New Bravo Owner. New to Mooney

[Zibolsk1]

I just purchased a 1992 Bravo. It has a high time engine with new mags,hoses, exhaust and turbo. It has basic standard mooney equipment plus a 530w, aspen pro 1000 and jpi730. Looking for info on oil temps, CHT, and EGT temps. Also had three over boost situations. Take off was normal at 38MP and at about 400 ft agl it let loose and over boosted. Engine was surging. Power was reduced almost immediately. Any thoughts?

[Zibolsk1]

Is nose wheel shimmy a standard problem with Mooneys? Mine seems to shimmy and has excessive play in the nose wheel.

[Marauder]

Nose wheel shimmy is not normal unless the bushings weren't maintained. 

[Marauder]

Anyone know this Mooney? N9155Y

 

BTW -- Zibolski welcome to forum.

[FoxMike]

Nose wheel shimmy is not normally a problem.  You need to have a Mooney expert look at it and diagnose.  I would do that right away lest you damage your airplane on the next takeoff.  When you get a real bad shimmy you cannot control the airplane and you will likely end up in a ditch or worse.  The overboost problem also needs immediate attention.  It may need to have the density altitude controller adjusted and more carefully safety wired or it may need an overhaul.

[Awful_Charlie]

Welcome Zibolsk1 - congrats on the purchase, and welcome to the club!

 

I've recently had a short overboost as well, and am looking into the cause. I'm guessing it must be in the absolute controller, as that should override the differential controller, but it is of course possible it's something else like a restriction in an oil line somewhere. Mine occurred on the climb out passing through about 5000' - boost went up to 36" briefly (but it was cold) and I grabbed in in time to make the easiest category in the Lycoming overboost SB592

 

For temps, in the cruise, 12-13GPH , 30" 2200, cowl flaps closed, normally about 350 in the cruise for the CHT, 180ish for the oil. My EGT probes are close to the cylinder heads, so quite high (about 1550), but as the temperature is so closely related to the distance from the flange, I expect there will be a lot of variation in non-factory installed figures.

 

No nose wheel shimmy here, have a search in the forums here, as a lot has been written about it for most models

[AndyFromCB]

Awful_Charlie,

 

I still for the life of me do not see how you are getting 13gph at that power setting. What's your TIT? I run mine at 28/2400 at closer to 16gph in order to keep my TIT in check...

[Awful_Charlie]

That's about 20 degrees LOP (gas here is expensive, I couldn't afford to cruise at 17+GPH on a regular basis!)

 

I can't get to the TIT limit at 30" and below, peak would be about 1650-1700 (but I'd try to avoid any continuous time at much over 1650).

 

One flight here: https://www.savvyanalysis.com/flight/825485/14f3f54f-8946-4f40-b0fb-2ae7a5df390e- that was FL230

[AndyFromCB]

Where are you at in Yurop. Heading to Austria for a week in May, but will probably just hang around Vienna with my sister. 

 

I tried to get book fuel burns in my Bravo and simply cannot do it. It will actually peak and my fuel burn will still be 2gph higher than book at all power settings with exception of 34/2400…My RPM and MP gauges are correct.

[Awful_Charlie]

I live in Zurich, the Bravo lives in France at Mulhouse-Habsheim. Not sure what's on in May yet, other than a few long weekends thanks to Bank holidays! PM me your plans when you have them, if a meet looks practical it's always good to pick a fellow Mooniacs brain (and even better when they're a Bravo driver!)

[Danb]

I would buy 28/2400 peak tit to be around 14 gph...Charlie 30 22 = 52 and your 28 24= 52 they shoul equal basically the same gph and %power...I run 30/24 -around 1600 and get about 15 gph...I don't see where Charlie is incorrectly reporting his numbers..most likely around 1625 degrees would yield 13 gph.. 180 knots...

[AndyFromCB]

I would buy 28/2400 peak tit to be around 14 gph...Charlie 30 22 = 52 and your 28 24= 52 they shoul equal basically the same gph and %power...I run 30/24 -around 1600 and get about 15 gph...I don't see where Charlie is incorrectly reporting his numbers..most likely around 1625 degrees would yield 13 gph.. 180 knots...

 

I believe his numbers. I run around 1650 at 28/2400 and it costs me 15.5-16gph. 30/2400 will cost me 17.5-18gph, 32/2400 will cost me about 19.5-20, 34/2400 will cost me about 21.5-22gph, depending on OAT.

 

I never use 2200 power setting as my engine/prop combo is turbine smooth at 2400 and I get noticeably more vibration at 2200. Cannot really pull LOP very well. My cylinders always peak all over the place depending on the phase of the moon, etc.

 

Now, my airplane seems much faster than the book at lower power settings. On 28/2400 I constantly see 175knots at 12,000 and 185knots at 18,000, with TKS.

[FlyDave]

I just purchased a 1992 Bravo. It has a high time engine with new mags,hoses, exhaust and turbo. It has basic standard mooney equipment plus a 530w, aspen pro 1000 and jpi730. Looking for info on oil temps, CHT, and EGT temps. Also had three over boost situations. Take off was normal at 38MP and at about 400 ft agl it let loose and over boosted. Engine was surging. Power was reduced almost immediately. Any thoughts?

Zibolks1,

 

Congratulations on buying a Bravo. It's an amazingly capable and versatile airplane.

Don Kaye was by Bravo instructor. He said to keep TIT below 1600 dF and CHT's at 400 dF max. Don is on the second engine in his Bravo and got somewhere in the area of 2300 hours out of the first engine, so he has a good history of Bravo engine management. I have flown my airplane to these specs since I got it in December 2013 and haven't had any engine problems (180 tach hours).

In climb I monitor CHT for temp. In the winter I can lean a bit in climb, in the summer (depending on OAT) I may not be able to lean.

In cruise I lean to TIT. Keeping TIT at/below 1600 dF my CHT's will be below 400 dF.

EGT's are not something I concern myself with. From what I understand, EGT's don't mean much if you're monitoring TIT (Turbine Inlet Temperature).

Also, I don't think you should typically be pulling more than ~35" MP on takeoff - per Don Kaye. I'd have this looked at.

As an aside, Mark Rouch of Top Gun Aviation in Stockton, CA - a well known and respected Mooney Service Center, says that he would run TIT up to 1650. I may try this but have not as of yet.

The Bravo engine is not a fuel efficient engine. My thoughts on fuel flow are I'd rather burn a bit more fuel and have a healthy engine than save a gallon or two an hour and have an engine or component failure in flight.

 

Is nose wheel shimmy a standard problem with Mooneys? Mine seems to shimmy and has excessive play in the nose wheel.

I would definitely get this looked at by a Mooney Savvy mechanic. This could turn a nice day of flying into a, well, not so nice day. Get it looked at right away.

[FlyDave]

Andy,

 

Awful_Charlie is the only one I know that can run his Bravo LOP. I certainly can't. I can achieve his FF's but at a greatly reduced power setting than he states. I'm envious!

What are your typical power settings, temps an FF?

 

Dave

[AndyFromCB]

Andy,

 

Awful_Charlie is the only one I know that can run his Bravo LOP. I certainly can't. I can achieve his FF's but at a greatly reduced power setting than he states. I'm envious!

What are your typical power settings, temps an FF?

 

Dave

 

I fly between 12,000 and 18,000 most of the time unless tops force me higher and I won't go higher than FL220 in an unpressurized plane. If really only fly one setting, 28/2400, 1650TIT, about 15.5 to 16 gph. Keeps my CHT below 380, most are around 360, #1 always running hotter, around 380. That power setting gets me 175 at 12,000, verified with 3 way GPS. For each 1000 feet higher I go, I gain 2 knots, so at FL180, I gives me 185knots.

[FlyDave]

I usually fly the same altitude range but two different power settings but have always kept TIT below 1600.

29/2400, 18.5 gph and in the summer CHT's can go over 400 without cowl flaps trailing a little. At FL180 I'm running 198KTAS and faster with a aft CG

26/2400, 16.5 gph and no problem with CHT's staying under 400. At FL18 I'm running around 189 KTAS and again, faster with an aft CG

I'll try 28/2400/TIT of 1650 and see if I can keep CHT's below 400. Your temps make me wonder if I need to adjust my baffling.

Also, I have had a vibration at the higher power settings and I believe it's the engine. My engine is definitely not turbine smooth. I had the prop dynamically balanced a few weeks ago and I it was about as balanced as it can be. I spoke to Cody Stallings (great guy!) and I need to have the prop tracking checked by the prop guy. But I do think it's the engine that's generating the vibration.

[Danb]

Dave, I don't have any vibration, and like Andy I don't like 2200 either due to smoothness we have a couple Bravos here and I'm the only one the exceeds books nos. also, maybe because it quite new 2005. I seem to beat book by about 5 knots, and since I do Ibusually never fly much stronger than 31/24. But usually 30/24 or less, just playing 24/34 and be equal to my J was..I always pay strict attention to temps., and in 3500 hrs never changed a cylinder or gad one below 70... Luck and temp. Control I guess..

Mr Zib. Welcome and enjoy one of the best machines in the sky,,you'll piss off a lot of Barons and the like..

[Zibolsk1]

Thanks for the replies. My Bravo is in the shop getting these items looked at as we speak.

[Zibolsk1]

Anyone know this Mooney? N9155Y

 

BTW -- Zibolski welcome to forum.

Why do you ask about N9155Y.

[Marauder]

Why do you ask about N9155Y.

I saw a picture of this airplane's Aspen displaying weather on an Aspen PFD. Was wondering what was driving it. Not sure why I asked on this forum thread.

[Zibolsk1]

I'm not exactly sure what the name of it is. It is an add on s to the Aspen.

[blakealbers]

I run 1550 -1580 tit 30-31 mp 2400 rpm. Climb 34-24. Glad av gas is getting cheaper. Would any of you like to elaborate on your descent procedures for cooling the engine

[donkaye]

500 Ft/ min descent rate is best for passengers, but often is not practical.  Reason?  Assume you're at 17,500.  Then descent would have to start 35 minutes out for a sea level airport.  Assuming 3 miles /minute that means a start of descent over 100 miles out.  In that situation, though, just lower the  nose and go fast.  I'll always go as fast as I can on descent given the conditions.  This somewhat makes up for the slower climb at the beginning of the flight.

 

When a quicker descent is called for, I'll first reduce power to about 20".  The rate can be as fast as necessary as long at the cooling rate of the coolest cylinder  read from your engine monitor is less than the 50°F/ min. as specified by Lycoming.  Next I'll smoothly reduce RPM to 2,000 such that the passengers barely notice.  This will insure that the engine runs the prop and not the other way around, which could be detrimental to the engine.  Next reduce MP to no less than 15".  15" is the lowest you should go until power reduction for landing.  Depending on circumstances you now have gear to help slow to flap speed, then flaps, then if a steep slope is required, speed brakes.

 

The Bravo can easily be slowed from 160 knots to 75 knots within 5 nm.

 

Reasons for following the above procedure: I've have my Bravo for going on 23 years, am on my second engine now and have been giving Mooney specific training for the past 21 years.

[hazek]

On 4/5/2015 at 7:24 AM, donkaye said:

Next I'll smoothly reduce RPM to 2,000

Why does the POH then call for 2400RPM in the descent?

[Fly Boomer]

40 minutes ago, hazek said:

Why does the POH then call for 2400RPM in the descent?

Probably those numbers were not for a slam-dunk approach.  I just briefly scanned Don's 9-year-old post above, and it sounds like he is describing how to get down as fast as possible without doing anything crazy.