gsxrpilot

Back when I owned an M20C, I was in and out of quite a few airports above 5000 ft. I don't have any hard numbers for you, but there weren't any issues. I was generally at gross weight and flying out of airports with long paved runways. FLG - 7014' WYS - 6649' BJC - 5673' APA - 5884' SAF - 6438' ABQ - 5355' On one trip west with my wife, we were debating during the flight where we should stop for the night. We were considering FLG and she was online looking for lodging. It was a warm summer afternoon in July. I told her if we landed in FLG, we were definitely there for the night. The DA on the ground was over 11,000'. I didn't think there was any way we could take off again that afternoon. We landed, spent the night, and took off in the cool early morning easily. Taking off out of WYS in the middle of summer, we had to circle the airport a few times to gain enough altitude to get out of the valley and across the high terrain of Yellowstone. But it wasn't a problem. I don't think my M20C was ever still on the ground at the 3000 foot mark. But I probably wouldn't want a high altitude airport with less than 6000' of runway. Full throttle, full prop, and keep adjusting the mixture to give you best power and yet stay under 400° or so.

+1 for McMaster My 4Runner is built for severe off-road action and towing an equally capable camper trailer. I did most of it my self with the help of countless parts from McMaster.

And you'll still spend the $25K before it's really flyable.

I might have to dig up the old list again. We've been hit with another rash of wannabe owners jumping into project Mooneys.

Are you an A&P? If not, this is only a project for your bank account. An old car is a project, an old house is a project, maybe a boat or motorcycle. With airplanes, if you're not an A&P, you're pretty much relegated to standing around writing checks and watching while someone else ignores your "project" in the corner of the maintenance hangar. There are some rare occasions where someone is such close friends with an A&P that they can do some of the work and have it signed off and pay a discounted rate. But baring that situation...

That's not an autopilot... or not one worth talking about. Autopilot = Stec30 or better.

Each of my Mooneys had been gear upped three time. My current 252 was gear upped twice by the same owner. It obviously doesn't bother me at all. A properly repaired gear up incident is the least of all possible issues with a vintage Mooney.

Let's see, what does a $50K M20C look like. Currently in annual and airworthy It will be flying regularly, probably between 50 and 100 hours per year. 100 is better. Complete logs or at least complete for the last 30 years ADSB out Everything in the panel will work, except for the ADF. It will have at least one, and probably two, of the following: Autopilot - Stec30 or better WAAS GPS - GNS430W or better Mid-time engine between 500 - 1000 SMOH Note: to rectify any of the above three items is a $20K bill. You will feel comfortable to hand over the check, pick up the keys and fly it for the next 12 months without doing anything to it.

The plane was insured for $50K. It had about 1400 hours on the engine. The insurance company decided it was more cost effective to write the check for $50K and then part out the plane rather than pay to repair it. There is a percentage calculation the insurance company uses to decide to repair or total. The owner thought about buying it back from the insurance company and getting it repaired, but estimated it would cost $7K to $10K out of pocket to do that... and then he'd still have an M20C, even a really nice one, but with a 1400 hour engine. I'd had the plane insured with a $60K hull value to be sure that a simple gear-up wouldn't total the airplane. Then I sold it for $50K. And so the buyer insured it for $50K. I wish I'd thought to explain to him that $50K wasn't enough protection and how to calculate an appropriate level of insurance. The plane was worth $50K but it would take quite a bit more than that to recreate that airplane. Jason who bought it, took the $50K check and added the $10K he would have spent, and a bit more and bought an M20J. He's since sold the J and is on to something else now.

Yep, that was a sad day. Especially for the guy who owned her at the time. I've always wondered where the parts went. It had every speed mod ever produced for the C. It also had a really nice interior and of course the panel and yokes.

It sounds like you're looking for a project, not too concerned about the cost, and interested in rescuing a deserving Mooney. In that case, this looks like a great option. The M20J being the most popular Mooney model, it's a great candidate rescue. Compared to rescuing a car, it will take a lot more time and will be much more expensive. But the end result will be very satisfying. And if you own/fly it long enough, you'll get your investment back. It will always have that "scarlet letter" of missing logs attached to it. But the effect will fade over time and as the overall fleet continues to shrink. Best of luck and keep us posted on the progress.

Yes, we do. Without sending digital logs you might sell to the local guy stopping by your airport. But you won't get the value out of the plane you would from a nationwide pool of buyers. Do you have any examples of a plane stolen by someone who did so because they had digital copies of the logs? That's not a thing. Even so, an airplane up for sale with nothing but digital logs, no originals available, would raise all kinds of suspicion. And even if it did happen, that's what insurance is for. For every one good airplane for sale, there are 10 that are being misrepresented. It's a fools errand to go chasing across the country after an airplane for which you haven't already inspected the logs. In this day, it's just good business to inspect digital copies of log books before getting too involved in the purchase of any airplane. Welcome to the 21st century.

I once learned this the hard way. I bought a set of J style yokes here on MooneySpace. They came with the shafts. Several months later I was sitting in Don Maxwell's office and proudly showed him what I'd acquired and asked if his guys could install them. He went in his parts room and brought out a couple of C shafts and showed me how much they were different from the J shafts. There was no way the yokes would fit without the official Mooney retrofit kit to fit J yokes to my C. It took another year to get Mooney to make them for me and I think they were about $600 each. I'm sure they're double that now. But in the end it was worth every bit of the trouble, time, and expense. Here you go...

M20J's don't depreciate. Or at least they aren't over the last 5 years. If you buy a well documented, airworthy, M20J today for 85K and fly it for 800 hours over the course of 6 to 8 years, you'll sell it for $125K. We'll assume you maintain it, fly it, maybe upgrade the panel a bit and take good care of it. All Mooneys other than the long bodies, have already fully depreciated. If one is maintained in flying condition with a moderately up to date panel/autopilot, it will appreciate considerably.

Me personally, I would get a very thorough pre-buy at MY choice of shop. And that pre-buy is going to be expensive. And then hopefully it all works out and you're flying a nice M20J for half what it should have cost. But... Just be aware that when you go to sell it, you're gonna take a huge hit to the value as well. Unless you own it for 20 years and have therefore created 20 years of impeccable logs, you'll take a bath when you go to sell. And even if you have those 20 years of logs when you sell, your buyers pool will be smaller as there are plenty of buyers out there who won't look at a Mooney that's missing ANY logs. I'd buy it if everything checks out... but it would have to be at a significant discount.

I don't know about Albuquerque, but @byrdflyr has had good things to say about Santa Fe Jet Center in Santa Fe.

Maybe that was the case 10 years ago, but no longer. And what is the problem with someone having digital copies of the logs? A savvy buyer today will want to see the logs probably before even making a trip to view the plane. It's just about become SOP in the Mooney community to get digital copies of the logs sent to Laura at SWTA for inspection before putting too much effort into the purchase. She doesn't work for free, so there is skin in the game and not just a bunch of tire kickers. I know that myself and quite a few brokers won't recommend airplanes that don't have digital copies of the log books available for inspection.

I'd be interested in buying into the deal assuming the J door frame is the same as my 1987 K door frame.

The cylinders and turbo on my Continental TSIO360 made it all the way to TBO and a bit beyond. I also just went through a major overhaul and the bill from the engine shop including all the usual accessories and converting the engine from an MB to an SB... came in under $35K

Actually, the N number and serial number of the airplane go on the AFMS. It can be downloaded from the Garmin website and it's already signed. The STC paper can also be downloaded and doesn't need any signature.

Some manufacturers control the STC. Garmin doesn't appear to do so. The signed and dated STC can be freely downloaded from their website and then you just fill in your airplane N number and Serial number. Other's like Genesys don't provide a signed copy of the STC to you without you paying for it.

The FAR/AIM is like the Bible, there are as many interpretations as there are people reading it, and all of them swear they have the right one. The clock in my panel is on the screen of my IFD540 GPS. When I took my Instrument check ride in I think 2009, I had an egg timer Velcro'd to the panel. I had to demonstrate a timed approach. The DPE had no problem approving the Cherokee 140 I was flying, and signed my certificate.

Are you sure? I think it's an IFR requirement, not an airworthiness requirement

I wouldn't ask. But certainly don't ask Garmin! If you must ask, ask a CFI or DPE, but first check to see if he's wearing an analogue or digital watch. Best to find a guy who pulls out his iPhone when you ask what time it is.

They never were for me.