Jeff_S

Here’s something to consider about the WAAS upgrade for the G1000/S-TEC folks (of which I am one). Not only do you get WAAS, but you get an updated version of the G1000 software which gives you some nice features that I use all the time. For example, when flying a descent or ascent to a target altitude, the MFD will display the location where you should hit that altitude...very handy when trying to get above or below an airspace while flying VFR, or when descending toward and airport. Do I hear “cross at or below x altitude”? Also, the FltPlan view allows you to switch between Leg and Cumulative view so you can see how far to your end destination...very handy when announcing your distance to an airport when flying practice approaches in VFR. And perhaps most important, this version of software allows capture of the flight log data on the SD card in the upper slot of the MFD, which you can then import into Savvy Analysis or CloudAhoy to help with engine monitoring, flight skill tracking, etc. I’m sure there a few other things that it does as well. Oh, and one more thing: the official documentation may still say that this setup is not approved for coupled LPV approaches...but that doesn’t mean it won’t do them!

Welcome J-D. Mooneys make a good commuting tool, but what IrishPilot said is all true. No GA airplane is going to be your 100% solution. Also, be realistic about your flying capabilities early on. Any Mooney is going to be a lot to handle for someone just coming out of a trainer. Retractable gear, constant speed prop, and demanding landing characteristics are all new things to learn and master. I can tell you that when I got my PPL, I started by owning a Piper Warrior first, which I used to get my instrument ticket and to learn to fly around in the system. Then I upgraded to a J model to learn how to fly a higher performance aircraft, and then finally ended up in an Ovation which meets all my needs. Each progression helped me grow my skills and experience. That was me, and I know some others here have said they bought an early C or D model and did their training in that. It’s all going to depend on how much time you can put into gaining proficiency. So just be cognizant of this as you explore your options. It’s amazing good fun to look at airplanes for sale...but really think about your mission and your own progression as you do this. Good luck!

Thanks Anthony! What was your trick? I tried to rotate it in every direction on my computer, but it kept getting uploaded sideways. I'm sure it will run even better now that you have it straight and level!

I'll play, as I'm fascinated by mechanical time pieces and have no desire to buy a smartwatch. My watch collection is fairly utilitarian: The Timex is el-cheapo but I use when sporting of any kind (water, golf etc.) because it's reliable and cheap to replace. The Tag Heuer was my first splurge, and I love it but it does require a battery so I need to get that fixed. The Hamilton is nothing too fancy, but it was the nicest thing my first wife ever bought me so I keep it (although I don't wear it for obvious reasons!). And the Breitling is my everyday watch, part of that AOPA promotion that happened a few years ago. I love it but can't really see the E6B numbers anymore even with glasses! But my real pride and joy is a bit too big for the cockpit: Not sure why I can't get this to rotate correctly, but this is a 1903 Frank Herschede grandfather clock that has been in my family for three generations now. I have this tuned so that it maintains time within 4 seconds of my cellphone clock every week. I think the engineering in that level of mechanical precision is pretty cool!

It was disappointing to learn that the latest system upgrade won't be available for those of us still saddled with the S-TEC 55x. But not too disappointing. Even with the NXi (or NXii, or whatever they're calling it these days) the basic operation of the G1000 seems like it's still pretty much the same. Frankly, I would guess that most pilots use less than 10% of all the gewgaws that keep getting put into the upgrades. I am starting to feel that way about ForeFlight; while I love the application and use it for every flight, most of the new features they are putting in are either a) targeting professional/corporate pilots, or b) nice to have but not really essential to my regular needs. There's a word for it in my industry: feature creep. So at this point, as long as the system I have still operates and is able to be repaired when needed, I'm happy.* There are other ways to upgrade the airplane overall that I think would be more beneficial to my personal flying and safety. I should really explore GAMI injectors to see if I can bring my LOP spread down a bit. Electronic ignition might be of value. Maybe the lighter-weight Acclaim prop, or that new cowling that Mooney is now promising. Those all sound like a more meaningful investment in the plane to me. *Corollary: if the time comes this isn't true, then I will be unhappy! At that point, I designate the plane as experimental, rip out the whole panel and build my own!

It sounds like you are doing a version of the Deakin technique, assuming you are priming the engine with the mixture at cut-off and running the pump for a minute or so. That is a pretty good technique. What I have found to work is to go full throttle, fuel pump just a skosh to see the fuel pressure go up, throttle back out and then turn five times, then crank. I can tell by the way the engine is cranking whether it is flooded or needs more fuel, so depending on the situation I may turn the pump back on or just let it go until it fires. The trick is to get enough cool fuel in the line to reduce any vapor barriers but not too much to throw off the fuel/air ratio. That's why opening the throttle more than on a regular start can help compensate if you've got too much fuel in the lines. It is an art, for sure. The pure Deakin technique claims to have it down to a science, but I've tried it and found that it isn't foolproof either. My technique works for my engine pretty well, with little risk of backfiring flooding. But each engine does seem to do it's own thing. Just remember your basics: fuel/air/spark. You have to find the combination that will work reliably for your engine.

As mentioned in at least one other post, your best approach is to subscribe to CloudAhoy and religiously log every flight. If you can't get flight log data (e.g. from a G1000) into it, even the self-created GPS data will help. This will let you track your tendencies and build your comfort zone. I just analyzed my last 10 flights, and the stopping distance ranged from 850' to over 1800'...obviously it can differ based on winds, how much runway you have left, landing long to get to a far taxiway for egress, etc. But what I noticed is that invariably I am touching down about 1000' past the numbers, which is a normal thing on a 3-degree glide path and given the O's tendency to want to keep flying. So when you are trying to get into a tight field, practice even better speed control, and change your aim point to try to touch down earlier (taking into account all other safety requirements of the environment of course). I'd say given my current proficiency, I wouldn't try to land at anything less than 2,500', but the Ovation will do shorter with practice.

Pretty difficult to say without seeing pictures. The panel has a few components in it that you could build around, but from the description it sounds like a jumble of old and new. Discerning buyers who are used to seeing more flat panel displays - including aftermarket rebuilds - would want to do that here as well. Engine has some history with a TOH, so I'd want to understand that better. I can tell you that I sold my 1990 J in 2010, which had a somewhat modern panel GNS 480, MF-20, JPI, etc.) and the interior was new leather. Hours were about the same including a TOH. I got around $135K for that as I recall, but the market was down at that time. Still, due to age of airframe and what sounds like a fair amount of interior work needed on this to spruce it up, I'm guessing you'd be lucky to get something in the $90's. But I say this without doing any comparison on TAP or Controller. Good luck!

I wish I had taken a picture of how I loaded my Ovation a couple of years ago during an Operation Air Drop mission after hurricane Michael. The baggage compartment, backseat and passenger seat were fully loaded with 300+ lbs of goods. While I had rigorously calculated the W/B to be correct, I hadn't factored on just the physical obstruction of so much material. With goods in the passenger seat, I would have had a dickens of a time with an emergency egress. I would pay more attention to that next time...it was pretty funny when I landed and the outside line person had to help open the door and off-load my goods.

Nobody answered the OP's original question. I don't have my W/B with me, but from memory I think the A/C adds about 80lbs to the total weight of the aircraft. It doesn't change any of the loading characteristics, e.g. it doesn't reduce the allowable load in the baggage compartment. Of course, there is no hat rack so THAT 10 lbs of useful weight is gone! My subjective opinion is that this adds to the nose-up attitude of the airplane on the ground due to the extra weight in the tail, furthering the notion that the Ovation is the twin of the P51! (Fraternal twin, of course.)

Welcome to the O-Club!

I know nothing about what Rocket Engineering did to test and certify their configuration. But I know that even though we generally prefer to keep CHTs below 400 for cylinder longevity, the actual Continental redline is much higher than that, I think 450. If your engine is running how you like it in all other respects, I would suggest this is probably normal for your setup. You already know what you need to do to get lower temps. As you say, you were at a lower altitude than the book spec, and what about outside temperature? Was it standard, high, low? That would have an impact as well. And of course, your actual fuel flow may be different than what the meter is showing, so unless you know it's calibrated perfectly that would be a factor. It's probably been quite some time since that airplane rolled off the "factory" floor (I admit, I don't know the process for how those Rocket planes are first configured) so time has assuredly moved your plane away from true book specifications, as it has with all our planes.

I have personally had very good experiences with Joey and his team, so you can't go wrong there. Never had any work done at Maxwell's but they sure have a great reputation. So as others have said, it will come down to whichever is more convenient for you. If you live in Kentucky, then Cole is certainly a lot closer and a reasonable drive (or a reasonable ask for a buddy to ferry you from your home airport!). Maxwell would likely require you to fly commercial unless you can wait around in east Texas for however long it takes. If those are the two you've narrowed it down to, seems like you're in a win-win scenario.

Hi Hank!

@OHAEDO To the OP, beautiful plane and one that most folks here would lust after (myself included). I'm curious, what is your use-case for the plane and how did you justify the expense? Now, before anyone gives me the "you can't justify owning ANY plane" speech I'll say "yeah, I know." But at some point we all look at the tradeoffs between the plane we have now and the one we want next, and have to decide if/when to make the leap. So that's what I'm really curious about. In particular, the jump to a turbine seems like an order of magnitude increase in operation and maintenance costs over even a gorgeous Acclaim Ultra, so unless you just have "F--- You" money in your pocket there has to be SOME type of analysis. (But congrats to anyone who does have F-- You money!) So Omar, I'm curious what sort of analysis you did on this and what you came up with. Thanks!

Flyboy, the primary difference between the traditional O3 and the Ovation Ultra is going to be your body work and the G1000 NXi panel. So for an extra $500K you get a pilot's side door, and a fancy-schmancy new Mid-Continent backup instrument (which admittedly is more nicely placed in between the two primary screens instead of over to the side). Plus the added functionality of the G1000 NXi. And redesigned rocker switches on the panel. Some folks actually aren't fond of the new rocker switches...I personally think they look like they would break more easily, but I haven't flown one, and I'll trust the designers that they are sturdy. They will fly the same, climb the same, cruise the same, land the same. It's still an Ovation. Just with that new-car smell and easier ingress/egress for the pilot.

Mike, the problem came back a few weeks ago so I spoke with Brian Kendrick about all the possibilities. He suggested much the same procedure, although just doing this by running the VS at +10 and -10 for the full travel in each direction. After listening to all the symptoms, he felt there was probably just some gunk that built up on the brushes of the pitch servo due to lack of exercise and the humid/salty climate. So I've done this and so far things seem to be working better!

I don't think it changes my original assertion at the top of this thread, but for clarity I will correct my writing and state that the Epic was certified with the S-TEC 2100, not the 3100. Still, I'm guessing that the fundamental software is the same, and they can make it work with a G1000 NXi so there don't seem to be any technical barriers. It's all about economics, as we've seen before. Sigh...

Not to restart a bad memory or anything, but I just noticed that the Epic E1000 turbo prop was certified with a Garmin G1000NXi and an S-TEC 3100 A/P. Hmm...so for the right incentive, Garmin will still play the game! And both the PFDs on the model shown in Flying magazine show the lack of GFC700 control buttons that are familiar to many of us in our older G1000 planes. So they are still making those screens. Is it about time to hit up Genesys again and see if they want to renew certification for the Mooney?

Okay, enquiring minds want to know...what are Charlie weights? I've not heard that term before.

Yes, that really was blacktop, just with grass growing on top of it. I will try to straighten the doors if I can, but I don't know if there is structural damage like cracks, etc. We'll know once we dive in. And the Airport Manager came over to help us get the plane out of the hole and he has already acknowledged that this is airport property and their responsibility...that just means the insurance companies will battle it out!

Such a beautiful morning flight, dodging a few showers, getting an aerial rainbow, practicing engine-out landings. And then my right main gear finds a sinkhole while backing into the hangar. Ah, Florida! You can see that the plane was being held up by the strength of the gear doors, and luckily it didn't sink in further because the hole actually extends much wider than the pics show. Extensive damage to both gear doors, but hopefully not the gear itself. We were able to jack it up and put a piece of plywood under the wheel to roll it out, so we didn't put any shear forces on the gear itself. I sure hope the factory has some extra Ovation gear doors lying around!

I saw this on BeechTalk today, but Walt Atkinson passed away from cancer on July 21. While he got a lot more coverage by name in the Beech community, his Advanced Pilot Seminars influenced how we all fly our airplanes and manage our engines. I wonder if he will fly his angel's wings LOP!

Well, they are essentially the same plane, with one key difference...those extra 30 hp on takeoff are a huge improvement, as Anthony notes above. By allowing RPMs all the way to 2700, instead of capping at 2500, you get much better takeoff and climb performance. Even once at altitude, if you bump up the RPM to do a cruise climb you will see significant improvement. Also, for those with built-in A/C like me, the O3 allows continuous use of the A/C even on takeoff, where I believe the O1-O2s require the A/C to be off for takeoff. And Niko, you can upgrade your Eagle to 310hp as well, if you haven't already...which with the lower gross weight of the Eagle makes it truly LEAP off the runway. Of course, once in cruise, you can back the RPMs off to regular cruise levels, at which point you still get all the fuel efficiency and speed for which the Ovation gets...well, Ovations!

So, is the factory ever going to reopen, or what? Any time I see a thread has gotten to over 10 pages I know it will no longer be about the original topic!