Correct Method to Raise Manual Gear

[rockydoc]

Since I purchased the old bird, i put 150+ hours on her and still have not mastered smoothe and consistent raising of the manual landing gears with the JBar.   I rotate at 60-65, establish climb, get out of ground effect and then try to raise them.  Occassionally, the JBar movement to the up and locked position is smooth.    I don't know if its me or if its the rigging.  So, two questions:  1)  what is the correct procedure to raise the gear with the JBar; 2) How can I determine if the rigging is alright without taking it to a MSC (I live in Mexico).  Thanks.

[kerry]

Right after I rotate at 80mph I lift my gear.  I never had any problems raising my gear.  I once forgot to raise my gear and I  leveled out  indicating 120 and I was surprised how easy it was to retracted at level flight.  I've heard by putting down pressure on your elevator makes it easier to raise.  

[Shadrach]

Doc,

The lower the airspeed, the easier it is to raise the gear. If you find it difficult at slow speeds, you may have worn bungees. Have them inspected. Is the difficulty progressive or linear?

[flyingvee201]

Try kerry's technique of down pressure (shallow your climb for a few seconds) while you bring the J-bar down to the floor and locked.

This works for me. All I need is my thumb and index finger to push it down and lock it.

If this doesnt work then you may need to have your landing gear checked.

 

-Vic

[rockydoc]

Doc,

The lower the airspeed, the easier it is to raise the gear. If you find it difficult at slow speeds, you may have warn bungees. Have them inspected. Is the dificulty progressive or linear?

Its not progressive.  

[rockydoc]

Based on these few responses, it appears that i must have a rigging or bungee problem or some other mechanical issue.  I consistently try everything that each of you have mentioned.  It has never been possible to raise easily with a thumb and index finger.  i have to grip it with my whole hand and put my body weight into it while putting down pressure on the elevator and loosing a little altitude keeping my airspeed around 80.  

[Shadrach]

Time to have bungees and preloads checked.

[rockydoc]

Time to have bungees and preloads checked.

Great suggestion.  That's what I'll do.  Unfortunately, Arapahoe Aero at APA in Denver is the shop I'll go to and Scott won't do anything on a flat rate--ALWAYS $100/hr regardless of what it is.  

[N201MKTurbo]

I flew an M20F for 19 years, so I'm a little familiar with the J Bar.

 

If you unlatch the bar from the up lock on the floor and just let go of it. The bar should stay at about a 45 degree angle. This is where the bungee spring and the weight of the landing gear are equal. If it does not stay there, then there is something wrong.

 

While putting the gear up or down, you will be assisted by the spring or gravity through the first half of the stroke. This will give inertia to the landing gear. The trick is to use that inertia to carry the gear the rest of the way through the stroke. It is important to have a continuous motion the whole way. If you slow down or stop part way through the stroke it takes a lot of force to complete the stroke. It is like dead lifting the whole landing gear assembly.

 

I honestly don't remember how I did the gear. I did it so often it was automatic and I didn't think about it.

 

I agree when done right it takes very little effort.

[rockydoc]

I flew an M20F for 19 years, so I'm a little familiar with the J Bar.

 

If you unlatch the bar from the up lock on the floor and just let go of it. The bar should stay at about a 45 degree angle. This is where the bungee spring and the weight of the landing gear are equal. If it does not stay there, then there is something wrong.

 

While putting the gear up or down, you will be assisted by the spring or gravity through the first half of the stroke. This will give inertia to the landing gear. The trick is to use that inertia to carry the gear the rest of the way through the stroke. It is important to have a continuous motion the whole way. If you slow down or stop part way through the stroke it takes a lot of force to complete the stroke. It is like dead lifting the whole landing gear assembly.

 

I honestly don't remember how I did the gear. I did it so often it was automatic and I didn't think about it.

 

I agree when done right it takes very little effort.

Thanks for the detailed explanation.  When my gear is up and I unlatch the bar from the floor and release it, it does indeed stabalize at the 45 degree point you mention.  So, according to what you said, that means nothing is wrong with the bungee cords, eh?  How does that relate to "preloads?"

[chrisk]

You might try tapping the brakes before you raise the landing gear.  It will remove the gyroscopic effect from the wheels spinning.

[rockydoc]

You might try tapping the brakes before you raise the landing gear.  It will remove the gyroscopic effect from the wheels spinning.

Good point!

[BigTex]

Check out Don Maxwell's website. He as an article on the proper technique to raise the gear.

[pinerunner]

Great post.

 

I get by with a little nose dip halfway. I wouldn't have called it easy but not too bad. I've always ignored the brake tapping advice I've seen in the past and it never occurred to me that momentum might matter. I think I just got upgraded. Thanks to all.

 

Dave

[N201MKTurbo]

Thanks for the detailed explanation.  When my gear is up and I unlatch the bar from the floor and release it, it does indeed stabalize at the 45 degree point you mention.  So, according to what you said, that means nothing is wrong with the bungee cords, eh?  How does that relate to "preloads?"

 

There are no bungee cords. There is a big spring hooked to each gear leg to counterbalance the weight of the gear. There is not much to go wrong with them unless one broke in which case the handle would be at some odd angle. You can see the springs attached to semicircular brackets on the top of the gear legs. They go thru an oblong hole towards the wing tips.

 

The preloads will not affect operating the J bar. The only time they come into play is just as you are going into the down lock. If it was rigged so the preload springs were fully compressed you would need to bend things to latch it, which is unlikely.

[rbridges]

Based on these few responses, it appears that i must have a rigging or bungee problem or some other mechanical issue.  I consistently try everything that each of you have mentioned.  It has never been possible to raise easily with a thumb and index finger.  i have to grip it with my whole hand and put my body weight into it while putting down pressure on the elevator and loosing a little altitude keeping my airspeed around 80.  

 

 

I raise my gear within a second or two of rotating.  I consider myself a fairly strong guy, but I can't raise the gear if I wait too long.  In that case, I have to nose over to reduce pressure on the bar.  I have the inner fairings on my main gear.

[carusoam]

There is a good speed to raise it. And a good speed to lower it. Slower is better on the way up. Faster makes it better on the way down...

Don't over do it.

Always step on the brake before raising, because the wheels stop by touching the wheel well (depending on what's left in there for rubber parts?)

That's my '65C experience. The bungee springs were probably original equipment.

The system is very A/S sensitive...

Best regards,

-a-

[rockydoc]

This thread is a perfect example of why I value this forum so much.  Being able to get information from so many experienced Mooney pilots...so many points of view.  I bought my first Mooney on June 6 this year.  Thanks to this group, I was able to transition into the airplane in a safe manner with full confidence that I could safely operate the machine.  I had to do a "go around" with only four cross country hours because I porpised.  I was able to execute it safely without complications.  You guys are THE best.  i don't think I could feel safe flying my Mooney without the support that you guys give me.  Thank you so much.

[rockydoc]

This thread is a perfect example of why I value this forum so much.  Being able to get information from so many experienced Mooney pilots...so many points of view.  I bought my first Mooney on June 6 this year.  Thanks to this group, I was able to transition into the airplane in a safe manner with full confidence that I could safely operate the machine.  I had to do a "go around" with only four cross country hours because I porpised.  I was able to execute it safely without complications.  You guys are THE best.  i don't think I could feel safe flying my Mooney without the support that you guys give me.  Thank you so much.