podair

I can't find info on this additional little display for the JPI, do you have a link or name if it is not made by JPI?

whats the rpm oat display above the Aspen?

Good question, they maybe another gyro in the indicator, but I believe not but may be wrong. It is similar to the kcs55a/ki525 setup, ie hsi indicator, remote gyro in avionics bay, and flux gate in wing. Only the Century one has an integral gyro? Anyway, there is bound to be some adjustment needed but I am hoping it is easily done for all the instruments.

Great interior as well Don. Re the tilt: at present my AI and HSI are on the top 'original' row of instruments, the TC on the bottom slanted one. I guess the HSI does not have a gyro built in, so no need to adjust the tilt on that? Can one keep and just have the AI and TC recalibrated? Will both be re-adjusted?

another thing... to the right of the autopilot, the STEC control box, I have two little switches. Autopilot Test and Nav1/Nav2. The switching box that is behind that is huuuge. Anyone know of a more compact unit? I don't really need the nav1/nav2 switch but obviously need the A/P test.

lovely M20E Scott! love the paint , new paint/windshield is next year's project and I m debating whether to keep a classic scheme or not. I do think the key upgrade is the sloped m20j windshield, gives a much sleeker look. The panel lights look very cool too, are these Nulites or UMA? Any issues with the installation?

oh that thing is just me just playing with the Xpanel. I wanted some kind of altitude / clearance nag, I currently use my ADF's RBI (which is frankly all I use the darn thing for anyway). The thing you see is the P2 Skybuddy, but for $300 maybe I ll just continue using the ADF! Sporty used to sell a cheapo plastic thing but it has been discontinued. https://www.p2inc.com/skybuddy.asp the one thing my M20F has which is not standard is another bracket on the copilot side to house the transponder and some more CBs. Not really an issue and quite handy.

I know this topic has been covered several times and I have been admiring some of the fantastic panels on this forum, read the various reports on the internet (Jonathan Paul etc). I am specifically looking for advice for the space available behind the panel due to the various structural tubes etc , as this will affect instrument placement and hence influence the design of the new panels themselves. I have been talking to Lyle Hendricks and his work is fantastic , so will most probably order the panels from him. So far I am aware of: - pilot side panel: little triangle just to the left of the yoke shaft, and yoke shaft itself that points upwards. This affects the length of what can be installed in close proximity of the yoke. - radio centre stack: structural V bar that limits how far up you can stack radios and how deep these are - copilot panel: same issue around the yoke and far right 3in instrument holes have limited depth. I already had to locate a Strikefinder below the RPM gauge as it is too deep to be installed where the factory MAP/FP gauge is (bottom right), which would have been my preferred solution as I wanted to have the RPM and MAP together but not possible. The Strikefinder replaced an old Narco Nav121. Anything else I should be aware of before finalising drawings? Looks like I will keep the copilot side broadly unchanged, just put a new overlay to look nicer. I might try to squeeze two 2 in holes around the yoke under the radio stack/former glovebox, but might only accept a very shallow instrument due to the yoke. At present I have the cigar lighter there and further to the right a JPI EDM 700 so plenty deep there on the right. Actually I don't think two will fit, so maybe leave that bit as it is. On the pilot side I will keep a pretty standard 8 x 3in holes plus a single 2in to the far left and space for the ignition switch (I am aware that the unit is actually quite large, coke can size? can I have that below and the 2in above it or should it be the other way round). I am unsure where to place my prehistoric Bendix HSI (IN831A). It is pretty much the same size (3in ATI) as the KI525A and requires 10in to the back approx. It looks like a lot of panels have managed to place an HSI to the left of the yoke, but I am actually thinking of having the six pack to the right , ie having all 6 standard instruments grouped to the right, so ASI/TC above the left of the yoke, so moving them one notch to the right , AI/HSI in the middle to the right of the yoke, ALT/VSI on the far right , and the two extra 3in holes used to the far left rather than the far right, for an ADF indicator (I have to have it in Europe) and an electric AI (so these will be to the left of the ASI and TC). Does that make sense? Any objections? My TC is the STEC40 TC unit and needs about 5in behind the panel. Alternatively I could do like everyone else and have the HSI to the left of the yoke but that's actually less in my direct field of vision and further away from the GPS where I always cross check track vs heading (at present my HSI is in the top far right corner!). Any suggestions or tips welcome. Current photos of the panel attached. The audio panel is going to be replaced by a combo PS Engineering intercom/panel unit and placed on the copilot stack. So basically what I am trying to sketch out above compared to the current layout is put the HSI where the TC is now, AI above it, and move ASI a bit more to the right (but slightly left of the yoke) with TC below it, and another 3in column to the left of that, so roughly where the current ALT sits (so a little to the right of that, and a 2in hole to the left of that). Also, in the not too distant future, I'd like to add an Aspen. Anything to be aware of so I don't have to re-order a panel? edited to add: a picture is worth a thousand words... a rough sketch using XPanel, great software (cheeky screenshot as demo mode can't save).

http://www.approachfaststack.com/ What do of the avionics gurus here think of it? Seems a pretty neat way of rationalising the rats’ nest of wires behind the panel, and also simplifies additional upgrades. I am planning a panel redo at some point, and so far I’ve always been told do everything in one go, but can’t afford to do my xmas shopping in one go. This system seems to enable a more gradual approach, making additional upgrades easier. The few people who have used this system on Beechtalk and other forums rave about it.

Hi, I have a pretty stock 1967 M20F with 3 blade hartzell. I consistently get 143/144ktas at 9500-11000ft density altitudes, about 15deg LOP , working out 32 litres an hour (8.5 us gal). I use the e6b function on my gps on every flight once in cruise, and been flying the same routes/settings/altitudes over the last six years. That's 2500rpm and about 21.5in map with ram air, wot A knot or two a bit lower with a litre or two more, a couple knots and a litre or so less higher up. It is so consistent that a few weeks I was getting sub 140 at those settings, turned out the retractable step no longer retracted, the vacuum tube had disconnected! Setting 47 (map+rpm) and 32 litres (so 65%) seems to be the best compromise at all altitudes. So at 3k/4k feet I tend to set 2350/23.5 , and 2500/22 higher up etc At all altitudes, I find if I try to go faster than 145/150mph IAS I really need to pour fuel and rpm, and it is not worth it. Even lower down, I need 25/25 to get to 160-165mph and 10gph. Hoping to install a sloped windshield and powerflow exhaust in the future, maybe I ll eke out another 5kt. Seems like I hit a drag barrier at 145mph ias. Although it seems my 1967 M20F is not that bad for a stock airframe, I am nowhere near the figures in the 1967 poh. However, I also looked at the figures quoted in an early 70s M20F and they are lower and more accurate, pretty close to what I get! That's Sixties marketing for you!

Ha! Olivier! I am in Quimper every weekend in July/early August (that's where the in-laws live), let me know next time!

not a planned European Mooniac meeting , but an impromptu one: the only GA aircraft parked on the apron at LFRQ (Quimper, Britanny, western France) three weeks ago were : my Danish reg M20F, a French M20E and M20K, and an OE M20J ! The E and K are regular vistors (link to similar pic 5 years ago), I often see them parked next to me on weekends in July , but have yet to meet the pilots unfortunately... The nicely modified E happens to be maintained by my mechanic as well, and my M20F and it were in the same hangar for a routine check the week later in La Rochelle, over 200 miles away! http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/image/35848-mooneys-lfrq/ http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/image/27912-three-different-mooneys-at-the-same-time-at-lfrq-completely-by-coincidence-ovation-arrived-shortly-after/

I don't think you need to worry too much , the mods won't add that much relative to where the yellow arc is on an M20F. the yellow arc on my 1967 starts at 175mph so waay above my normal cruise speeds. I did some training on an M20C and there the yellow arc was lower and you would routinely go into it in cruise. Mine is completely stock , except for a 3 blade Hartzell prop. I rarely achieve more than 145-150mph IAS, at my normal 65% power settings, but at my usual 9000-10000ft that is already routinely 142 to 145 kt TAS at 8gph, which is pretty good already and my optimum altitude. If I really push it, I can sometimes get 155mph at lower altitudes but 10gph or so. I doubt the mods achieve more than 10mph, maybe 15 max which would theoretically put you in M20J territory at 150-160ktas. I am thinking at some point of putting a M20J windshield mod, and maybe a Powerflow, but I expect no more than 10mph out of both, combined. Maybe more if I put the LoPresti cowl, but not worth the expense. Looks cool though. The cowl closure seems to help with CHTs , not really an issue with mine but might do it regardless.

works nicely on a 200hp Mooney with fuel flow in litres: double the flow = % HP ah the metric system... royal cheese :-)

Joel Patault Fly West Aerodrome de Fontenay le Comte (LFFK) fly-west-loisirs@orange.fr tel +33-6-0827-3463

Hi ! I can only speak very highly of Joel Patault at Fly West in Fontenay le Comte (LFFK) near La Rochelle is an excellent mechanic and is looking after a growing fleet of Mooneys from all across France. His number is 06-0827-3463. He has been looking after my Mooney for several years now and prior to that my Robin. He has built a large brand new hangar for his outfit and has a stellar reputation. I can also vouch for Aerotech in Coventry, Falcon at Biggin Hill and Shipping & Airlines there too, all experienced with Mooneys. Avionics-wise I have been very happy with work from RGV in Gloucester and Aerodima in Nangis LFAI near Paris. For parts we usually call LASAR or Aircraft Spruce directly in the US. LASAR offered exceptional service the rare times I needed parts.

Hello all and thanks to Mooneyspace for setting up this forum. I fly a 1967 Mooney M20F, mostly between Thruxton (EGHO) and western France (Britanny and Dordogne) to visit family and our house there. I have a British PPL/IR, am half Irish/ half German, grew up in France, and my Mooney is Danish registered... I've owned it for seven years now, prior to that I flew a Robin DR360, and before that a share in a Piper Comanche.

Re bringing an avionics specialist over: very interesting idea, especially if we group a bunch of aircraft together. I'd happily provide a hangar and accomodation in SW France (and wine!) if you know of anyone in the US happy to fly over. The trick afterwards is to work out the paperwork. I guess for N reg that would be fine, mine is EASA reg but the work I am thinking of having done (old panel to 6pack and a couple new radios) I can probably find someone to sign off. The other hiccup might be for things like new Garmin GPS/Coms like the GTN where only Garmin approved installers can buy it. I am not sure the cost saving is going to be substantial unless you find someone who actually is an approved avionics installer in the US and wants a paid holiday in Europe in autumn. You'll need someone with Mooney experience to be happy to work on our cramped panels. In addition, you'd need to pay VAT on the kit and the work to be perfectly legit...

I in for the baggage one, I ve installed both from aircraft door seals and worked great, but baggage one half gone after lots of loading unloading.

There are a lot of pilots flying N reg aircraft with FAA licences in Europe. Especially IFR pilots as the European IR is a pain in the butt to get. However from next year you will be required to hold an equivalent European licence if you want to operate an N reg if you are based in Europe and hopefully the process to get the European IR will be easier too as well as conversion from the FAA IR. Anyway that's a huge topic on itself and a huge can of worms. Note that I am talking about the process to get the IR not the IR itself, as I don't view the FAA IFR as any easier (I have done both the EASA and FAA ratings), which is sometimes what you hear from the old aeroclub bar bore. Quite a few mechanics with FAA sign off privileges, but usually your local shop will have someone sign off their work who is FAA authorised. Same thing with instructors , quite a few FAA CFIs and CFIIs living here, and you can do your BFR and IPC on a European registration. Funny enough I just renewed my FAA ratings using my Danish registered Mooney over Coventry in England last month! A few medics can do the medical too. Actually the one I use can do EASA, FAA, South African, Australian and New Zealand ones!

Shipping & Airlines at Biggin used to be an MSC and know Mooneys inside out. Falcon at Biggin is great too and look after a few Mooneys. Aerotech in Coventry used to maintain my Mooney and also have a great reputation. I'd very happily use any of these shops again, anytime, and would definitely listen to Tony, Singh and Rob's advice (main mechanics at each of the above). My M20F is now maintained in France as it is nearer to my house there and I often hangar the Mooney there. I My current mechanic, Joel Patault at Fly West in Fontenay le Comte (LFFK), is excellent. French Mooney pilots fly their Mooneys to him from all over France and I've know him for over ten years. Otherwise, never heard anything bad about Troyes Aviation, the main European service centre, but have never needed to use them (I order parts directly from Lasar in the US), and I am sure there are some very competent shops in Germany given the number of Mooneys there.

1967 M20F Useful: 941bs Fuel capacity: 64gals useable (384lbs) FF Payload: 557bs NR Range: 980nm I have no idea why my empty weight is so high on my M20F, 816kg (1799lb). It is a perfectly stock 1967 M20F Executive , albeit with a 3 blade Hartzell prop and pretty well equipped in 1990s avionics (STEC ap , KNS80 , Garmin 155XL, Collins ADF). Anyway, suits me fine, I routinely fly from a 2000ft grass strip in summer with full tanks and bags, 2 adults 2 kids, no issues at all. Usual cruise is 33 litres per hour / 9000ft approx / 145kt TAS/ 2500rpm wot just tad lean of peak.

I might be interested too, but I have to check on the installation requirements on my European reg aircraft. I need to confirm it has been installed here in Europe. I spoke to ARI ages ago and they did tell me they sold a kit to Switzerland or Germany. Anyone know of it? There is another thing that is not quite clear however, do I need a new spinner? I have a Hartzell 3 blade on my M20F.

Indeed . My 178cm ones fit in my M20F (same cabin) easily, although across the rear seats obviously. They can stick out into the hat rack if needed. I think someone here once posted a pic of a ski tube in the rear fuselage, through the access panel, looked like a fabric sack that was suspended. Sorry can't answer any other questions, I'd love a 231 too! The one you posted looks great, especially the panel.