Any Mooney owners in Kansas City area willing to take up a passenger or a student?

[JB2000]

Hello Everyone--I am in the Kansas City area (West/KS side) and interested in Mooneys, but I have never flown in one.  Whenever I volunteer that I would like to get one someday, I receive a huge range of opinions on Mooneys, and it would be great if I could form my own opinion based on real-world experience. I am particularly interested in model years 1965 to mid-seventies (C, E, G, F -- J if I win the lottery).  I am hoping to find someone in the KC area with a Mooney along those lines and who wouldn't mind showing it off and maybe taking me up for a flight. 

Additionally, it would be even better if someone reading this happens to be a CFI with access to the kind of Mooney I described for dual instruction.  I will probably need 10 hours of dual in whatever I end up getting (according to my insurance), so I might as well start on the Mooney time if I have the opportunity.

Thanks for reading!

[toto]

I’m not sure whether he does instruction in his own plane, but @KLudwick is a Mooney owner and experienced CFI in Kansas City

 

[KLudwick]

Hey guys, sorry for the delay.  Just logged on for the first time in a bit.  I unfortunately do not give dual in my own airplane and have recently moved away from the KC area.  Need to update all of the Mooney instructor sites to reflect that.  Thanks, @toto, for the tag.  There's an E-model owner downtown that may be able to help, and I'm happy to connect you both if you DM me.  

[JB2000]

No worries, and thanks for the reply, @KLudwick.  I'll shoot you a DM.

[FlyboyKC]

I might be able to help you out. I have a 68 G model.

Also, Leavenworth Aviation has a M20e that you can do a checkout in as well. 

[Parker_Woodruff]

On 4/23/2024 at 6:20 PM, JB2000 said:

I will probably need 10 hours of dual in whatever I end up getting (according to my insurance), so I might as well start on the Mooney time if I have the opportunity.

It typically needs to be in the exact model you purchase, so just wait till you buy the plane and do the training in your particular plane.

[hubcap]

I am based at KLXT on the Missouri side. I live in Lees Summit. I will be happy to show you Myrtle. She is an M20K 231, 1982 model. That may be newer than you are looking for, but there is an F model that just moved to KLXT.

[Zippy_Bird]

7 hours ago, Parker_Woodruff said:

It typically needs to be in the exact model you purchase, so just wait till you buy the plane and do the training in your particular plane.

Agree with the above statement.  Did my training in my plane after purchase.  My thoughts are that regardless of insurance policy one should choose to do transition training in the insured airplane for optimal safety... especially if one is stepping-up from fixed gear and fixed prop.  An individual airplane's STCs, Avionics, and minor modifications all make a difference in the cockpit.  Every situation is different, but I'd give the training a hard gut-check.  It is a good idea to transition train in one airplane then jump into a different airplane for a fingers-crossed solo?  Maybe it is.  Maybe it is not.

For the insurance nerds I have a quick story.  When buying my plane the initial Avemco policy stated:

"Prior to solo, must receive not less than 10 hours dual flight instruction in the insured aircraft or one of the same make and model to include not less then 10 takeoffs and full-stop landings.  They must also obtain written approval from that Certificated Flight instructor who is current in make and model."

Standard stuff, but I found the "same make and model" language vague considering models across the years.  I reached out to Avemco and asked for clarification on "model" exactly.  I thought there would at least be a difference b/t the Lycoming's and the high performance Continentals but surprisingly NO.  For transition training purposes they see all M20s as the same.  Really?!?!

[JB2000]

Thanks for the replies, everyone.  I live in Shawnee, so a Mooney available for check-out in Leavenworth would be very interesting to me.  I typically fly out of IXD.  It seems that FLV and LXT would take me a little longer to get to but neither one is significantly closer than the other to me. And, @FlyboyKC, where are you located?  I have seen the occasional G model listed, and my understanding is that it would be pretty similar to an F model except for the carbureted/injected difference.  And, @hubcap thank you for offering.  If you are ever planning on swinging by IXD, let me know, but for now since I know that I am very unlikely to go with a K, I will probably keep looking to connect with someone with an earlier, non-turbo model. 

Regarding Insurance, I spoke with Avemco and can confirm that they view all the M20s that I discussed with them (c e & f) as the same plane.  Insurance aside, I am mostly motivated to know what the experience is in the typical Mooney c e g f whether my time is at the controls or purely as a passenger and without regard to whether the time spent counts towards anything (although that would be nice).  

Edited May 11, 2024 by JB2000
Fix tags

[toto]

2 hours ago, JB2000 said:

I typically fly out of IXD.

I’m at IXD and I’m a CFI, but I don’t do instruction in my Mooney. Sounds like you have some other promising leads on this thread though.

A rental E model in Leavenworth sounds like a gift. You could potentially rack up some hours in that aircraft while finding one to purchase, and your insurance company will be much happier

Might also be worth mentioning that most airports in the KC area have multi-year hangar waiting lists, so you may have a longish drive if you want a hangar. Even K34 has a multi year wait.

 

[JB2000]

15 minutes ago, toto said:

I’m at IXD and I’m a CFI, but I don’t do instruction in my Mooney. Sounds like you have some other promising leads on this thread though.

A rental E model in Leavenworth sounds like a gift. You could potentially rack up some hours in that aircraft while finding one to purchase, and your insurance company will be much happier

Might also be worth mentioning that most airports in the KC area have multi-year hangar waiting lists, so you may have a longish drive if you want a hangar. Even K34 has a multi year wait.

 

The hangar situation is on my radar.  I am not in a rush, so if I have to wait because of hangars, then I guess that will be that. 

[toto]

2 minutes ago, JB2000 said:

The hangar situation is on my radar.  I am not in a rush, so if I have to wait because of hangars, then I guess that will be that. 

My advice is to put yourself on the waiting lists. In Johnson County, it costs $100 for the wait list covering both airports, and the $100 is refundable if you ever want to be removed from the list. There’s no commitment required. 

[JB2000]

13 minutes ago, toto said:

My advice is to put yourself on the waiting lists. In Johnson County, it costs $100 for the wait list covering both airports, and the $100 is refundable if you ever want to be removed from the list. There’s no commitment required. 

Yea, I looked into that, and I was planning on getting on when I felt I was within 6 months of buying.  I thought I read somewhere a little while ago that someone got in a hangar in one of the major KC area airports in less than a year, but, it sounds like you have recent information on the wait times and that current wait times are in excess of one year.  

[toto]

20 minutes ago, JB2000 said:

Yea, I looked into that, and I was planning on getting on when I felt I was within 6 months of buying.  I thought I read somewhere a little while ago that someone got in a hangar in one of the major KC area airports in less than a year, but, it sounds like you have recent information on the wait times and that current wait times are in excess of one year.  

I don’t have any particularly good or recent information, just past experience. The JCAC is good about responding to questions, so you could certainly drop them an email and ask what their current wait time would be. I suspect it’s on the order of 2-3 years for “any” hangar (any size, any airport), but that’s a wild guess.

https://www.jocogov.org/department/airport-commission/t-hangars

[Z W]

7 hours ago, toto said:

My advice is to put yourself on the waiting lists. In Johnson County, it costs $100 for the wait list covering both airports, and the $100 is refundable if you ever want to be removed from the list. There’s no commitment required. 

This is why there's a "multi-year" wait list.  Most people on it have no plane or serious plan to get one and pass on the chance for a hangar when their turn comes up.  Don't be too deterred by the length of the list.  If you're serious about it, someone will find a way to provide your plane with a hangar and collect your rent.

[toto]

37 minutes ago, Z W said:

This is why there's a "multi-year" wait list.  Most people on it have no plane or serious plan to get one and pass on the chance for a hangar when their turn comes up.  Don't be too deterred by the length of the list.  If you're serious about it, someone will find a way to provide your plane with a hangar and collect your rent.

I’m not sure whether this comment was about the JoCo hangars specifically, but JCAC allows someone on the wait list to “pass” only once - if they aren’t ready to accept a hangar the second time their name comes up, they go to the bottom of the list.

If you want to park inside and you don’t have a private hangar, the best alternative imo is a group hangar. These are normally available, but may require a lot of phone calls or emails to various FBOs around town. There are positives and negatives to the group hangar experience, but it’s a reasonable gap filler while waiting on the list.

I wouldn’t let the lack of a hangar be a reason not to buy an airplane - it’s just something to have on your radar screen while you’re looking. 

[JB2000]

Interesting. I did not realize that group hangars were being made available for long-term rent in KC.  I suspected they might be, but my online searches had not revealed any public information on them.  Good to know that group hangars may be a backup solution in a pinch.  

[Pinecone]

21 hours ago, hubcap said:

I am based at KLXT on the Missouri side. I live in Lees Summit. I will be happy to show you Myrtle. She is an M20K 231, 1982 model. That may be newer than you are looking for, but there is an F model that just moved to KLXT.

And I may be in town in mid-June and show you my 252/Encore

[toto]

5 hours ago, JB2000 said:

Interesting. I did not realize that group hangars were being made available for long-term rent in KC.  I suspected they might be, but my online searches had not revealed any public information on them.  Good to know that group hangars may be a backup solution in a pinch.  

Yeah, every FBO handles their own group hangars in their own way, but they are definitely available - and often available on a month to month basis for as long as you like. 

[hubcap]

5 hours ago, Pinecone said:

And I may be in town in mid-June and show you my 252/Encore

Looking forward to seeing all that new glass!

[JB2000]

4 hours ago, toto said:

Yeah, every FBO handles their own group hangars in their own way, but they are definitely available - and often available on a month to month basis for as long as you like. 

Good to know!

[Pinecone]

17 hours ago, hubcap said:

Looking forward to seeing all that new glass!

I hope to get it there.  But will probably postpone the PPP.  Which one are you planning on doing?

[hubcap]

3 hours ago, Pinecone said:

I hope to get it there.  But will probably postpone the PPP.  Which one are you planning on doing?

I am going to Ft Worth in October with a buddy who just purchased an F model and he can’t make Owensboro since they rescheduled that event. 

[Pinecone]

OK, I will consider that one.  Or the VT one.

[FlyboyKC]

On 5/10/2024 at 6:05 PM, JB2000 said:

Thanks for the replies, everyone.  I live in Shawnee, so a Mooney available for check-out in Leavenworth would be very interesting to me.  I typically fly out of IXD.  It seems that FLV and LXT would take me a little longer to get to but neither one is significantly closer than the other to me. And, @FlyboyKC, where are you located?  I have seen the occasional G model listed, and my understanding is that it would be pretty similar to an F model except for the carbureted/injected difference.  And, @hubcap thank you for offering.  If you are ever planning on swinging by IXD, let me know, but for now since I know that I am very unlikely to go with a K, I will probably keep looking to connect with someone with an earlier, non-turbo model. 

Regarding Insurance, I spoke with Avemco and can confirm that they view all the M20s that I discussed with them (c e & f) as the same plane.  Insurance aside, I am mostly motivated to know what the experience is in the typical Mooney c e g f whether my time is at the controls or purely as a passenger and without regard to whether the time spent counts towards anything (although that would be nice).  

I am located at the Downtown Airport (MKC)