Hank

Quote: mooneyflyer Good story... and that's why it's SOP to add half of the gust factor to your approach speed. This is not Mooney-specific. This is SOP for pretty much all single engine aircraft in gusty conditions. I think you needed complex/High Performance CFI, but your example is not Mooney-specific. Still struggling with things a Mooney-specific CFI does that a good complex/High Perf CFI would not do. Phil

Quote: gmcd I took delivery of my new Mooney M20E today!!! So where do you guys store charts, plates, pens, flashlights, etc? I have the one pilot side pouch that holds a checklist, and maybe a few pens.... that's it. I suppose I could use the seat back pockets but would prefer something a bit easier. What about "mounting" a flashlight, etc? Any tips? Thanks!

Quote: Kenmcquillan I have a lot of data to sift through, and many of the answers were not what I expected, which is good because it will make the research much more interesting. When I am finished with the project, in about 3 weeks, I will post the survey results and final paper here. Ken

I think the whole thing is a paperwork and arithmatic exercise for the A&P. Remove everything, weigh it up and calculate the change in weight & CG. Our African friend has a requirement to put the plane on the scales every few years; over here, we don't do this, and some pilots are afraid to even think about it. So run some numbers and see what they turn up. It shouldn't be hard to find weights and arms for things like starters, DME units, ADF antennas, etc. The "savings" will depend upon what is installed, and what if anything has been cleaned up by previous owners. I still have the towel-rod ADF loop antenna on my tail because it will be lots of sheet-metal work covering up holes followed by a 3-color painting job to help hide it. But the wires are gone!

Quote: N9453V Hank, Thanks for the info. I skipped HTW since on long cross countries, I generally prefer airports with an ILS. Also, I looked at HTS, but we travel with our dog and the only decent hotel in Hawthorne that allows dogs wanted a $100 pet fee for a 1 night stay. The Holiday Inn in Charleston was much more reasonable and has a free shuttle from the airport. Didn't know about the AF museum in DAY, but may need to save it for another trip since this will be a quick turn. We need to be on the ground by 1630 EDT in CYLS to clear customs and that necessitates an 0500 CDT departure from BTR. -Andrew

Mike-- Do us all a favor and record your power settings, DA and airspeed for the rear CG flight. Maybe you can provide actual data for the light vs. heavy speed thread.

Quote: Parker_Woodruff

There IS something to be said for hot lead therapy in cases like this.

I need to redo the piece above the ceiling liner that distributes the air forward from the vent. Replacing the GPS antenna during WAAS upgrade broke it into many pieces, and airflow to the front seat suffers. But two knee vents and the huge influx below the throttle often has my wife under a blanket. More air would be nice when down low, though. Does anyone have a clear drawing of this plastic piece? The sketch in the Parts Manual is insufficient for making a new one.

Quote: rob Hank: I have a few issues with what you're saying. 1. IAS is important always, as a metric of how the plane is performing. You should be familiar with what your plane indicates in particular configurations- any deviation could be an indication of a problem. I'm not advocating keeping track down to individual knots, but you should have a general idea of where the needle rests under normal operating conditions. 2. You state that 162lbs is not much. At what point is the weight enough? That last .5 when you're flying into the wind starts 162 lbs ligher than your first .5. That's akin to one standard FAA person missing. It's over 6 percent of your gross weight. I'm no engineer, but I think we can agree that 6% is significant, can't we? If not, at what point is it significant?

For the OP, I've never noticed the difference in IAS because I've never looked for it; what matters to me is groundspeed, because that is fuel burned. IAS is only important in the pattern [always the same except on final where I adjust for weight], in turbulence and up/down drafts and mountain waves. I do admire it during descent, and am ready to level out and slow down if it's rough. Even WOT, I still manage to cruise in the green, and only get near the yellow in descent; to reach yellow, I need to be >500 fpm. She accelerates nicely with gravity! I have some upcoming trips whose weights will vary significantly. Now I'm going to have to remember to check airspeed on them! On my recent 4.4 hr. trip, I was watching groundspeed and counting time on my fingers vs. fuel in the tank. Still landed with >1 hour left. My legs are usually 3 hours or less, sometimes 3.5 into the wind, so I don't often see a significant weight change from fuel burn. [ 3 hr x 9 gph x 6 ppg = 162 lb, not much]

I've heard that Canada requires onboard survival equipment, and they may check for it at the border. Others can provide details. Yell when you come to CRW, it's a whopping 42 nm from here. Fuel may be less expensive at KHTW; if you need an approach, try KHTS to get down then cross the river (special) VFR. Coming into CRW for 23 is interesting, you will see where a few hilltops were removed for glideslope clearance; if you come in on 5, notice the runway extension hanging out beyond the ridgeline with lots of struts. DAY will be a nice stop, you can park close and tour the AF Museum [it's free] if you have time.

Quote: Fastbyk Just curious, but aren't the wing skins on the Ovation Bravo and Acclaim thicker?

Quote: allsmiles Hank, I said "less drag and thus lower speed required to maintain altitude." I'm not referring to acceleration. I specifically said non-accelerated flight! Would you agree that in a given configuration the speed of the airflow over the wing and AOA determine how much lift generated? And that an increase in either of these parameters will increase both drag and lift? Take two identical Mooneys. Load one heavy, leave one light. Fly beside each other at any reasonable altitude. The heavier aircraft will be at a higher AOA if they fly the same speed [increased AOA for increased lift]. If they both fly the same power settings, the heavier aircraft will be slower [higher AOA for increased lift creates more induced drag, slowing the heavy aircraft]. In any given configuration, altitude and power setting, the airflow over the wing and AOA determine the amount of lift generated, which will equal the aircraft weight in level, non-accelerated flight. The heavier aircraft generates more lift to offset its heavier weight by increasing its AOA. This also increases drag. At typical WOT power setting, the heavier aircraft is slower than the lighter weight aircraft at the same altitude. If the two aircraft maintain the same speed, then power settings and AOA are different, with the heavier aircraft having higher power settings and higher AOA. I don't think I can notice a ½º difference in AOA, but my plane will descend if I trim it level and lean forward in my seat. When flying at reduced power settings, as in the pattern, flaps enter the picture. Higher airspeed is maintained on final when heavy due to: 1) stall speed increases with weight due to increased lift required; 2) the heavy plane is at a higher AOA, closer to the stall AOA [typically ~18º for light GA], and higher speed lowers AOA. Flaps lower stall speed, modify AOA and increase drag so that you can descend without increasing speed and floating across the airport.

Quote: allsmiles Thank you Hank! So...Hank, in level unaccelerated flight what determines the amount of lift generated by the wing?

ATC always reminds me of the stadium TFR here when I'm coming home, but since they are not at my field I have to remember it before departure. But since my college days are decades behind and hundreds of nm away, I don't always keep up with when they are playing. I've been vectored around it to get in before, thankfully. Another good reason to use Flight Following and fly high--stadium TFRs are 3 nm, 3000' agl, and "one hour before until one hour after" the game. Good luck knowing which town below you has a college stadium with 30,000 seats and a home game before you pass overhead, much less when the game might end. IFR takes care of it, too. My previous comment about "self important" folks getting TFRs applies not just to the President, a man whose Office I respect whether I do the current officeholder or not, but to the various and sundry other politicos for whom TFRs are also created. Campaign season just makes it worse. At least where I live now, I no longer have to worry about the State Patrol shutting down the interstate during rush hour so a campaign can get back to the airport and head out to their next stop. But I expect several more of these in Columbus, OH this summer and fall, ranging from Pres to VP to Senators and opposition candidates for each position. More reasons to be thankful I no longer live there.

Quote: stevesm20b I don't think TFR's are a good idea. I mean, telling everyone in the world when and where the president is traveling can't be good. I think it would be a lot more secure if no one new when and where the president was going to show up someplace. Just like when President Bush showed up to visit the troops that one Thanksgiving.

Forward CG will require more trim, which increases drag and slows you some at any weight. Moving CG aft, within reason, will reduce the out-of-trim drag and let you go faster. I've never paid close enough attention to IAS on long flights to remember a difference, I usually spot-check it when making power/altitude changes and rarely record settings, temp, altitude and IAS for reference but not more than once per flight. I'll have to start watching for this.

Quote: allsmiles Mike, you are stating the obvious but I think the opposite is true. A heavier airplane must, by definition, have a higher AOA than a lighter one. It must fly faster in order to overcome the higher drag and maintain altitude. As it progressively sheds weight the AOA decreases. Less drag and thus lower speed required to maintain altitude. Wing loading and trim play major roles as Carusoam noted. What I've said assumes non-accelerated flight.

Quote: flyboy0681 Huh? Are you saying the president (Obama or otherwise) doesn't deserve protection if he's in a city for a fundraiser but should get it if he's there on official state business?

Three planes violated the Fund Raiser in Chief's idiotic TFR last week in Taxifornia. While it wasn't a TFR, and I was on an IFR flight plan, I had a Blackhawk follow me through R space charted to begin at 1500 agl but the briefer said it was "hot to the ground." Since it overlaid my destination, I went to the grass strip anyway. Overflew to eyeball the windsock, turned cross then downwind, and there's the 'Hawk, banking from behind me to circle out of the way. Turned base, final, landed, and back-taxiied to park, and there's my friendly 'Hawk, watching and hovering. Guess anything moving counts as practice, although I didn't give them much trouble ducking, dodging or jinking. All they had to do was ask, I was talking to the military controller . . . .

That depends entirely upon how much "hart" you have!

Quote: Wildhorsesracing I am in the process of an owner assisted annual. I am doing it to learn more about my new (to me) airplane. The shop where my plane is at is very busy and I know it would take 2-3 times as long if I didn't help out. I love the fact that I am getting very intimate with all of the working details of my M20C. I want to fully understand all of the subsystems of the plane in case I have any issues in the future.

Quote: N6719N Dreaming of how to own a Mooney, and trying to figure out how to not have to pay a CFI for a few very valuable hours of his/her time, and enjoy their associated liability, wisdom, experience, judgement, and skills. Does anybody else perceive a flaw in attitude or judgement here? Good grief!

I also use the "SAFETY" routine, but give boarding instructions on the ground prior to entry. "Step here, then here; walk only on the black, not the white. DO NOT lean on the door, lean on the plane." For the "Y" part, I've always used "Your Questions," anything they may want to ask about. At the end, I remind them not to talk during takeoff until I tell them it's OK, and to please point out any other planes they may see in the air.