jetdriven

Also, superheated turbine wheels glow white hot and actually "blade stretch" when overheated causing blades to rub the housing. Quote: carusoam "What would cause the turbine wheel to expand too much?" - aviatoreb "expanding" on Don S.' response.... Consider the following regarding expansion of parts due to heating... Think of it as related rates of expansion. Turbo housing expanding slower than the turbine. They both expand, but not at the same rate. All materials will expand when heated. They do this at different rates in/in/deg or mm/mm/deg. The turbine is made of a different material than the housing. Thus rates of expansion will be different. The turbine will also be hotter (overall) than the housing. The housing has some cooling, the turbine is very surrounded in the exhaust gases. The clearances are as tight as can be to begin with. Not much room left for differential expansion. Since it is practically impossible to measure the temperature of turbine itself, the next best thing is define a TIT not to exceed, and stay on the safe side of that. Cylinders and pistons have a similar relationship with similar limitations. Just some thoughts from atop my engineer's soap box... Best regards, -a-

Well the bashing was nonstop and I guess Jimmy got tired of hearing it. We bought ours there at All American Aircraft and it we need another one thats my first stop.

Those things are rare. I think the best upgrade wthout spending too mcuh money is a MX-170 Michel radio. Slide in replacement.

Can someone post the drawings for the fire extinguisher bracket? I'd like to fab one but it must be based on approved data.

Is there a website that shows fuel prices for Canada?

Does TAS depend on density altitude or just straight altitude?

Everyone knows LOP is bad. Fuel it cheaper than engines. It also burns valves.

The Six burns 14-16 GPH. A 201 burns 8-10. The back seat in a 201 is the same as any 4 cylinder single. Roomy enough. I am 5'10' and 210 Lbs its fine for me. The front seats get a little tighter but still doable, especially considering you sit in them 20% less time than that Arrow or Cardinal when you are going somehwere. now, four 180 LB adults, or pushing 240+ a Mooney starts to not work out. No problem. There's always the Six and its 90$/hr fuel bill.

eBay or eflightmanuals.com. You want Manual 104 (service and manitenance, date 7-1980) and the Manual 205 (Illustrated Parts Catalog, 6-1977). We bought our parts catalog here: http://www.eflightmanuals.com/detail/itemList.asp?cID=3083

Cris, I wasn't implying your Eagle was worth 80K, rather the average Mooney costs near that. Your original post stated you paid 2,000$ for escrow/title services. In a later post you said that also included an 852$ prebuy inspection. The former sounds really expensive. The latter, more reasonable. 900$ for title, escrow and insurance sounds like a good deal if you are risk-averse. We chose to skip some of that cost and trust what looked like a straight transaction. Instead, we spent some of that "saved" title insurance money for inspecting the aircraft in more detail. Some title insurance policies only pay the bank, which is a total rip off, why doesn't the bank pay for their own insurance? At the 50-80K plane level, there are a lot of additional expenses that banks and insurance companies want to pile on and turn the whole thing into like buying a house. Its way too complicated. I could leave the Ford dealer with a 65,000$ 3/4 ton diesel in an hour. But an airplane somehow becomes a fee circus. sorry for the misunderstanding. Quote: Cris Quote: Cris I used the escrow/title services available thru AOPA simply because they are a known entity to me. I do not recall the exact cost but it was probably around $2000 including title ins. Of course AOPA makes money so the services are available elsewhere for less but I did not have the experience to determine who might be better. However the recommended company did the title search. provided title insurance, & guaranteed that the paperwork would be filed correctly......... Jetdriven: For the record I just checked and the cost of the "title" insurance (which is what the insurance company calls it) for my Eagle was $652. This is for an A/C valuation that is based on more than double your $80K estimate for my A/C. Frankly I'll buy several low time Eagles at that price. Just tell me where. So as I said I did not recall the exact figures but now that I have looked it up the closing fees were $500 which included the "title" search, paperwork, registration, escrow & whatever else was required. The $850 differance between the $2000 & the 1152 was for the PPI. The $500 escrow fee plus the $652 title insurance fee = $1152. This insurance may well be worthless if never needed just like the cost of the A/C liability insurance but that is my choice. I belive it is a prudent decision-for me. Now here are the facts: An aircraft title insurance policy can protect an owner or lender against actual losses that divest them of their interest in the aircraft. The best title search or legal opinion can only report problems of record at the FAA, while a title insurance policy goes beyond that and insures risks that are never reported in the public records, and that the most thorough title report or legal opinion could never discover. Federal & State tax liens, some mechanic's liens, improper deregistrations, unenforceable bills of sale or security agreements, are just a few examples of undetectable risks that our covered by a title insurance policy. In the case of a covered claim, title insurance will pay the attorney's fees to defend your title, and if there is a total loss of title, will pay the value of the plane, the remainder of the loan, or the amount of the policy, depending on the circumstances. The cost of title insurance is typically based on the A/C valuation.

They didnt file bankruptcy per se, but they did form a new entity and "foreclose upon themselves" thereby shedding the debt, a de facto bankruptcy. But if they cannot make money building 3800$ ailerons or 4,100$ elevators perhaps they should just burn it down.

There is no "title" per se for aircraft records. The FAA is the final repository for all aircraft ownership items. Lienholders record their security interest with the FAA just as you do when you send in the bill of sale. The broker for ours had his title saearch from a month previous and we ran our own also. At some point you have to acept some risk and not spend an extra 2,000$ on a 80K aircraft on most likely, worthless insurance.

The only Mooney that can cruise at 165 knots on 9 GPH is Testwest. And his is a pretty seriously modified 201. Ours, 9 GPH gets you 150 knots. Quote: allsmiles This is available but not to us because it is cost prohibitive. We HAVE the next best thing. We have a bullet proof engine married to an airframe that has been evolved for raw speed. Who else can cruise at 165 knots at 9 gph ?? Know any other airplane that can claim this ? VOR/RNAV and Loran are/were bullet proof but they have been replaced by new technology. There is nothing affordble to us that can replace our engines. Not yet anyway.

I can explain most of your 50 LB weight gain. First of all, the licensed empty weight of your plane from the factory is just an estimate. They weigh an airplane every few serial numbers and take the average of that. Now 30 years of removing and reinstalling equipment, based on the weights on the data plates. Anything less than one pound does not change W+B data. My own plane had an engine monitor installed with no change. Yeah right. So you could install 30 items weighing .9 lbs each, and no change to weight and balance data. Its legal. Also, consider that a mechanic replaced our alternator with a Plane Power and didnt update the W+B record for the -2.8 LB change. Amazing what 500$ labor buys these days. So 30 years of repairs, drilling rivets and replacing, doublers for cowl flap mounting, reinforcing the boot cowl with new fiberglass. Stripped screws replaced with oversize, or stainless. Cut zip ties, added wiring. New interior. Carpet. Perhaps some soundproofing. Leather covered yokes. Its called service weight pickup. Thats the reason commercial aircraft must be reweighed every 36 months. Now the factory paint job is very thin. Sometime along the way, the airplane was strippped, some body work done, and a nice new paint job with 2 coats of primer, a wash primer, then 2 coats of paint. Mauybe 3 or more, and a coat of clear. You reweigh the plane, and !!!! WTF? This cant be right! I'd say most planes weigh 40 lbs more than what they are licensed at. Roll it onto the scales and find out. EAA does this sometimes at fly-ins. You don't have to update the W+B record. You may not like what you find, however. I hope this helps your understanding. Quote: mooniac58 I added a bunch of weight actually and I am not 100% sure this is not just the scales being off at the shop (or the last scales I was weighed on being off). According to my shop I gained 50lbs, which makes no sense to me. The vaccuum system was removed, the old ADF antanae was removed, the Aspen screens are very light and replaced 6 steam gauges, the panel is essentially the same. We added the Stec-55 autopilot and its servos, we added the TAS-600 Avidyne traffic system and the XM Weather module in the tail, but it would be hard to imagine all the weight came from just that. At some point down the road I plan on doing another weigh in to see if I get a different result. Basically my aircraft now weights about 100lbs more than it did when it left the factory. That seems hard to believe with a panel that clean. Plus I have upgrade to the Plane Power lightweight alternator and Skytech lightweight starter. Go figure!

The VOR check can be placed in the aircraft permanent files. I am not aware of any requirement for it to be carried in the aircraft. I used an app called FLT Crew iLog. I wouldnt recomment it. too many steps. Is there a program to just use an excel spreadsheet? I could log the flights on that, and also record trends.

keep surfing ebay those things come and go

OT rant

Quote: allsmiles Why did you pay the mechanic for a prebuy in advance of the actual inspection? I didn't think this was SOP (regardless of the broker, I would not pay a mechanic before he actually did the work).

And don't rely on a prebuy, even a MSC or Maxwell prebuy. Do the prebuy yourself, spend 3 hours looking the aircraft and logs / records over. Re-read them. We did this. Go fly it. Then i stopped by during the annual to take away the oil filter and a sample. I looked inside the belly on jacks. The prebuy was to verify what we already knew. No surprises. Some people paying 5k for a prebuy 3 and 4 times is really something. What you see is what you get unless its Bondo on a prop and private sellers do this more than brokers.

For all you guys suffesting that you use AOPA escrow service, we looked into it. For a 5K deposit the escrow fee was over 1,000$. Id rather risk losing my deposit than pay some bank 20%. The same AOPA aircraft financing is just another pig with lipstick courstey of Bank of America. 16% APR for an aircraft. My Bank of America credit card is cheaper.

Thats odd we bought our 201 for ten grand under market from them in January. Less than you guys are paying for F models. We even test flew it on a Sunday and they delivered it 250 NM for free. All American Aircraft. Quote: allsmiles Didn't want to put a name on them but such "self proclaimed Mooney specialists" are indeed used car/plane salesmen. AAA is probably the worst! They manipulate and pump up the market and thus inflate their asking prices. Buyers and sellers don't need these middlemen. They are self serving and are not there for neither the buyer nor the seller. The seller realizes less for their airplane and the buyer pays more than they should! They only confuse the process which in the end costs more for all involved

we lean ours for around 2 GPH on taxi, or as lean as it will run smoothly. Io-360 Lycoming. Cant hurt it.

the front of a bonanza doesnt taper down so much, although the Bo might be narrower, it feels quite larger. there is definately more room for your legs. Mooney is like a kayak in that regard. And with a throwover yoke and lay down pedals on the right side, there is tons of room for the passenger.

An instrument shop can overhaul that for you, and calibrate it as well. I imagine there are a lot of Mooney pilots on here that say how they can get XX GPH on 25" of MP, but their plane is a little slow also.. Between that and the tach instead of running 25"-2500 they are 23"-2400 RPM.

Cris it sounds like bad piloting, not bad airplane. The same thing happens in piper warriors. Its called fuel starvation. I have plenty of hours in Bonanzas too, and in our 201 the fuel selector is between your knees and requires a stick to turn. At least in a Bonanza you can reach it sitting upright. Ragarding the famous "rollcage" consider an Aeronca Champ is built the same way, only it has fabric covering the tubes. Bonanza's are semi-monocoque construction. I do know semi-monocoque structures absorb tremendous amounts of energy deforming. Look at all those Bonanza off field landings and the entire bottom of the aircraft is destroyed, but this allows for a survivable deceleration. In short, i dont think there is a difference either way. Now a V-tail cruises very close to its maximum speed and I have busted redline in those things a lot more than I intended. The tail cam come off if you overspeed the aircraft and maneuver it aggrssively. It also fishtails which annoys passengers. Straight tail Bonanza's have no structural concerns. You can pull the wings off at 9 G's so the Mooney wing is stronger, but how much do you need anyways. I thnk more doctors crash Bonanzas because more doctors fly Bonanzas. Face it, Mooney's were only marketed as a premium handcrafted luxury airplane from the late 90's on up. Their moniker was always speed and efficiency IE the 252 was called the "personal airliner". The Bonanza has always been known as the finest GA airplane you can buy. And the price to match. Go fly both. Quote: Cris Jrob Here is a real life Dr. story for you to consider. My fiancee' is an MD who was married to another MD that unfortunately lost his life in a Bonanza. Needless to say she does not really want to fly with me even though I am a CFII ATP etc. I read the accident report & he simply mismanaged the fuel which is a more more complicated system than is in the Mooney. He was a low time pilot who recently transitioned to the Bonanza & stalled the A/C short of the runway in the trees while in a engine out situation. This was due to fuel starvation at altitude. It was VFR, no mechanical problems & plenty of fuel in one of the tanks. While I do not know if this might have happened in a Mooney I do know that the Mooney is a much stronger A/C with a steel roll cage and one piece wing. Tails & wings don't come off in a Mooney. As an instructor I find the Mooney forces a pilot to maintain airspeed control. The A/C is not "hot". It simply won't land unless you have it right! Other A/C allow you to be, shall I say somewhat sloppy in your flying & IMHO I think it leads to a more casual consideration of flight. Flying in and of itself is not inherently dangerous but it is terrible unforgiving. Bonanza's do have a rep with Dr's. Mooney's apparently do not. Maybe there is a reason. Just my thoughts. Fly safe.