N1026F

I just had my '04 Ovation repaired after my "expensive brain fart" of pulling the gear up instead of the flaps. (Apparently, Dugosh is kept very busy by stupid Mooney drivers). Nonetheless, their service is second to none in the service industry. The service techs, have factory experience and Ronnie and Vannette have been doing Mooneys forever. They are complete and they found everything that needed to be fixed,repaired or replaced, in addition to an annual while waiting for a couple parts. Dugosh is worth every penny! But if you want a thorough but inexpensive ( approx. $1000.00 squawk-free) annual by a Mooney driving A & P that is a big Mike Busch fan, call Chris Burnette in Corpus Christi at 361-834-6299. My plan is to use Chris for two or three annuals then fit Dugosh in every three or four years--Chris likes the idea too. Either way, you get what you pay for. As a matter of fact, I have the Ovation up there right now because I have a small fuel leak on the left wing that needs to be hunted down and sealed. I don't need a total reseal, just a patch. Obviously, I believe Dugosh is the right place to get it done correctly. If there are any places out here that MS members don't believe are worth the price, it's not libelous (in Texas) to state a simple opinion along the lines that you feel "more comfortable taking you business elsewhere." Along the lines of pre-buys. A short war story from a friend of mine that bought a Citation a couple years ago. He had a pre buy at a San Antonio Service Center. Everything passed and he bought it. At the next annual, the same shop informed him that the thrust reversers needed work because they were now out of spec. (either overhauling or replacement--I don't recall which). Cost: $300,000.00. I count my blessings for smaller problems...

I have an aluminum prop spinner with barely noticeable damage to one part of the inner flange. It came off a 2004 Ovation (io-550g) It shines up nicely. If there's any interest or questions call me on my cell at 361-533-5000 or send me a text. New Cost is approx. $1250.00. I'll let it go for $625.00 (includes shipping). Any lower, and I might as well keep it as a spare or have it powder coated with a spiral design...

Attention Mooney shoppers: I was ran across an old copy of AOPA's Air Safety Foundation's "Safety Review" of Mooney M20 Series, Models M20 through M20M. It's copyright 1995. It answers a bunch of questions commonly asked on MS regarding comparisons with other aircraft of similar type, detailed safety stats, training, accident reports, ad nauseum. You can probably pick one up for a lot less than renting a bunch of flight hours in various a/c.

I recall that video. Try these buzzwords on YouTube: Beach/low/highspeed/pass hopefully it doesn't drag up bunch of Beechcraft videos!

Well, this is where it gets tricky. The facts and...well, the law matter. And it depends on which state you live in as to whether private sector cost shifting is occurring on an a smaller and inadvertent level or on a larger scale. When you pretend to know that lifetime medical care for a specific injury is not realistic, you expose your ignorance in a large way. (Kind of like Newbie wanting to buy a Bonanza and a Mooney because he wants the 'best of both worlds.'), (Hold on everyone: this self-confessed diatribe will worm itself back to the OP--promise.) Texas Work Comp, like many other forms comp. including U.S. Longshore and Harborworker's Act, is a private policy, premium-paid insurance that has lifetime medical for the specific compensable injury. See Tex. Lab.Code Sec 408.021. It's realistic and it's worked since 1913. The Medicare Act (42 USC) was passed in 1964. Whether you agree with the basic premise or not is irrelevant at this point--sort of like if you still believe in "separate but equal." Nonetheless, pursuant to the Medicare Act, it was intended to remedy the fact that there were so many retirees of industry and the military that were falling between the cracks in middle to old age and certain employers failed to protect the retirement funds of their employees (Studebaker is the most famous example--it used the retirement funds of its employees to fund its loosing grip on the auto industry--then filed bankruptcy). Well, it took over a decade to get Congress to pass ERISA to directly address an employers fiduciary duties to its employees ("damn government regulation--stepping in and protecting people from dishonest employers!), but the need for Medicare was so obvious and the US healthy enough (not in a gigantic $$$$$$$ hole), that the bargains were struck, exchanges were made and it became law. In 1980, Ronald Reagan signed the Medicare Secondary Payer Act (42 USC 1395y). That law makes ALL other forms of insurance that "have or had" responsibility to pay for a particular service, the "primary payers." The penalty for failing to pay for an item or service within a reasonable time (120 days of presentment) is that the primary payer is subject to a claim by Medicare or an affected beneficiary for double damages plus penalty interest at the same rate as delinquent taxes...ouch! Well, if that damn liberal, Ronald Reagan said Medicare is vital to protect the interests and health of an aging population and shouldn't be burdened by cost-shifting private enterprise, who the hell am I to disagree? Becca raised an important and relevant point in her original post: the AOPA represents pilots. That's it. And when the organization that we all support tends to question spending on matters that affect one sector of the population without questioning large financial commitments in other areas, especially those areas that have huge contractual commitments with private industry, it smacks of special interest...shareholder concerns...conflict of interest. For example, why isn't military contractor spending the topic? Consider the question as phrased by another well known "liberal," Supreme Commander of the Joint Allied Forces, General turned President of the United States, Dwight D. Eisenhower: "The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without." Understand this: Becca's observation was started by a question. I don't know Becca and couldn't spot her in a line-up. But your response was an ad hominem attack and it was ugly, immature and unacceptable. In my line of work, I can typically endure a lot of confusion and heavy duty advocacy, but as one poster has already observed, you probably would never talk like that face to face with someone. And that's for good reason: most husband's would have a legal excuse for a spontaneous visceral but physical reaction to such words. In Texas, it's called the "fighting words doctrine." A gentleman learns early in life that "one can disagree without being disagreeable." Then again, my dad, Master Senior Chief, Michael Horne taught me, "Son, some people live and learn...others, just live."

Okay, I missed a lot of good stuff here.(I was drafting a 20 page motion for new trial that has 21 exhibits--this is WAY more fun). But let's get real: My next writing assignment is a Writ of Certiorari to the US Supreme Court that is on behalf of a gentleman who was injured on the job in Texas where Worker's Compensation Insurance companies promised, in exchange for the darling of the right wing "tort reform" that they would get "lifetime medical benefits". Guess what happens next? The comp carrier cut him off by hiring a doctor to say that his L5-S1 ruptured disc healed all by itself and his uninterrupted string of doctors visits would now become someone else's problem. Who's problem do you think they became? They became the tax payer's problem. Because of his work related injury, he can no longer work. He has sufficient credits to qualify for some measly income benefits (certainly not enough to have anything in common with anyone on this board). The tax payer is picking up the tab on Mr. Caldera and all those like him in Texas. Medicare paid over 50k for his surgery when the Insurance Company of the State of Pennsylvania turned their back on him. Bottom line: when you talk about where the money is being spent and why, realize that Mr. Caldera is one of tens of thousands of people in just in the state of Texas that can no longer work 3 years after their work-related injury. Want another fun fact? For 20 years Texas has had a super majority Republican government that has never met an insurance company it didn't love. Think I'm full of it? Fact check me: Google "Caldera v. The Insurance Company of the State of Pennsylvania." And "never bring a knife to a gun fight."

Does anyone else suspect 201er is a spambot gathering "innocent" information for "who knows?" Remember, you only have a "reasonable expectation of privacy..." And the definition of "reasonable" expands and contracts with context (and the balance on the SCOTUS). As for me, I only fly in IMC when I am proficient in every manner, I'm current, mentally and physically sharp, the plane is IFR current (don't forget the 30 day rqmt. on the VOR(s) and currency on the GPS databases) and all of my documentation is ready for a ramp check.

I'm one of those people that likes a political discussion but believes that organizations such as the AOPA, need to understand that its members are not automatically from the FAUX News crowd. As the founding member of the Radically Pragmatic Moderates (RPM), I often find myself in opposition to opinions entrenched in confirmational bias. Confirmational Bias, for those of you that still fly ROP--, is the opposite of the scientific method. It's interesting to me (I have a low threshold for excitement), that many pilots (typically above average in intelligence) adhere to what they perceive as "Conservative--ism." Also as intriguing, is the tenor of apparent disbelief that there would be fellow pilots that are critical thinkers; isn't it well understood, that as the pilot in command, that it is in our nature to have independent minds capable of making critical decisions regarding flight? Why not pick on Liberals here? Well, pilots are only liberal when it comes to additional fuel...and retracting flaps on roll out.

...you don't land a Mooney; you let it stop flying very close to the ground. Bounce happens when you try to force it to the ground prematurely. Too fast and you will float. Lots of flaps make you feel like the float lasts forever. In most cases, it actually results in a shorter roll. Whatever you do, don't get into the habit of messing with the flaps until you get clear of the runway.

PM Don Muncy or call Dugosh--get it from the guru's then confirm their sources--that's due diligence.

If there's anyone out there considering a 430 WAAS, I've used the 480 GNS and the 430 WAAS--the 480 is much more easy to use and provides Airway feed to PFD's, also has the NRST button on the panel that provides instant info on it, freq memory...gobs of features that are quicker to access than the tiered 430/530 architecture . Although IMO the price is a little high for ANYTHING that old...it's probably negotiable though.

Nice Plane! Great price! I would ask about the "?" marks on the entries, borescope the cylinders on a pre buy, and fly it with pride. Anybody looking for more of a reduction on this plane would have to ask Jimmy Garrison why the seller laughed in his face.

Uh...I thought we were referring to a human partner. I love my bird, but....

I have an Ovation--no, you can't. And I bought mine at auction; sight unseen.

Considering the perils of a probable shift if weight and balance along with the chance of getting "cross-controlled" and entering an inadvertent spin (the aircraft), I believe Mooniacs should increase their minimums: "2 mile high club."

I did the G500 mod in 2010. I have a 2004 Ovation2 (still being fixed--see: "expensive brain fart" thread). Anyways, I have the 530 and 430 in WAAS, the back-up "steam gauges" AI, IAS, and alt ind. mounted directly in primary sight (there's a Garmin YouTube video that demos the system in a Bravo--same configuration). The big advantage in this system is the AHRS box--remove the vacuum system--everything then becomes solid-state. The Bendix-King HSI is a great tool but when it need fixin' it gets pricey; I like making changes that increase reliability. (I don't like doing the math especially in a changing market: that requires economics/depreciation/calculus...). AHRS is hardwired to the main bus and can also reset in flight. Garmin has a training simulator for the G500/600 on its site. I trained for IFR with an excellent instructor and former MAC test pilot, Dylan Foley. During training we emphasized the "button-ology" of knowing how to immediately call up and set all variations of flight plans (even DME arcs), functions between the 530/430: GPS 1 and 2, VOR 1 and 2, ILS 1 and 2, etc. The training also involved "turning the glass off" and flying with only the back-up gauges. Dylan is a close friend of mine now and owner of KALI Aviation (Alice, Texas) I get recurrent training as often as I need. I believe all pilots are professionals--it's a mind set. But the most important thing I've learned from those that actually pay the bills by flying, is that they get recurrent training constantly. This applies to glass or steam.

...'Newbie, most Mooniacs weren't born that way--we started off just like you: looking for the best plane to fit our mission and we did the same objective analysis before sinking hard-earned money into the initial investment. I bought a 78J model before I soloed--great plane. At one time, I thought I'd build one...then my wife asked me a critical question (that is actually the definition of "wife"--one who asks questions to which you don't necessarily like the answer): "do you want to spend time building or flying?" Damn! Well, shop well, and realize that with ALL planes in an aging fleet, there are quantum leaps in comfort, speed and capability. I now fly a 2004 Ovation 2 with substantial upgrades--I like the plane... Mooneys will always lead the pack in all single engine categories and safety--even without a parachute. That is an objectively verifiable statement of fact.

I finally read everything else on the internet and made to the end...this is it. whew!

My recent research on the cost of a rebuild is between 26K and 46K. I suspect the low end to be too low and you'll end up with more costs that get tacked on. The high end is from Victor Aircraft and includes everything including a 10 year warranty (the first 5 years parts and labor-then pro-rated after that), with no surprises.( I went with Victor. In my former life (prior to law), I was a laser lab analyst in a materials testing lab, so Victor's testing, treating and balancing brochure made sense to me). The typical cost is closer to 38K--without the labor of R/R. If I was selling a run-out, I'd discount the plane by 50k to keep it from just sitting

I went from a '78J model to a '04R (Ovation2). I still think that J model (210YG) is the fastest cruise (165kts) J model out there...But, if I pull the power back a bit in the Ovation, it will see the gas burn numbers at very close to the same speed as the J model. Err...uhh... that's not why you upgrade. I keep it between 7500ft and 10,500ft most of the time and cruise at 182-185 30* ROP. (After the Victor Engine rebuild break in period, I'll go LOP--different thread...) Anyways, I was convinced to upgrade by riding in a friends '94 ovation and noticing the huge difference in the smoothness of the engines. Then I looked at the market for J models and the Ovations and what I could get by an upgrade. The "little things" add up: redundancy,newer standard avionics, redundancy oxygen, redundancy, shoulder belts, speed brakes, redundancy, back up electrical system, better interior and exterior lighting, newer paint, newer interior, newer wiring harness--redundancy. If you're one of those people that like to keep improving your plane by making upgrades, look at the cost efficiency of just getting a newer plane. If you're one of those people that gets more thrill from flying a more basic plane and doing so at the least cost, recognize that and shop wisely; planes are luxuries--choose your favorite logical construct and then, if you dare, try to convince the rest of us that you're making the right decision. Some will agree and some won't...

Im a big KSAT fan. We fly there often for Spurs games. Landmark is very attentive, friendly and professional they also know how to move a Mooney without being told.(They know how to move a gear-up Mooney too--but try to avoid that). If cheap gas is the concern, stop at Beeville and tank up then top off at KSAT or buy something from them. KSAT is close to everything, on two main highways and I've never been rushed by heavy traffic nor made to feel like the Mooney is less important than the big metal. You might even see one of the Spurs as they use Landmark to come and go on road trips.

Thanks! That's helpful. You get what you pay for.

I vote Napa. Nice facility. Nice people. Nice place.

I need a Pirep on Custom Airmotive in OK. My adjuster just forwarded a quote on a T&I for my 550G (See "Expensive Branfart thread). The quote was 1/2 that of two other shops of with good reputations. Hmm...

Thanks to this site and those of you who have shared your thoughts and condolences. But I work for people who are seriously injured or who have lost loved ones; this was just property damage and, yes, an injured pride that up to this point could silently say, "poor other pilot, shouldv'e thought that one over." Nonetheless, I think the process of discussing this will save some claims in the future that may have occurred. If an accident or two can be prevented--we'll never know--then the real value of this site is worth supporting with whatever small price to pay in order to keep it a high quality operation. I know I learn a lot from other pilots. I wish I had learned this one thing faster, but...