Flew first Mooney today!

[benpilot]

Flew in a Mooney 231 Rocket today that a guy wants 140k for. Wow it was fast! Climbed to 4000' and cruise at almost 200kts.

 

BUT the owner tried to get me to buy a 252 instead since the Rocket is a pig and sucks down fuel( 25-30 gph! ) and the 252 is almost as fast and uses much less fuel.

 

Only thing is controls felt heavy maybe something to get used to?

[AndyFromCB]

The heavy controls on a mooney work both ways. Kind of a pain but stable like a rock.

[KSMooniac]

How did you like the way you fit?

[benpilot]

too cramped for my taste

[driller]

Think of it as a sports car, and if "fast and efficient" is your goal, you will not find anything better.  Come to think of it, I was the front seat of a Malibu Mirage the other day and the Mooney has more headroom and your knees aren't in your chest.  I'm 6' and the Malibu was very uncomfortable for me. 

[benpilot]

Agree except the Rocket sucks fuel and is not efficient uses 25-30 gph but it is VERY fast. Now the 201J and 252 are fuel efficient and if I bought a Mooney these would be great way to go. The climb rate and speed is amazing though in the Rocket! I think if I was flying coast to coast and international a lot, the Rocket would be well worth the fuel burn and cost.

[AndyFromCB]

Skynewbie,

 

A Bo is actually an inch and half less wide than a Mooney plus quite frankly you'll be spending considerably less time in your Mooney. A Mooney is like an Aston Martin aka perfection achieved other than the left blinker quit working at 4200 miles and the seat controls that came from a Ford F150 kind of funny right next to italian leather seats that cost more alone than a F150. Basically, you have to ask your self, are you a pilot or a driver? A clutch and steering wheel on the Aston feel heavy too. But point it and it will go. A Bo is more akin to a Benz. Everything is perfect but how boring.

 

Before there was a Cirrus, there was a Bo. A Bo is for drivers, a Mooney is for pilots. The Corvalis feels like Mooney's child.

[AndyFromCB]

Agree except the Rocket sucks fuel and is not efficient uses 25-30 gph but it is VERY fast. Now the 201J and 252 are fuel efficient and if I bought a Mooney these would be great way to go. The climb rate and speed is amazing though in the Rocket! I think if I was flying coast to coast and international a lot, the Rocket would be well worth the fuel burn and cost.

 

Rocket does not suck fuel any more than any other aircraft. Slow it down to 200knots at 18,000 and I bet you'll can get the fuel flow around 16gph LOP. 

[benpilot]

Well the owner wants too much for the rocket so figure it was good to experience Mooney speed at the least. I have a BMW M3 which is very fast, comfortable, drives on rails but not heavy in the handling. Not sure why the yoke controls are so stiff and heavy in the Mooney compared the the Cessna, Bonanza, and Piper that I have flown. I've heard that the 252 Mooney is lighter in controls so might be better way to go.

[Marauder]

Well the owner wants too much for the rocket so figure it was good to experience Mooney speed at the least. I have a BMW M3 which is very fast, comfortable, drives on rails but not heavy in the handling. Not sure why the yoke controls are so stiff and heavy in the Mooney compared the the Cessna, Bonanza, and Piper that I have flown. I've heard that the 252 Mooney is lighter in controls so might be better way to go.

Mooneys use push pull rods to move the control surfaces. C&P (maybe use cables. When you are in heavy turbulence, you'll appreciate the difference.

[jackn]

When my 252 was converted to an Encore, bigger counter weights were added to the control surfaces. This was for a 10 hp increase. I don't believe Rocket Engineering did this. I always wondered why. This may be why the controls feel heavy.

[davidsguerra]

in  max cruise rop the Rocket burns 21 gph. it burns 25-30 gph on climb but you are climbing 1600-2000 fpm. at that rate it takes less than 15 mins to get to ceiling. if you want to run lop and save gas you can do that too.

 

at 140k a Rocket is a bargain. Acclaim speed for a fraction of the price. even a new Cirrus turbo is slower than my 83 Rocket. the interior may be nicer in an acclaim or cirrus but you can always upgrade that with all the money you saved from not buying the cirrus. and of course you will looker cooler in a Mooney than a Cirrus.

 

if you need FIKI get a 252 Rocket.

[benpilot]

Cool well I see a 252 Rocket for 110k which is dirt cheap for serious performance. Maybe I need to fly another Mooney to give it a chance? I liked the speed and stability in turbulence compared to the Cessna. BUT the heavy controls unless you are in straight in level cruise long distance flight take getting used to. Maybe I need to do forearm and wrist exercises? It was cramped compared to the Bonanza I flew. Maybe it is the cockpit layout of Mooney? Felt like my instructor was ON top of me like 1 inch distance between our seats. I felt more room in the Bonanza and Socata that I flew and sat in.

[OR75]

WOT

[OR75]

i would not want to drive a porsche with cadillac controls or vice versa.

both are fine cars

[Marauder]

Cool well I see a 252 Rocket for 110k which is dirt cheap for serious performance. Maybe I need to fly another Mooney to give it a chance? I liked the speed and stability in turbulence compared to the Cessna. BUT the heavy controls unless you are in straight in level cruise long distance flight take getting used to. Maybe I need to do forearm and wrist exercises? It was cramped compared to the Bonanza I flew. Maybe it is the cockpit layout of Mooney? Felt like my instructor was ON top of me like 1 inch distance between our seats. I felt more room in the Bonanza and Socata that I flew and sat in.

I think you will be surprised at the inner dimensions of a Mooney compared to other airplanes. They are not as small as you feel -- if that makes sense.

[benpilot]

 

So how come a Mooney feels a lot more cramped than a Bonanza or Cessna? 

[Marauder]

 

 

So how come a Mooney feels a lot more cramped than a Bonanza or Cessna? 

 

 

I think it is the height that gives the illusion. The seats in a Piper/Cessna & Bonanza sit higher. I will try to dig up the dimensions, but a Mooney's cabin width is 43.5" while a Bonanza's cabin width is 42.0". 

[Marauder]

Found them:

 

Aircraft                            Cabin Width    Cabin Height
Mooney 201                          43.5"              44.5"
Beechcraft V35 Bonanza       42.0"              50.0"
Cessna 182                           42.0"              48.0" 
Piper Arrow                           41.0"              45.0"

[Hank]

The Mooney feels tighter because the panel is closer to you, and the legroom is mostly in front of the seat, sports car style vs. SUV seating position.

The controls feel heavy because there are pushrods to the control surfaces, not braided cables and pulleys. The time will come when you will be glad to have the pushrods (or you will wish you did).

Listen to the Rocket & Missile owners here about actual performance, engine management and fuel flow--they aren't trying to sell anything.

[rob]

Well the owner wants too much for the rocket so figure it was good to experience Mooney speed at the least. I have a BMW M3 which is very fast, comfortable, drives on rails but not heavy in the handling. Not sure why the yoke controls are so stiff and heavy in the Mooney compared the the Cessna, Bonanza, and Piper that I have flown. I've heard that the 252 Mooney is lighter in controls so might be better way to go.

If you think the M3 isn't heavy in the handling then you've not driven a Cayman, Lotus, McLaren or even a Miata or Gt86. Relatively speaking your M3 is a fat pig and feels it. The comparison is similar between a Bo and a Mooney. You're probably a Bonanza guy given your choice of a sports sedan.

[benpilot]

 

I've driven Lotus, Porsches (Cayman/911 Turbos) and Ferraris. You are right, the BMW M3 is heavier compared to these cars but much more comfy and luxurious. Yes, I trade pure performance for better balance of comfort and some good performance. I like the Mooney design and speed but not sure I can deal with sitting in such a cramped cabin for more than short flights. So yeah, Bonanza more roomy to me. Nothing against the Mooney in fact the climb performance and speed as well as felt very stable in turbulence make for a great aircraft just not the right fit for me. Sorry. Then again, I am not crazy about Cessnas and Pipers either. I am more of a Beechcraft Commander type guy that values comfy plane with decent performance. Maybe I can fly another Mooney model other than Rocket since I heard the controls are lighter in the 231 and 201J than the Rocket.

[driller]

Cool well I see a 252 Rocket for 110k which is dirt cheap for serious performance. Maybe I need to fly another Mooney to give it a chance? I liked the speed and stability in turbulence compared to the Cessna. BUT the heavy controls unless you are in straight in level cruise long distance flight take getting used to. Maybe I need to do forearm and wrist exercises? It was cramped compared to the Bonanza I flew. Maybe it is the cockpit layout of Mooney? Felt like my instructor was ON top of me like 1 inch distance between our seats. I felt more room in the Bonanza and Socata that I flew and sat in.

 

 

Your instructor took you up in the Rocket or am I reading this right?  I would certainly do some homework before you make a big decision on purchasing a high performance aircraft. 

[benpilot]

 

No, the owner/CFI selling his Mooney Rocket took me for a demo flight. Nice guy, Geoff Lee with 50 years flight experience. Bought his Mooney from factor years ago and was kind to fly me in it as long as I paid for fuel. 

[davidsguerra]

Its very comfortable at at 17500 with no wx or turbelence going 240 kts.  since neither mooneys nor bonanzas have toilets the difference in comfort is minimal  IMO. with the mooney you get to the next toilet faster which we all know is the limiting factor in cross country flying.