201 panel upgrade starts

[CCAS]

Stopped by the avionics shop today.  It's coming along.  Most of the old wiring has been removed.  New wire harness is just about complete.  Autopilot servos are being installed.  Tail LED strobe light is in (and rudder has been balanced by the factory and re-installed); remaining LEDs to be installed shortly.  Panel design taking longer than expected.  Latest architecture block diagram based on how I understand the harness design (left the GMU and audio panel off to save space): 

 

 

[ArtVandelay]

  On 2/12/2025 at 2:28 PM, Pinecone said:

I have an FS-510 and it updates fairly quickly.  A few minutes.
One thing to check with your installer to make sure that the high speed data transfer is enabled.  So that once your 650 gets updated, the other boxes update quickly.
In my setup, my 750Xi is primary and 650Xi is updated from the 750.  That takes maybe a minute (no charts).
For me, the long time is the G3X as it requires a card to update it.  And that takes longer than the FS-510. And I have two G3Xs, so either I have to do two cards, to do the update thing twice and wait.
Next update cycle, I need to time the updates.

The G3X takes about 12 minutes if updating all charts, the flitecharts, IFR takes most of the time IIRC. Even on the coldest of days, the engine warms up faster than the database update.

[toto]

  On 2/20/2025 at 8:16 AM, ArtVandelay said:

The G3X takes about 12 minutes if updating all charts, the flitecharts, IFR takes most of the time IIRC. Even on the coldest of days, the engine warms up faster than the database update.

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Mine takes almost exactly 20 minutes. I try to do it when the plane needs a quart of oil, so I start the db update, do the oil, open the hangar door, pull the plane out, close the door, and then wait about 3-5 minutes for it to finish

 

[Pinecone]

I will have to time mine.  I need to do an update.

It doesn't bother me too much.   What IS annoying is that I have TWO G3X, and have to update both with a card.  So I did get smart and get some extra cards, so I write two update cards, put one in each G3X and do the updated simultaneously. 

 

[CCAS]

Latest panel version attached. I"ve got one more round of feedback before we lock down the design. There are a couple minor things I've noticed (at least one typo on the CB panel labels, Gear Safety Bypass button needs to slide further right, etc) but I'd appreciate anyone's input if they see something glaringly odd.  FYI.  I went back and forth on placement of the GMC507 in the stack and after chair-flying the options I ended up with it at the bottom which worked best for me.  Thanks!

John 

1 N716J Update General 2.pdfFetching info...

[shawnd]

That looks great! I like the design . What switches are you going with?

[CCAS]

  On 3/29/2025 at 7:58 PM, shawnd said:

I like the design . What switches are you going with?

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I thought you might appreciate the design since it's basically yours!  The switches are Carling Contura V series except for the dimmer switches which are Carling LD series.  I opted for the generic actuators (the actuator isn't labeled...the label goes on the panel) and I'll just buy a few extra actuators to keep in the airplane as spares.  The Smart Glide switch will be a locking version of the Contura V.  

[shawnd]

  On 3/29/2025 at 8:13 PM, CCAS said:

I thought you might appreciate the design since it's basically yours! 

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Love it - I am glad you found it useful!
 

  On 3/29/2025 at 8:13 PM, CCAS said:

The switches are Carling Contura V series except for the dimmer switches which are Carling LD series.  I opted for the generic actuators (the actuator isn't labeled...the label goes on the panel) and I'll just buy a few extra actuators to keep in the airplane as spares.  The Smart Glide switch will be a locking version of the Contura V.  

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This scheme would match the newer Mooneys. Just a couple suggestions to consider:

1. In an emergency, every second matters and the locking Contura switch may cause you a bit of grief. Do you have one and played around with one? The official Garmin smart glide is much easier in comparison, lift the flap and press the switch with minimal effort. Your fallback however could be to hold the Direct To button on the GTN for a few seconds to activate it.

2. I've been advised that it's important for the ELT to be within arm's reach while buckled in and unable to move. Relocating it to the CB panel might look cleaner, but it could put it out of reach in an emergency when you need to arm it. It’s worth testing the setup assuming seat belts and shoulder straps are fully secured and locked (unable to move).

 

[CCAS]

Thanks Shawn - I've got another visit to the avionics shop this week so I'll see what they think. I feel pretty comfortable with the locking mechanism of the Carling switch but will look into it a bit more. As for the ELT switch, I hadn't heard any guidance like you mentioned. I've never had any issues reaching over to the CB panel before (even when strapped in tight during turbulence) but maybe my flexibiity in the future could be an issue. 

John

[Pinecone]

Minor things.

You seem to have 3 com radios.  That is if you put GNC-355 in the middle space.  Or are you putting in a -375 for transponder?  I would consider a remote mounted GTX-345.

I would use the factory Smart Glide, and put it where it is easy for the person in the right seat to get to in case of pilot incapacitation.

Not sure if this is done, but put the GDU as high as you can.  Less head tilt that can lead to spacial orientation issues.

Why 2 GI-275?  Is one engine instruments?  Why not just put them on the GDU?

[CCAS]

  On 3/31/2025 at 8:43 PM, Pinecone said:

Minor things.

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All good questions and points. 

Only two radios.  Below the GTN will be a GNX375 for a combo XPDR and GPS#2; the second radio is the GTR205. Looks like the last drawing wasn't clear on those components. 

Question about the Smart Glide: In a scenario where the pilot was incapacitated but the airplane was just fine, what kind of flight path would you get if a non-pilot passenger activated Smart Glide with the GFC500 engaged?  If the engine was turning at 2500 RPM would Smart Glide still want to establish an IAS descent to the nearest airport?  

The avionics shop has been working with the panel folks to get the GDU as high as possible but I agree with you...it looks like it might be able to go a little higher.  I'll revisit that question.  

The bottom GI275 is the EIS.  I wanted a GI275 for engine data because other aircraft I fly have 275 EIS and I liked the commonality to process data more consistently when I move between platforms.  I was surprised there wasn't a huge difference in price between a stand alone GI275 EIS versus adding the EIS to the GDU. 

 

[Pinecone]

  On 4/10/2025 at 2:30 AM, CCAS said:

All good questions and points. 

Only two radios.  Below the GTN will be a GNX375 for a combo XPDR and GPS#2; the second radio is the GTR205. Looks like the last drawing wasn't clear on those components. 

Question about the Smart Glide: In a scenario where the pilot was incapacitated but the airplane was just fine, what kind of flight path would you get if a non-pilot passenger activated Smart Glide with the GFC500 engaged?  If the engine was turning at 2500 RPM would Smart Glide still want to establish an IAS descent to the nearest airport?  

The avionics shop has been working with the panel folks to get the GDU as high as possible but I agree with you...it looks like it might be able to go a little higher.  I'll revisit that question.  

The bottom GI275 is the EIS.  I wanted a GI275 for engine data because other aircraft I fly have 275 EIS and I liked the commonality to process data more consistently when I move between platforms.  I was surprised there wasn't a huge difference in price between a stand alone GI275 EIS versus adding the EIS to the GDU. 

 

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OK, I see.

Smart Glide is a PILOT aid, not a passenger aid.  It would have to be a REALLY bad day to lose the pilot (incapacitated) AND the engine at the same time.  But, AFAIK, it would pitch for Best Glide airspeed, which will result in a climb if the engine is running.  There is a thread on BT about Smart Glide. 

Level button is a pilot and passenger aid.  I have taught my SO, that if I am incapacitated, if we are on autopilot, don't do anything, except start talking on the radio.   If NOT on autopilot, push the Level button FIRST.  Then take a deep breath and start talking on the radio.

OK, that also makes sense for commonality.  I am happy with the G3X GIS.  But have since installed a GI-275 EIS in my CAP-10.

[bixmooney]

  On 2/4/2025 at 3:28 PM, Pinecone said:

I left my wingtip halogens alone.  If you change them to LED you have an issue with the annunciator (Gear Down) dimming.  There are work arounds, but considering how much of a PITA it is to change the bulb, and you may need to change the socket AND do the work around so the Gear Down is not dimmed all the time.........

 

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Could you elaborate on this ?   Which gear down bulb dimms ?   The one on the panel or the floor indicator when switching to LED ? 

[Pinecone]

  On 4/11/2025 at 1:59 PM, bixmooney said:

Could you elaborate on this ?   Which gear down bulb dimms ?   The one on the panel or the floor indicator when switching to LED ? 

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Panel one.  The dimming is controlled by the current/resistance of the nav lights.

[bixmooney]

  On 4/11/2025 at 5:56 PM, Pinecone said:

Panel one.  The dimming is controlled by the current/resistance of the nav lights.

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Thank you.   I had changed to the led nav lights and the panel light did not dim.  
 

my floor indicator is out but I think that is just a burned out bulb and waiting to get at it.