Schllc

ok, here is the question we are all thinking!! How much!?

While I have no bravo time, I have a large amount of ovation and acclaim time. To say that they are basically the same plane below 10,000’ just is not accurate. They can be flown at near identical numbers if the acclaim is babied, and the 310hp ovation will absolutely outclimb the acclaim maybe to 2000’, but they are even at that point with the acclaim steadily pulling away. I also disagree that a turbo is useless below 12k. At 12k the ovation may squeak out 21” while the acclaim can produce 33”, or 30.5 at max cruise. This means better climb, and more speed. The acclaim can also be flown almost identical to an ovations fuel numbers, only burning slightly more at LOP or ROP, but having much more speed and climb available at any moment. The turbo is not necessary of course, but aviation is all about trade offs, and once you become accustomed to a turbo, you have a very hard time going back. Lastly, I have not found the maintenance to be a great deal more in the three that I have owned, and aside from more frequent oil changes, is well worth the expense. I know the bravo is not as fast as the acclaim, but would think it’s more like the acclaim than not. If speed is irrelevant, you ever won’t go anywhere near weather, and don’t live near mountains, you may never wish you had a turbo, but no matter what your mission, if you flew one for 100 hours and had to go back to NA, chances are you would be disappointed. Point being, a turbo provides options and advantages unavailable to a NA plane and anytime the airframes are the same and a turbo is the distinguishing difference, the turbo will outperform the NA in nearly every aspect. Almost all the people I have spoken to about turbos who rag on them have never owned one, and just gave second hand anecdotal hangar talk. Talk to someone who owns and knows how to fly a turbo, and you will hear the straight dope. They almost all love them!

That was an excellent synopsis of the process to check the rigging. as soon as mine is out of the paint shop I’m going to do the test. I have a great mechanic, but I would think that something like this would be best suited for someone who really understands these challenges, and let’s face it, most shops are not going to really spend the time it takes to fiddle with something as sensitive and nuanced as this. im not even sure the plane needs it, it’s just hard to believe that things a true and straight after 13 years of flying and service... that being said, I’m pretty green and somewhat ocd, and like to know that there is nothing wanting on my baby.

Im not sure if this question is phrased correctly, but my question is regard to all the (adjustable) items that affect drag and aerodynamics. As a plane lives it gets its dings, adjustments, paint, replacement parts etc. I have never seen any of my planes have a comprehensive check of all of these things; control surfaces, gear doors, door, baggage door, cowling etc. Not even sure what to request or who to go to. I know any A&P "can" do this, but I would prefer someone who takes their time and understands the purpose. I don't just want a lazy look at them and a log entry. Perhaps it isn't even worth the effort, the reason I am asking is that of the five longbody mooney's that I have owned with continentals, all of them have had different cruise, and max speeds. I would think this has to be, at least in part, the efficiency of how they are rigged?

Ive seen two g1000 bravos with ac, came very close to buying. it also had FIKI and the UL was 860 or so which I thought was pretty good for the equipment. That being said I realize it had a narrow appeal, for for a solo flyer or small couple, that is a very capable and comfortable airplane. I think the acclaim with the same equipment would be well under 800.

“The is an unique Mooney M20K with amazing performance. Was an upgraded Rocket” is it no longer a rocket?

40-50k will evaporate in weeks with attorneys involved. Not to mention the anxiety and stress and hassle. I’d give the shop an opportunity to fix the way I want and if they declined I’d probably just grit my teeth and go another route. Maybe after its done send the bill and see if they pony up something. Even if, big if, you prevail, you wont likely get attorneys fees, and will never recover the time and stress. it sucks, they were wrong, your being punished but such is life. I have been in this position more than once, fortunately not in the aviation world but its the same thing, don’t let emotion get in the way of good sense. You are right, winning will likely come at a cost that isn’t worth it. This sucks but I would have a local shop you trust do an IRAN and move on.

Varre phips and heaven will be on your route, it will get you through the corridor they want you to go. even if you file otherwise and get a clearance, they will amend it and send you there. Ideal is at least 8k

Anyone know what this mod costs, or if it’s even really available today? trying not to get into a debate about why this shouldn’t be done, just want to know what it costs to do if possible.

There may be a few nicer c’s out there, but not by much. https://www.trade-a-plane.com/search?category_level1=Single+Engine+Piston&make=MOONEY&model=M20C+MARK+21&listing_id=2390383&s-type=aircraft

I don’t believe that’s correct. Left is left in relation to controls. tanks are labels this way too. Why would it be a left tank and a right tire?

I would think it’s mostly a function of familiarity and proficiency. if I had been sitting behind a six back for 20 years and a glass panel for a month or two, and was forced into an emergency or even high workload situation, I would probably be a lot more comfortable with a six pack. I trained for my ppl with a six pack, no AP and no gps, in about 10 different planes and five different makes/models. A few weeks before my ppl checkride with a scant 48 hours, I bought my first Mooney, a g1000 ovation. 95% of my hours today are with a g1000, (about 85% of those in mooneys) I am definitely more comfortable with glass, and while I feel it provides more situational awareness, with less effort, I cannot say it is “better”, merely better for me. to each their own. I’ve read a lot of folks bashing the g1000, but have yet to meet one with 50+ hours behind one that has anything bad to say. it really is a marvelous piece of equipment, even with its warts.

Best thing to do is get in touch with the public side of the airport management, and ask them to let you know about sublets. Also, troll the pilots lounge and or the pilot shop at the airport you’d like to find a hangar. most of the airports in south florida have lots of seasonal residents and their hangars are open at least half the year, some are between planes for years and sublet so they don’t lose the hangar. im on the west coast of south florida, and we have the same problem, I found a temporary hangar almost immediately. while the hangar wait list ticked away for two years I bounced around, hangar, shade hangar, tie down... more inside than not for the majority of time. its imperfect, but beats the alternative of it being on the ramp. Being outside is hard on a plane, I walk by the tie downs a lot and all of those planes look pretty tired...

Lol, and density altitude?

Humidity?

Flight aware will track every flight of a plane that has adsb. If it’s filed, it will usually have a “filed” speed, and would show a route in the form of a white dashed line. if it’s a car flight it just shows a track. This is of course, assumes the planes owner hasn’t blocked the tail number. this flight looks like the pilot filed.

I’d go most anywhere within 250 miles of south florida. most things seem to be available around this neck of the woods.

Have him fly in both back to back. if he is a pilot there will be little selling required.

Somewhat aligns with what I was quoted for the engine. I rounded up for all the other, “while we are here’s”, as well as the unforeseen. Better to set an expectation that leaves room for pleasant surprises. But that’s just me, to each their own...

I have never had the pleasure of changing one, so I can’t say for sure, but from what I’ve been told it’s pretty close.

Stec has had this one three times. I’ve owned two planes with this autopilot and never had these kinds of issues. Something is causing the head and trim servo to go out, and replacing them buys time, but obviously doesn’t address the root of the problem.

Lots of people claim the ac’s don’t work well in the Mooney. I have owned four with ac and that hasnt been my experience at all. Two friends of mine with ac, that I have flown with, were not aware the vent was on while they were running the ac, which you won’t notice on the ground much, but once you’re moving it mixes outside air and the ac feels like it isn’t working. once I showed them this, they stopped complaining. the useful on 809BW is 840ish, which isn’t bad for both fiki and ac. It’s also about the UL of the ultra acclaim with one or the other. the autopilot in that one however, is a real problem child. Look at the logs... I suspect wire chaffing somewhere. Really no reason for that to be out as many times as it is in the logs, and ironically, as the plane sits today it’s out for repair again. She also had light hail damage on the ailerons. otherwise it was in very fair shape for its age. Only other consideration is the time on the engine. That’s 100k right around the corner...

The model I’m looking at is a gx model with g1000. It’s a 2005. it has the stec55. I think I read once there is only one Bravo out there with a gfc700. I’ve never seen one and I have a shopping addiction to long body mooneys, so it seems plausible. no waas either, but the upgrade isnt 40k nor is it hard to come by parts. I’ve done two, and anytime i look for the Gia63w’s I can find it them. They aren’t on the shelf at every avionics shop, but a little effort turns them up. I inspected it today in person. It’s a nice and clean plane. the stec has been out of the plane six times, including at this moment for head or trim motor servos. I didn’t have any issue with the two I owned, so not sure what that’s about. Very minor hail damage on the ailerons only, and it’s hard to see with the paint color. also one of the few planes that finish looked better in person than photos. It’s usually the other way around. one owner and hangar kept.

My experience with Monroy tanks was just get used to not really knowing exactly how much fuel you have unless you plan to fill them up the day before you leave and check the next morning. The poh has a supplement telling you how to interpret the wing gauges, and while I understand the methodology, it was still a bit unnerving to me at times. while I don’t want to make it sound like I had no idea how much, it was more of a suspicion that I was inaccurate. I’ve kept a fuel log since I started flying and have always documented what my totalizer said I burned vs what the plane took when I filled up, (until the Monroys, I always kept my tanks topped off). Three of my planes were usually within a gallon of calculated and actual. With the monroys I kind of gave up, and just started deducting 5 gallons from whatever I thought I had for planning purposes. That being said, it’s not a knock on the extended capacity, it’s just a fact you have to get acclimated to, and is a trade off for the additional range.

I just signed a contract on a Bravo. I’ve reviewed the logs thoroughly. 1500tt half the cylinders have been replaced, exhaust was removed and sent for repair at 1200 hours. Pretty good maintenance at factory and Maxwell except for the last few years. any bravo or tks specific issues I should be looking for or concerned about or look for? im pretty versed on “Mooney”, and normal aging airplane issues but have no experience with Bravo’s or Lycoming engines. All four I have owned have been continentals. any advice would be appreciated.