Troubleshooting CIES Fuel Senders on an Ovation with G1000

[Ed de C.]

Good evening folks - it seems that I am the first CIES fuel sender customer with an Ovation and G1000 install.  (Let's make that the first fact check.)

I skimmed the other CIES threads and thought I'd start this one based on G1000.  

My Ovation (2008) had an erratic right-side gage reading that was jumping around periodically.  Removing the interior panel on the right side showed some fuel staining around the bulkhead of the factory sender.  Advice was to take this opportunity to switch to CIES digital gages.  So, I did.  

I originally called CIES (in January 2024) and a nice lady told me that I appear to be the first Mooney / G1000 combo to ask about this.  She mentioned that the Ovation kit had been recently modified to include bends that shops were doing in the field.  But the G-1000 piece would be new, but "shouldn't be a problem".  I had my shop give me a quote which meant they had to communicate with CIES and the result was about $6k to do the work (including parts, which someone on the Marauder thread found similar).  My shop A/P reported that all seemed to go well except that the right inboard side sender needed to be "flipped over" to not snag on something in the tank.  They installed the gages, had a couple of calls with CIES about resistors, and calibrated the tanks.

I have the 100 gallons usable tanks.  Some of you may see the problem coming.  

The initial test flight with 100 gallons of fuel onboard started with the customary 44.5 gallons a side on the G-1000 screen. Immediately, the selected tank started to burn down on the G-1000 gage.  My totalizer has proven dead-nuts accurate in the past and calibrates very well with the wing mounted gages. The CIES/G1000 gages are reading 6 - 10 gallons low compared to the totalizer after 10 hours of operation. 

The A/P suspected he had been thrown by the fact that this Mooney has 100-gallon fuel capacity whereas the G1000 gages only read up to 44.5 gallons a side.  A separate thread explains that Garmin never updated the fuel gage readings to accommodate the higher tank capacities after original certification.  The A/P had an idea which was to delete the last fuel calibration entry in the G1000 to see if that would cause the system to realize that 44.5 gallons is the limit of what the G-1000 can accept.  Preliminary results after his deletion is that the gage readings remain inaccurate by between 5 and 10 gallons in mid-range quantities that I've been able to observe.

Question 1: Have any of you with a long-body and G1000 installed CIES gages?

Question 2:  If so, how did you deal with the 44.5 gallon-a-side limit on the G-1000 gages?

Question 3:  Any other ideas?  I can live with this until the annual in 6 months when the plane will be back on jacks and can be levelled for a repeat calibration. On the other hand, given what I've spent, I want these senders to be the best thing since sliced bread.  

Best,

Ed

 

[LANCECASPER]

13 minutes ago, Ed de C. said:

Good evening folks - it seems that I am the first CIES fuel sender customer with an Ovation and G1000 install.  (Let's make that the first fact check.)

I skimmed the other CIES threads and thought I'd start this one based on G1000.  

My Ovation (2008) had an erratic right-side gage reading that was jumping around periodically.  Removing the interior panel on the right side showed some fuel staining around the bulkhead of the factory sender.  Advice was to take this opportunity to switch to CIES digital gages.  So, I did.  

I originally called CIES (in January 2024) and a nice lady told me that I appear to be the first Mooney / G1000 combo to ask about this.  She mentioned that the Ovation kit had been recently modified to include bends that shops were doing in the field.  But the G-1000 piece would be new, but "shouldn't be a problem".  I had my shop give me a quote which meant they had to communicate with CIES and the result was about $6k to do the work (including parts, which someone on the Marauder thread found similar).  My shop A/P reported that all seemed to go well except that the right inboard side sender needed to be "flipped over" to not snag on something in the tank.  They installed the gages, had a couple of calls with CIES about resistors, and calibrated the tanks.

I have the 100 gallons usable tanks.  Some of you may see the problem coming.  

The initial test flight with 100 gallons of fuel onboard started with the customary 44.5 gallons a side on the G-1000 screen. Immediately, the selected tank started to burn down on the G-1000 gage.  My totalizer has proven dead-nuts accurate in the past and calibrates very well with the wing mounted gages. The CIES/G1000 gages are reading 6 - 10 gallons low compared to the totalizer after 10 hours of operation. 

The A/P suspected he had been thrown by the fact that this Mooney has 100-gallon fuel capacity whereas the G1000 gages only read up to 44.5 gallons a side.  A separate thread explains that Garmin never updated the fuel gage readings to accommodate the higher tank capacities after original certification.  The A/P had an idea which was to delete the last fuel calibration entry in the G1000 to see if that would cause the system to realize that 44.5 gallons is the limit of what the G-1000 can accept.  Preliminary results after his deletion is that the gage readings remain inaccurate by between 5 and 10 gallons in mid-range quantities that I've been able to observe.

Question 1: Have any of you with a long-body and G1000 installed CIES gages?

Question 2:  If so, how did you deal with the 44.5 gallon-a-side limit on the G-1000 gages?

Question 3:  Any other ideas?  I can live with this until the annual in 6 months when the plane will be back on jacks and can be levelled for a repeat calibration. On the other hand, given what I've spent, I want these senders to be the best thing since sliced bread.  

Best,

Ed

 

Do you know what software version you're running in the G1000? The version appears on the splash screen of the MFD on start-up

@Pmaxwell has done a lot of G1000 software updates and could tell you if newer versions have the 102 Gallon option (I believe they do since they also have the 130 gallon Jose Monroy Long Range Tank STC option in the 401.37 software and maybe earlier versions).

 

I think adding CIES senders to the G1000 is a solution in search of a problem. The factory senders are very accurate. I haven't noticed any discrepancy in the totalizer versus what fuel I've added at top off. If I end up with a sender that's acting up, if necessary,  I'll send it off to be rebuilt or change it out. I don't want the shop learning on my dime. Maybe after a shop has done a few before mine . . .

[Ed de C.]

In hindsight, I'm inclined to agree (that CIES senders to the G1000 is a solution in search of a problem.)  The factory gages were right on, except for the glitching that probably could have been rectified with an overhauled unit. But, here I am. 

I'm running 401.34 software.  It seems I cannot upgrade to .37 without the 345(?) transponder that I don't have. I have the 330ES.  

Ed

 

[GeeBee]

I know you are not the first. I believe Cole did an install on a G1000 Ovation and I saw one on Controller with Cies senders.

 

[MatthiasArnold]

6 hours ago, Ed de C. said:

I'm running 401.34 software.  It seems I cannot upgrade to .37 without the 345(?) transponder that I don't have. I have the 330ES.

0401.37 runs smoothly with GTX33ES. 

I know at least two birds with this configuration. 

However, no idea if this solves your problems with integration of CIES fuel senders.
Changing the G1000 configuration to 102 gals has no impact on the range of the analog style fuel gauges on the MFD’s engine screen but increases the upper limit of the fuel increase button to 102 and sets the default value of the fuel reset button accordingly.