RJBrown

Door and baggage were originally the same. Yes they can be changed by a locksmith to match the ignition key. I would pop out the two door keys and take thenm to a locksmith and ask. It is fairly easy to pull those locks.

Service ceiling is the altitude where you can no longer maintain a 100' climb for a normally aspirated Mooney. My 1990 MSE is 18800'. That number is really meaningless from an operational standpoint. 16500 is about as high as I feel comfortable climbing. The service ceiling on the M20Ks is 24,000'. That is a certified ceiling. For part 91 flying it is not a limit. Rocket investigated raising the certified ceiling of their conversions to 31,000'. They did a lot of testing at that altitude and the plane did fine. For cost reasons they did not "certify" the plane to 31,000". The only advantage would be to allow air taxi operations above 24,000'. Kind of pointless really.

As I fly my MSE 50 knots slower than my Rocket I feel like I am standing still. I already have given up too much speed. Speed is why we fly isn't it? As I crawl along at 150kts saving gas like crazy I miss 20GPH and 200+.

Quote: Tom In fact, firing squad is only still an option in one state (Oklahoma, not in a Western state), while hanging is only an option in two states (Washington and New Hampshire). What is not fact is often not widely known.

Hard to see location from your pictures. When I had my last plane painted I had a landing light put in one wing. Installation of wing mounted lights is a great improvement.

Once upon a time in North Texas. I was IFR at about 20 and avoiding build ups. I never entered a cloud but did experience updrafts of over 1000 FPM and hail. I thought I was giving it a wide berth. DONT even get close. I escaped with $35000 in damage and quite a scare. That was about 12 years ago. Never again. Repeat: I was never in a cloud. I thought I was a safe distance away. And I was passing to its left as it moved right. When it happened I made a 90 degree left turn and rode the elevator till IT quit going up. I told center what I was doing. I did not wait for his permission. Simply cleared as requested. Center understood the deviation and once things settled down we re established a altitude and heading.

MooneyKFlyer started this thread and I meant to respond only to him. They are his for postage only, if he wants them. They have been sitting in a 5 gallon bucket in my garage collecting dust for over a dozen years. I am happy to give them a home where they are wanted. Randy

My insurance requires a IPC every year. This year I will combine it with my BFR. Both in My plane. Being proficient in YOUR plane is more important than just being legal.

I have 2 stock 1980 231 dark brown leather headrests. These are leftover from a plane I sold 7 years ago. You are welcome to them. Here is a picture. PM me with contact info if you want them.

Quote: scottfromiowa 1. Paying excessively higher fuel prices for 100Low Lead...IF I don't need it.

Any mention of alcohol as an airplane fuel scares me. Alcohol attacks too many existing components in our planes. To make an older Mooney "alcohol compliant" would require changes to every flexible component in the fuel system from the tank sealant to diaphragms and O rings. Pretty costly it seems to me. I understand that any mogas STC excludes the use of any fuel that contains alcohol. At KAPA there are Aircraft based on the field: 836 Single engine airplanes: 568 Multi engine airplanes: 135 Jet airplanes: 112 Helicopters: 21 Aircraft operations: avg 875/day * 44% local general aviation 41% transient general aviation 14% air taxi 1% military * for 12-month period ending 31 December 2008 There are 836 planes based at Centennial. Of that total there are 112 Jets. The avgas sales average 50,000 gallons a month. Jet fuel sales average 800,000 gallons a month. 7 times as many aircraft using 1/16 as many gallons of fuel. An average corner gas station sells more fuel than all the avgas at Centennial. Avgas is a really small market. Forcing a questionable fuel for "environmental" reasons is purely for political show. There is so little lead introduced into the environment that it is silly to worry about it.

If they used Mooney parts the O2 would be in the left armrest. It is not visible in the interior picture where it is in every 231 I have ever seen. Is the guy leaving his portable set in the backseat? My question was does anyone have any firsthand knowledge on the O2 situation with the 79 231s. I have heard conflicting info and would like to hear what the truth is.

The only 231s I have seen without O2 were all 1979 year planes. I have heard all were built without, but it could have been added to any as an option. I have also been told there is no stc to add it. I have no first hand knowledge just "what I heard" Any one know for sure what the O2 situation was with the 79s? Some like Jason believe thiers is original. At the other end a reputable Mooney dealer told me non were original. I don't know the truth either way. On this one the O2 pressure gauge and the lever to turn it on are missing from the interior picture.

The plane is like most 79s and has no oxygen. A turbo with no O2 ? It only took Mooney 1 year to figure that one out. As a rule most 79s did not have the equiptment of later years. Most had mechanical tuners for all the radios like the kx170 nav coms.

I own an auto repair shop. What I see in engines depends on how a customer treats and maintains the vehicle. Identical cars can be junk at 100,000 miles or still running strong at 300,000. Most "lemons" are a result of customer abuse. With the ability to control all the parameters of the engine such as mixture, cowl flaps, RPM, etc. we also have the ability to abuse our engines in ways a car operator can't. How long our engines last depends on us more than anything else. TBO is just a manufacturers recommendation, for part 91 it has no regulatory significance. We are free to run our engines as long as we feel comfortable doing so. The 4 cylinder Lycomings historically have shown the ability to run safely past TBO. For me to feel safe an engine near or past TBO should be on an oil analysis program and have solid maintenance records. Any engine past TBO that is in a plane that is for sale I would consider worthless as anything but a core.

The gross weight of a Rocket is, or can be changed to, 3200#. My old Rocket had a usefull over 1100#. Full fuel was 101 useable, or 606#. This left 515# of legal payload. The TLS has a gross weight of 3368. Both share the same flying surfaces. The TLS was allowed the higher gross weight, not because it could lift more but because it could land heavier. The landing gear was beefed up on the TLS so it could keep a similar useful load at the higher gross weight. The 305HP Rocket will always be able to out climb and out run a 270HP TLS at any weight. A 3130# gross weight Encore may have a greater usefull than any other Mooney if the 1800 empty weight is to be believed. I for one can't imagine an Encore under 1900# empty. Any real world Encore drivers out there? Was the Rocket you looked at an early one? The ones finished before the 3200# gross was approved may have a lower useful.

First Pryority Bank of Pryor Oklahoma lends. I talked to Robert Guderian there. I believe they loan 85% max though.

My wife is 5'3" and under 120# I am 6' and over 215#. 4 people like us are about the FAA average of 170# per seat. For a 2 hour/ 300 nautical trip a J should start out with 35-40 gal of fuel. So 680# of people, 240# of fuel leaves 65# for pilot junk and baggage. Not much for bags. Because one of my daughters gets motion sick in the rear seat my wife has often ridden in the back. For her the seating is fine. With full fuel (384#) I can carry 600# or 2 adults 2 small kids and 100# of stuff. My plane is a 1990 with the 2900# gross. That said MOST flights are 2 or fewer people so weight really becomes a moot point. If you buy a plane for the last 5% of your flights you will pay for that capacity every flight. It will be far less expensive to own a M20J for 90%+ and rent for the rest than to pay to haul around 4 extra seats most of the time.

My last airplane was N231NH. I bought it in 1994 and I flew it as a 231 for over a year. When it had engine problems I had it converted to a Rocket. After over 800 hour as a Rocket I sold it in 2003. A year ago I went through the search to find the perfect plane to keep throughout my retirement. I looked at 231's TLS's and Rockets but bought a clean low time 1990MSE. She is a great plane, well equipped, fast and economical. With speeds of 155-160 knots on 9 gph, what more did I need? When I fly down to Texas or east to visit family I love it. But every time I head west I miss the Rocket. The ability to look down on the rocks from the 20s sure felt nice. Hey Steve want to trade me back my plane? Any one interested in helping me get back into a Rocket? Unless there is someone who wants a trade I will most likely need to sell and buy all over again. Thats not something I look forward to. I thought about the M20 Turbo but for $40,000 it just does not make sense.

seriously, which seats would you prefer?

They would look better to match the seats to the headrest not the other way around. Those blue seats remind me of the ones that came in my 80 231, could not wait to get rid of them.

Are you looking at N800MS ? I had it under contract Jan of 09. US aircraft the MSC in Denton did the pre buy. At the time it had quite a squawk list. I would have bought it had the seller honored the contract. I talked to the shop that did the OH 10 plus years ago and felt good about the "bones" of the plane. If you have not seen it up close you need to. Looks MUCH better in pictures. I think it spent a lot of time soaking up the California sunshine collecting "paper" annuals, before the current owners bought it. They bought it with a current annual and were quite surprised by what US found.

My first plane was a 1980 231 that was later converted to a 305 Rocket. I now own a 1990 MSE. Under 12 the J model is great 150-160kts on 8-10 gph. Above it gets pretty weak. The 231 climbs well into the flight levels and a Rocket is still well over 1000 fpm at 26,000'. When I am scooting along down low the MSE is wonderful. When I fly west of here I really miss the turbos. Last weekend I flew over the mountains and the winds and rough air beat us up at 16,500. With a turbo we could have sailed along in the 20s. It all comes down to money vs performance.

The install to be IFR legal seems to be a big cost. Lots of old usable units around. The avionics shop I talked to wanted a bunch to put in a old kln90/94. Something about annunciators and such to make it legal. 2-3 AMU installed and running would be easy. Over that I'd just keep what I have till I can get what I want. Seems these older units can be had for under 1 AMU but to get it running is what'l kill ya. I guess there is no plug n play replacement for the KLN88. I had a KNS 80 in my Rocket and it served the make it legal purpose but I really did not want to go that way. I did like using it though.

The eligible airframes are: Serial# 24-1686 through 24-3200 and 24-3202 through 24-3217