A64Pilot

I agree, but if you can meet all three, then you should in my opinion.

I’m going to guess that English isn’t his primary language, and the parts manual may call it that, or maybe Google translate did what it does and inverted the words.

I have a tailbeacon installed on a J, I bought it with it installed, it had been installed by an MSC. When I got the airplane, I noticed it was loose, a quick investigation showed that they had used the screws supplied by Uavionix and they are smaller than what the Mooney requires, So I removed the unit and the installer had buggered up the plate that mounts to the rudder, the screws were broken and Uavionix supplies the good butt splices, the ones that heat shrink and seal with glue, but the installer hadn’t heat shrunk them, so everything they could screw up, they did. ‘So I called Uavionix and asked to buy the mounting plate, and was told it was a Certified part and they couldn’t sell it separately, So I thought UH-OH, but the next words out of his mouth was send it in and we will warranty it, and they did, even paid to ship it back Fedex. So MSC zero, I mean how can you screw up two screws and two butt splices? Avionix 10 for supporting something that was not their fault. The $2,000 tail light was going to fall out, hopefully not on someone’s head. ‘I don’t like the wing tip one as how could you do wingtip strobes?

If anyone is interested, pic is of the old and new relay 12V. The new one appears to be about 1/8” longer but I don’t see that being an issue.

I just had a thought. ‘I believe at some point Mooney went from a 14V electrical system to a 28V? Is your newer airplane that uses the Kissling relays a 28V airplane? Mine is a 14V. I ask as the 26.72.03 part number you gave appears to be a 24/28V relay

The Kissling relay is a better relay, I doubt anyone could make a logical argument that it isn’t, and price isn’t an issue not really. However what’s the basis of approval for putting them on my older aircraft? The fact that they are used on newer aircraft won’t get you there unfortunately. If the relay ends up being the problem, my golf cart relay lasted 41 years, almost positive what make it quit is corrosion of the contacts as they are a 100 amp relay, I doubt arcing from 15 amps or less did it. The Kissling is a hermetically sealed relay and should prevent it from getting internal corrosion, could last well longer than me certainly, but then if the golf cart relays go for 40 years, that’s longer than I have left and likely longer than the aircraft. I had an epiphany the other day, I won’t need to put a 30 year roof on the house when it needs one in 5 years or so. ‘I picked the Kissling for Thrush specifically because they could survive being pressure washed as an Ag plane lives in a highly corrosive environment and a good operator de skins and washes his aircraft daily, same reason I went with the Ancor heat shrink and hot glue lined wire splices. ‘I can defend using an identical cross matched part that meets the form, fit and function when the part called for is no longer available, but using a completely different part of a different design that is a different fit and form factor would be tough.

That balloon has apparently caught several boaters that have visited Cuba though, not smugglers, just tourists.

Yes they will certainly be serviced at the same time. The 500 hours comes from not a time of likely failure, it’s a time interval that ensures that a failure due to time is very remotely possible. The likely hood of both mags failing in one flight are so remote as to be statistically insignificant. The reason many people will try to split overhaul times on twins isn’t to reduce likelihood of a failure, it’s to spread costs so your not hit with both engines being overhauled at the same time.

Lots of things you can get familiar with on the MVP-50, like setting the fuel flow / consumption, you enter the fuel used and it will compute the percent difference snd ask if you want to make the change, and it will change the K factor for you. ‘I’d recommend doing that at first fill up, but after that keep a running track of fuel you buy and don’t adjust it again until you get to about 100 gls or so, the larger the volume, the more accurate it will get, and it can get astonishingly accurate, then leave it alone and don’t adjust it again. ‘Then you know about the data sample rate, factory default is I believe .3 per sec and depending on how much memory is in the unit that will determine how long until it wraps. You may want to consider decreasing that interval some, or the newer units may have a lot of memory so default is fine, it will tell you how long it will record in hours. You download it on a USB thumb drive of course and it can be read and displayed on Microsoft office, I believe excel, no special software needed. Do you have the voice warnings enabled? If so then you may not have an embedded file that covers everything but you can upload a custom file. You can also install external warning lights, I called them Master warning and Master caution, the red one lit whenever any reading was in the red, and yellow anytime you were in the yellow, red meant do something now, of course and yellow meant pay attention. Where did you mount the EDC?

Speaking of hidden functions, I went to the (D) Longbow maintenance school years ago, with I guess 10 years or so experience of maintaining A models, I had come to appreciate it was an electronic aircraft, and the more familiar you were with the schematics the better. ‘Well I found in several schematics that there was an MIK switch that had to be closed or a whole lot of stuff wouldn’t work, apparently this MIK was quite important. Now the Apache had many, many acronyms but MIK was new, and I didn’t find it in the list of abbreviations, so I started asking the instructors and no one knew, finally one of the Boeing tech reps smiled when I asked what it was. Each company of course has its own acronyms and names for things, Bell had coolers and fuel controls, Mcdonald Douglas called them heat exchangers and HMU’s for Hydro Mechanical Units. Anyway for Boeing the MIK stands for “Master Ignition Key” so I learned that if you don’t turn the key on, a whole lot of stuff doesn’t work.

PT20J explains that in the third post, I wouldn’t have expected it either, my assumption is it’s fail safe, break a wire etc to lose power and the instruments are fail safe to on.

Turbines in a crop duster, from 750 SHP out to about 1370 if memory is right. Army helicopters using GE-T700 engines used centrifugal force to clean the air, if you spin the air anything with mass will sling or the outside, then vacuum off the outside and you have clean air. Back in the day the Thrush did as well but it didn’t work very well or at least not as good as a K&N. The dirt is so fine in SWA that it has almost no mass and the centrifugal air particle superstore doesn’t work, one of the last things I saw at the test activity before I left was fitting K&N air filters to Blackhawk helicopters, called them barrier filters. Kuwait Iraq etc is not sand like the old movies suggest, it’s dirt that over time has been pounded into almost a flour like consistency.

I did miss that. ‘Just from a glance of the electronic replacement, it appears as if something is going to be driven from the single mag drive pad, which if I understand it will still have many of the same failure modes. ‘I woud have hoped it would have used a crankshaft sensor and nothing be driven from the drive pad. ‘But back to there are many items that if they fail, your going down, from a crankshaft, cam shaft and has been said I don’t believe there are any gears in the accy gear box that if one breaks that anything will continue to function if nothing else the chunks will break what remains. ‘I’m 100 or so hours away from a 500 hr inspection myself, when I get there, I’ll evaluate the electronic ignition, but I’m comfortable with my one big ole mag as long as it’s professionally serviced. ‘My belief is that for whatever reason many are overly concerned about the (D) magneto, and I believe it’s risk is easily managed, have it serviced, don’t re-use the lock washer and don’t put the wrong gasket under it. Personally I think the problem came from being tough to access, so it was often undertorqued and no one ever looked at the thing ‘While I’m legal to service it, it’s one of those things that i’m my opinion is best left to people that specialize in that area, so I send one off. It’s usually actually cheaper to have one (D) mag serviced as opposed to two single mags ‘I believe years ago I used Maxwell’s magneto’s, I’d assume he’s no longer in business as it was awhile ago. By the way, I’ve known about the SAIB for quite some time. It’s been revised by the way to suggest that at overhaul the Mag flange be dye penetrated. But it’s not an AD, I can’t explain why because it wouldn’t be a tough AD

Yeah, I’m not wild about those in-line fuses either, worse I don’t now what they fuse

It’s nice to know two things, what a CB powers so when one day it trips and won’t reset, you know what you lose. Secondly if there are any hidden functions, I hate those. For instance the AH-64A transmission temp transducers were powered off of the engine start CB, so a shorted temp transducer would pop the CB and you couldn’t start the aircraft. Found that out the hard way

I’m holding onto the old King stuff as long as I can, Hopefully they will outlast me.

Years ago there was something called JTF-6, it was a joint venture between the US Military and the CBP, actually the Border Patrol as Home Land security didn’t exist yet. Sometimes LP/OP’s set up by infantry (listening snd observation posts) up to a Squadron of Apache helicopters. ‘Due to Posse Comittatus we weren’t allowed to do anything but observe and report, nor should we have, Army isn’t policemen, we would suck at it. But anyway we absolutely could shut down the border, nothing bigger than a mouse could get through without being seen. The first night we would be in a sector, we caught drug smugglers, but by night two we only got some people who were crossing to find jobs, no drugs. ‘Very quickly we figured out that there was an intelligence leak in the CBP as the military didn’t know in advance which sector we would be working and we asked if we could be allowed to run a screen line over several sectors determined by us, which was of course denied. ‘Before some get too upset, we were an Air Cav unit and this was actually very good training for us performing a couple of our actual war time jobs, mostly a screen line, so it wasn’t wasting the taxpayers money. It was some of the best training we got. ‘Anyway JTF-6 got canceled when some Marines after being shot at several times, returned fire, one shot and killed the aggressor. Well the media made it out like the Marines were out killing innocent immigrants and that was the end of that. ‘It was a set up job by the drug Cartels, they knew that would end military involvement. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Task_Force_North

What you circled is RBM and Cutler-Hammer, unless I missed something. Does Kissling make them? Are they the parent company? Honest question not trying it be a smart arse, companies are bought all of the time and sometimes the new company bought the old companies name too and keeps it. I was told when I called LASAR’s parts dept that the retrofit kit was needed to use the Cutler-Hammer relays if you had the old RBM relays, but that neither the kit nor the relays were available, there were some used relays available but how do you determine the condition of a relay removed off of a junked airplane? I’n the Army we called that Cannibalization and the rules to use a cannibalized part we’re so stringent that except for something like a panel or similar it just wasn’t possible. There is a reason why when you buy electrical components at a car parts store that they won’t take returns, and that’s that you can’t determine if the part is any good or not from a visual inspection.

I was at Oshkosh years ago as am exhibitor, and before the start of the show I was walking around and spotted a Predator drone on display, being interested I walked over to the thing and noticed it’s big CBP decal. They apparently use reapers which are big 1000 HP aircraft to patrol the border? I asked how they did that, how did they get around the see and avoid requirement, and someone else walked up and said they only fly in controlled airspace so it was legit. I asked what controlled airspace and was told class A, so I asked how do you get to class A? He walked away. I mean be realistic, what does the CBP need Reapers for? It even had the wing hard points. 32 million dollar a piece drone and the ground station costs God knows how much, to replace a man in a C-182. Operating costs of the Reaper are over $12,000 a hour. https://gizmodo.com/we-mapped-where-customs-and-border-protection-drones-ar-1843928454 Again years ago I was at an IA renewal in Savannah Ga, it was at the 8th Air Force museum. One of the classes was given by the Civilian in charge of the Army drones at FT. Stewart. He said the flew them in the Restricted area. I asked where they were kept, he said that fly them out of Wright Army airfield which is now a joint Military / Civil airfield and or course is outside of the Restricted area. I asked how do they get the to the Restricted area since they are not allowed to fly in the National airspace system and he got a little pissed and didn’t answer.

No, I didn’t say that I was unaware of any failures of the dual mag, I said I was unaware of failures of the drive shaft, that being the only common item of the dual mag that I knew of, but if there are enough of anything, there will be failures. But I woud say it’s safe to say that pretty much any item that falls off of the aircraft will cease to function, but being incorrectly torqued or even if the mounting stud broke its not a mag failure, it’s an engine failure, or a human failure. There are innumerable single items on the engine and aircraft that the failure will bring it down. So if a wheel falls off on landing because the mechanic left the cotter pin out, is it a wheel failure? You can’t make something idiot proof, there will always be a better idiot, and we all can on occasion be that idiot.

It was explained to me that the retrofit kit was needed to use the alternate relays, I was quoted I think $2,100 for the kit and told none were available.

Referencing the parts manual page that you circled, the alternate isn’t a Kissling relay, it’s a Cutler- Hammer. which when I called wasn’t available either, it’s the relay that I found only one at $800 for NOS, the rest were take off from junkyards. ‘Plus it requires apparently the retrofit kit that you also circled, that guess what, also isn’t available. ‘I would prefer a Kissling relay as I chose them at Thrush as they were far superior to what we had been using, but I know of no way to use one. Glad to hear newer aircraft have them, but that doesn’t mean I can put them on my older aircraft. Oh, and I’ve been an A&P since 1988 if memory serves, it was well before the Gulf War because I got my A&P before my Airplane Commercial / Instrument and I had all before the war. On edit, in my opinion as long as I can assure that form, fit and function are identical and the cross matched part meets or exceeds the original parts specs that it’s a minor alteration. I see it as no different from the manual calling for a GE landing light and I substituting a Sylvania as long as I can ensure it’s the same wattage and functions and fits identical to the GE called out You will of course get different opinions from different people

I hope so because a motor cycle battery would do that, add a diode so it can’t be drained by the factory battery and your done. I bet it could even have an internal Li-ion just like the modern artificial horizons etc do now. I used to road race motorcycles, we would power the ignition systems off of a small battery and it would last all weekend easy, four cylinder engine and it was wasted spark so it fired twice as often as necessary.

I have read but cannot confirm that if you buy a zero time motor from Lycoming, they will sell you one for two magnetos for the same cost as a single. Assumption is your buying new mags and harnesses?

You could make that statement about most anything. But now that it’s highlighted, it’s easy to manage. Anything will fail if it falls off. I had a dual mag on my 540 and kind of liked it, easy to time, better starts as both mags are firing and just send it in to an expert every 500 hours and that’s it. ‘Oddly “hot starts” on my dual mag motor are ridiculously simple, full rich, no priming and turn the key and it starts like a car. No flooded starts?