking. It would have lasted forever on the Mooney

[Andy95W]

Okay, so after looking back through this topic, and another one from a year or two ago, I have counted a total of two props that failed the eddy current inspection: the one that Cody mentioned above that flew for a year on a Piper Arrow and one that came off an aerobatic airplane.

Does anyone know of more? I already have faith in my prop (properly inspected), but I will have more if it really is that rare to fail.

Lastly, does anyone have any experience with the Top Prop/Scimitar propeller, specifically on an M20C? Better performance? Quieter? Smoother?

[triple8s]

I ran the old style Hartzell and dealt with the ECI for 5 yr and it had been a LONG TSOH so after a couple years I had it OH and I felt it was very worth the piece of mind. I ran the risk of having the prop opened up and finding corrosion or other defect but it got to the point where I was thinking about prop failures every time I was doing a preflight. I guess I had read too many reports of what happens when a prop fails. So all operators of propellor driven aircraft have two options, KNOW our equipment is right having done everything in our power to know beyond any doubt that we've done everything possible to make our aircraft safe or look at things while doing a preflight and hope the blades stay on. Every time you light the fire it is a risk, if every tiny detail is done it is still a risk, a calculated risk, flying is just that and nobody thinks it will happen to them but I personally couldn't continue to climb in and wonder. My prop looked brand new but hadn't been OH in many years and when I did bite the bullet and get it overhauled it was very inexpensive as much as a prop OH can be, but I had peace of mind that was worth every penny. Read the reports of what happens when "it" let's go, it'll definitely make you think. I'm not advocating buying a new prop, but if you're gonna run the old one, follow the guidelines on TSOH and do the ECI as recommended.

[Andy95W]

Just had eddy current inspection today by H&S Propeller out of Pontiac, Michigan. $200 and it passed.

Pretty knowledgeable guy, said he had seen two hubs fail, one while in for overhaul, not eddy current. I asked out of how many and he said "thousands?" And he wasn't sure what engines those 2 were on- could have been aerobatic or a 300 HP application.

I like my odds with sticking with the eddy current inspections every 100 hours, unless they jack the price up or Hartzell comes up with a prop that will give me 200 mph from my C model.

[Cody Stallings]

The Instructor that taught me to fly had a 62C N78912.

We took his E Hub propeller in, an fixed him up with the new style Hartzell. The only problem he had was the factory spinner that came with the new prop cracked. Hartzell shipped a composit spinner out an he never looked back.

He said it climbed faster an cruised faster, must be the blended airfoil on that blade design.

Then agin, he had speed mods which may have helped.

[nugs314]

Flew my F into Lancaster to Sensinich (sp) today thinking I would have lunch, get the sign off and leave. Failed the eddy current. No visible flaws but they didn't like what they saw. Looks like a replacement for me. Going to hurt!

[Andy95W]

Ouch. Sorry to hear that. Mind sharing how much the new prop will be? Do you get to keep your blades? Or are you going to spring for the Top Prop scimitar?

[Alan Fox]

I may be interested in the old prop , and pick it up in Lancaster.....PM me if interested..

[Cody Stallings]

Second opinion may save you $9k

[Andy95W]

Second opinion may save you $9k

+1

[nugs314]

Second opinion may save you $9k

They pulled the hub. Waiting to hear what they think. Was told it could be a little corrosion on one of the bolts. If that is the case I will spring for an overhaul for 2200. New hub quoted at 5700. I'll update the final verdict. Very disappointing though. Just wrapped up the annual and was excited to put some hours on her this month. Vacation ruined!

[bonal]

9 hours till 100 will be heading to Stockton CA for the dreaded EI the shop that does the inspection is not affiliated with Top Gun and charges 350. I think for my retirement years I will get certified purchase the tester and offer the service for a reasonable price. I know inspections are for the good but I sure do get antsy when they come up.

[nugs314]

9 hours till 100 will be heading to Stockton CA for the dreaded EI the shop that does the inspection is not affiliated with Top Gun and charges 350. I think for my retirement years I will get certified purchase the tester and offer the service for a reasonable price. I know inspections are for the good but I sure do get antsy when they come up.

I hear ya Bonal. I assumed it was going to be just a " formality" and I'd fly away 250 bucks poorer. Boy I was wrong. Good luck!

[kerry]

I just went through the same thing but it was blades that didn't pass.  I just got the top prop in Florida for $7800.  Let me know if you want the name of the shop.  I also know a guy who has a new black mac for 5k but I hear its not a good match for the mooney.

[Ron McBride]

The prop shop at San Louis Obispo  KSLO charges about a $100.00.  Go get lunch at the same time.

 

Ron

[Andy95W]

I just went through the same thing but it was blades that didn't pass.  I just got the top prop in Florida for $7800.  Let me know if you want the name of the shop.  I also know a guy who has a new black mac for 5k but I hear its not a good match for the mooney.

How is the performance with the Top Prop? Climb? Speed? Worth the extra money, in your opinion?

[bonal]

Just a bit longer flight to KSLO 250 dollars less is the prop shop the name of the business? how is the service. i am definetly interresed in checking them out.  N9154V have you used them before.

[bonal]

Would that be KSBP. I'm trying to look them up any body have knowledge on The Prop Shop

[kerry]

How is the performance with the Top Prop? Climb? Speed? Worth the extra money, in your opinion?

I didn't really find any performance gains over my old Hartzell AD prop.  Seems like I have a longer take off roll with the top prop.  It is quieter.  Especially on the ground while taxiing.  I was shopping around for props for awhile and finding non AD props OH'd for $6500.  I figured it was best to pay $7800 for a new prop.  The prop is pretty with it's composite spinner.  I wouldn't upgrade if your old prop works fine.  I would have been just as happy with my old prop if it could of been OH'd.