Schllc

I know, it was a tongue in cheek comment. I think the title of the thread is what piqued my comment. Why would one have to ask the question of why you would want to “linger in icing”? Icing conditions are unpredictable and vary wildly. It may be a small risk, and I may have won the lottery with my encounter, but I don’t want to get lucky again. I also don’t fly for a living, and don’t have to be anywhere badly enough to plan to go into those conditions. I’m quite familiar with the tks system on my plane and have had to use it inadvertently a few times. I didn’t buy a fiki equipped plane to change how I plan, I bought it for inadvertent ice. I bought a FIKI twin, and I doubt I’ll plan to fly that into those conditions either. It’s just a personal decision, I don’t think those who do it are foolish or irresponsible, they just have a different risk tolerance.

I agree with you, it does limit the use of my plane. I don’t judge or disparage people who utilize the system. It’s obviously proven and capable. I just personally don’t wish to experience that again, and since all of my flying is discretionary, I’ll wait for favorable conditions, or buy a twin, which is what I did…. I doubt I will take that into known ice either!! I’m a big ole chicken!!

Anyone who has had a real encounter with icing, has no desire to relive the experience. Even asking the question seemed somewhat crazy to me, but then I realized not everyone has had the experience. Those who have not are probably pretty sure, as I was, that there was some embellishment, and/or exaggeration. My experience took all of about 3-5 seconds to go from completely clean to accumulating 3”+ on the wings, enough to completely block the windshield, and cut my rate of climb by two thirds. I saw rain drops on the windshield, looked at the wings, looked back at the windshield which was completely covered in ice, looked back at the wings to see the 3”+. It took me longer to type this than it did to actually happen. I can honestly say it was the scariest experience of my life, and the thought of “lingering” in conditions that could reproduce that experience is just unfathomable. I would NEVER intentionally take a single engine piston, with or without FIKI knowingly into icing conditions. But to each their own….

I’m heavily biased for a turbo so I say the k, bravo or an acclaim. It’s kind of like growing up eating sirloin and calling that steak. Then one day someone serves you a waygu ribeye. Do you need to eat that to eat a steak? Nope. But, every time you eat one you will think about it… Turbos provide options you just don’t have in a NA plane. Do you “need” it? Probably not, but once you have it you won’t enjoy life without it.. maybe it’s better to not try the waygu.

@LANCECASPER said it perfectly… Your “rote” isn’t appropriate anymore. Assume you are flying a new plane. it will come with practice.

What kinda numbers do you see in a typical profile? speeds, fuel burn, altitude etc? @MtnMann

I’ve landed on a 35’ runway before, it isn’t as intimidating as you would imagine. your perspective changes as you approach anyway so your just dialed in further out,or your going around because you know it. You also, without thinking about it get real slow instead of all those little hedges. Again, I think it’s the perspective and sight picture.

I don’t know how to answer the first questions. Discussing the conditions, and options for decisions is different. I like reading accident reports because I prefer to learn the easy way. I try my best not to second guess a pilots decisions simply because one never really knows how they will react until they have to…. Monday morning quarterbacking an accident with injury or death is pretty crappy.

The effects of the pandemic have distorted the GA market like we have never seen, and the change in the cost of gas is a pretty minor part of ownership cost. Anyone who flies commercial has a nightmare story to tell. I myself will not fly commercial at all unless it’s a non stop to my destination. I personally know at least eight people who have gotten involved in GA, either in ownership or just jet cards or partnering simply because of the hassle and unreliability of commercial travel. Remember, it doesn’t have to be a lot of people for it to affect our market. In 2018 there were only 173,000 piston planes registered in the US. To put that into perspective 373,000 Toyota Camrys were imported/made into the US in 2021. I don’t think GA will crash with the same timing as normal recessions, simply because there aren’t that many airplanes and there are enough people willing to pay for the convenience. That’s my two cents anyway… Time will tell and I am glad I am debt free, keeping my powder dry and waiting for the opportunity to start buying again. “Bad times make strong men, strong men make good times, good times make weak men, and weak men make bad times…” It’s the natural cycle…

To block users on a mobile device click on the “hamburger” icon at the top right of the mooneyspsce page, then go to “account”, then to “ignored users” and add the name to block. thank goodness… some folks are just toxic.

I have been the service center several times, and the entire experience is everything that you could wish for. The people are competent, efficient, courteous and great to deal with. Mike is one of the nicest, most knowledgeable and decent people I’ve ever met I haven’t heard anything different from anyone who has actually been there for service. The comments with no first hand experience are neither helpful or necessary. Can someone remind me how to block someone using an iPad?

Was the decision to leave gear up based on trying to stop quicker than if you were rolling on the gear? For what it’s worth, I am in no way questioning your decision, I hope to never have to make those decisions, and think if you walk away without a scratch you absolutely made all the right choices.

After flying into an uncontrolled field I would rank myself pretty highly compared to others. But flying into Dulles, or Atlanta maybe I’m not so cocky. I think the ranking has to happen on the inner 80% of the bell curve. Those in the bottom 10 really give pilots a bad rap, and those at the upper ten we should aspire to emulate. Regardless of where I rank myself, I have never felt that I am “good enough”. Always room for improvement…

Given the many accidents over the years due to running out of fuel, intentionally starving an engine of fuel to check the veracity of a gauge seems to be, to me, an extreme method. I don’t plan any trip that close, but to each their own… I haven’t found any gauges dependable enough to give me comfort to within a gallon, but the totalizers have been accurate. All the ones I’ve used, have been well within that range. Most being down to within 2/10ths, which could easily be a rounding error from refueling.

I’ve done 6 hours, that was enough. It wasn’t the time in the seat for me, it’s the noise. My ears rang for weeks after that trip, the noise takes more out of me than anything else.

Why is that? I like the spacing and control the bigger ones provide, and can’t stand the shenanigans that happens at uncontrolled fields. I try to stick to anything with a tower, and the big airports are usually well organized and safer in my experience. I seldom fly without filing or flight following.

Some movies don’t age well, it was very good when it came out, less so when i watched it over again a few weeks ago. but the actors, music and tech are either your era or not so I get why you didn’t like the first one. I have heard nothing but good about the new one, and I appreciate cruise’s ability to shut up and act.

I love that retro color scheme and was always fond of the stinger tail. I’ve never seen the rudder trim tab(if that’s what it is). Why would they not put it parallel to air flow? I would love to find one of these in the project plane price range, I didn’t know only twelve were out there either Good luck!! What a pretty bird!

Difficult to pick one in that succinct of an answer. Florida Everglades, X01 is 2400 with zero displaced threshold and water on both ends. I have landed on shorter with much longer displaced thresholds. That is as short as I would like to try outside of an emergency.

Mine is HOT. I can usually only pull it out to the first detent. Anything else gets way too hot very quickly.

I only have experience with the big continental mooney's but LOP always yielded temperatures much lower. Average LOP would be closer to 320degF ROP would be at those temps averaging closer to the 365deg. Are these temps typical for the four cylinder LOP?

sums it up for me too

Heat management……

Yes, this describes the reason one avoids “peak”. Hence lean of peak and rich of peak. There are a number of documented deleterious effects of running at peak, there are also numerous quantifiable issues with running improperly rop. I cannot find what those affect are from lop. Everyone just says it can be bad, it can damage an engine, etc etc. What are they? What damage occurs? What are the specific things that happen? I mean if over leaning an engine damages an engine why do we pull the mixture to kill the engine? I know this is over simplifying to an extent, but every time I ask, the answer is just that you aren’t supposed to… I mean once again it’s just about heat management and lop’s biggest side effect is less heat….

What physically occurs in these zones that causes damage is what I meant. For example, excessive rop operations can fry a turbo if you aren’t careful, it also fouls plugs and exhaust valves. What kinds of things happen in lop? I am really curious about this, you guys have so many more years of experience with these engines and aviation than I do, and I am very eager to benefit from that experience. I have always approached the lop vs rop argument from a simple physics perspective. Engine care is about heat management, period. I think genesis of the conventional wisdom/proponents about/of rop was a combination of ignorance (not stupidity), and inability to really monitor what your engine was doing. An analog gauges that shows the temperature of the hottest probe doesn’t tell you if three probes have failed…. Most people that own planes are people of means, not wealth perhaps but means…But being wealthy doesn’t make you smart, or conscientious. I have flown with people in brand new planes that had complete unawareness of what they were doing to their engine. One idled at 1600rpm all the way from startup to the hold short and when I asked him why, he said “this engine loves fuel”.. uhhhhh ok My point is, I haven’t really found anything that tells me how running lop can damage an engine, and I really don’t understand the debate. I realize it can be done safely, but at least in my plane gaining 5-8 knots for an additional 4 gallons per hour, only to have the belly white from burnt fuel in the exhaust, fouled plugs, and 30-50deg hotter cylinder head temps isn’t worth it. Reliability and longevity are the only thing I care about with regard to engine management. I would like to know what I’m risking lop, out of the box, in the box… What happens out of the box? Please don’t take this as an argument, it’s a sincere question. I don’t understand, other than fuel exhaustion, how you can hurt the engine. I don’t care if I convince anyone of anything, just want to take care of my plane the best way I can