1990 M20J Advice

[WSPilot]

I, like many, have been lurking for a over year learning about Mooneys prior to purchase.  I have M20F and M20J time from many many years ago and am finally in a life position to purchase to an airplane and a Mooney is what fits the bill.  Even though I have spent my career flying, this will be my first aircraft purchase and am trying to avoid expensive mistakes I have watched others make.  Here is a new listing that interest me and would like to solicit any advice from veteran Mooney owners:

https://indyairsales.com/current-inventory/aircraft/1990 Mooney M20J - N1077U/

My concerns:  Very recent gear up landing, however this resulted in a freshly OH engine and prop which is a benefit I believe.  It also spent its early life at FlightSafety, my guess as a complex trainer meaning it has seen significant student abuse.  A life in FL also could mean some corrosion?

It is in the price point that I am comfortable, I know you buy the airframe only once and this one is slightly checkered.  Do any of you Mooney experts see something I should be leery of?  I am aware in this sellers market I will need to act quickly as I anticipate it will sell within days.  

 

[philip_g]

Some staining of some sort around the accessoaneks on the bottom of the right wing. Leaky tanks? Can't tell. 

[Niko182]

I think its a bit high priced for what it is. gear ups arent an issue, but a gear up 300 to 500 hours and 5 years ago and a gear up 7 hours ago are 2 very different things. That leaves no time to figure out the issues associated with the gear up. The max takeoff weight is also only 2740. If its possible for the 2900 pound gw via paperwork thats a good thing. If not, 871 pounds of useful load isnt great. The market right now is crazy, but i dont think this J warrents this premium price. For reference my tiedown neighbor just bought a 1984 J with a runout engine, a mediocre panel and ok paint, good tanks, and ok onterior for 87k. Leaves him 53k to do what he wants on the plane, but he gets to decide what he wants, and gets to see it get done right.

 

Edit: im not saying these guys didn't do it right, but when you get to see it done it adds a bit of comfort to the aircraft youre flying.

Edited December 6, 2021 by Niko182

[LANCECASPER]

1 hour ago, WSPilot said:

I, like many, have been lurking for a over year learning about Mooneys prior to purchase.  I have M20F and M20J time from many many years ago and am finally in a life position to purchase to an airplane and a Mooney is what fits the bill.  Even though I have spent my career flying, this will be my first aircraft purchase and am trying to avoid expensive mistakes I have watched others make.  Here is a new listing that interest me and would like to solicit any advice from veteran Mooney owners:

https://indyairsales.com/current-inventory/aircraft/1990 Mooney M20J - N1077U/

My concerns:  Very recent gear up landing, however this resulted in a freshly OH engine and prop which is a benefit I believe.  It also spent its early life at FlightSafety, my guess as a complex trainer meaning it has seen significant student abuse.  A life in FL also could mean some corrosion?

It is in the price point that I am comfortable, I know you buy the airframe only once and this one is slightly checkered.  Do any of you Mooney experts see something I should be leery of?  I am aware in this sellers market I will need to act quickly as I anticipate it will sell within days.  

 

It's certainly worth it to look at the logs on this one. An overhaul at a good shop with new cylinders is definitely worth something.

[1980Mooney]

I read the logs.  I have not looked at the Mooney Value Guide here on Mooneyspace because the plane is worth what someone else will pay for it regardless of what the Value Guide says.

If you look at the hour accumulations and the "100 hour" inspections and search the past owners in AviationDB you will see that the plane has been used most of its life for flight school training.  That is not necessarily a bad thing.  A flown plane is better than one that sits.  It got a lot of inspection and the total hours are not too high.

• There was some corrosion repair and the plane was repainted in 1997
• Engine overhauled first time October 1997
• Tanks were resealed in 2001
• Repainted again and interior/upholstery in 2005
• Left main shock discs replaced in 2010
• Repair/reseal right tank in late 2015
• Nose gear shock discs replaced in late 2015
• Right main shock discs replaced in 2017
• The gearup was in January 2020 Kathryn's Report: Mooney M20J, N1077U: Incident occurred January 21, 2020 at Pompano Beach Airpark (KPMP), Broward County, Florida (kathrynsreport.com)
• The engine was shipped for overhaul to Pinnacle and looks like they got it overhauled and back July 2020
• Also noted that the exhaust was sent out for some overhaul work in July 2020
• The prop is new
• Repairs and painting completed November 11, 2021.

So it took over 21 months to get the plane repaired.  It could be both insurance and supply chain issues.  A gearup in a Mooney can be repaired as good as new.  I have a friend that did it twice in the same J  - and he is still flying it nearly 20 years later. 

Now I noticed that they used the existing engine shock mounts when reinstalling the overhauled engine - that is really cheap.( after all the engine was out )  Also changing shock discs on the landing gear on one side of the plane is cheap too - should do both sides.

Regarding the stain on the wing - either Mooney's currently leak fuel or they will eventually leak.  It is just a matter of time and money - the curse of the wet wing.

The plane is just new enough to be eligible for the GW increase to 2,900 lbs which is a plus. M20J-Gross-Weight-Increase-SL92-1-1.pdf (mooney.com)

The gear up doesn't scare me but you need a good look at it during the prebuy inspection.  Also a good test of rigging - control surfaces and landing gear.

Edited December 6, 2021 by 1980Mooney

[RoundTwo]

This may not be the “Right Plane”, but it would work out to be a great “Plane for Right Now”. This market is nuts and if you don’t buy it, someone else will and probably close to asking price.

R2

[ArtVandelay]

For reference my tiedown neighbor just bought a 1984 J with a runout engine, a mediocre panel and ok paint, good tanks, and ok onterior for 87k. Leaves him 53k to do what he wants on the plane, but he gets to decide what he wants, and gets to see it get done right.

Let’s do the math:
$87k price paid
$30k engine overhaul (or more if you have a bad cam, case,etc)
$4k prop overhaul
$17k paint job
$10k interior redo
$75k new panel: GFC, G3X, GPS, PS Audio…
For a total of $223k….

No problem in aviation can’t be solve if you have enough money.

[Niko182]

4 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

Let’s do the math:
$87k price paid
$30k engine overhaul (or more if you have a bad cam, case,etc)
$4k prop overhaul
$17k paint job
$10k interior redo
$75k new panel: GFC, G3X, GPS, PS Audio…
For a total of $223k….

No problem in aviation can’t be solve if you have enough money.

I guess thats applicable but it would only be fair to apply the panel price to the plane above. Other than the lynx, everything in the panel is over 20 years old just like in the plane I was comparing it to. If you want that same panel its still going to cost you 75k. Puts the total for this J at 214,500.

[WSPilot]

Thank you for all the thoughts and responses, it is much appreciated.    

[philip_g]

I find it kind of interesting that this thread was mostly positive about the plane

 while this plane is more or less the same panel just with some damage history and the vibe is a bit less positive. Both posters have more or less the same goals. 

Edited December 7, 2021 by philip_g