IO-360-A1A Cylinder Overhaul Cost

[TheAv8r]

Hey all,

Figured I'd run this against the Mooney hive mind... planning ahead for my annual in a few months where I know I'll need 1 cylinder OH/replaced and potentially another. I have an IO-360-A1A wide deck. Our plan is to do a full engine overhaul in the next 2-4 years pending engine health (right now looks great) so I planned to do a minimum OH on these 2 problematic cylinders and then get new ones when we do the OH. I called J&J Air Parts which has a great reputation, very friendly and easy over the phone, but they quoted me $1575 per cylinder for overhaul. I was a little stunned since new Superior cylinders are in the $1350-1600 range. I called Gibson out of Oklahoma, gave them all the stats on my engine and they said $525/cyl + rings and misc parts, usually ends up being around $750/cyl. J&J's website shows the most expensive IO-360 cylinder is $725. https://www.jjairparts.com/category/cylinder-lycoming-300series-io360-cylinder/io-360-cylinder 

What am I missing here? Why the huge delta between the 2 shops and why would OHing a cylinder be almost as much as buying a new one in this case? What is the average cost for an OH cylinder?

[Ragsf15e]

Typically angle valve cylinders are more expensive.  I want to say I paid $1800 to buy a first run OH last year for my A1A (my cylinder was chrome, flaking, and trash).  That being said, it depends on how much work they need to do to your cylinder to OH it.

Also, there are only Lycoming cylinders for an A1A, I don’t think you can get superior cylinders…

[TheAv8r]

2 hours ago, Ragsf15e said:

Typically angle valve cylinders are more expensive.  I want to say I paid $1800 to buy a first run OH last year for my A1A (my cylinder was chrome, flaking, and trash).  That being said, it depends on how much work they need to do to your cylinder to OH it.

Also, there are only Lycoming cylinders for an A1A, I don’t think you can get superior cylinders…

Thanks for the PIREP, that’s good to know! I bet Gibson didn’t know it was an angle valve. I’ve heard great things about J&J I was just taken aback by one company quoting 1/3 their rate and their website saying 1/2. 
 

Ah, I saw B1B and my mind thought it was A1A. On closer inspection you are correct. 

[N201MKTurbo]

If you only need a few hundred hours, go with the cheap shop. They are still regulated By the FAA. You are still getting your cylinder cleaned, inspected honed and a valve job. Do you get anew piston? I would always get a new piston.

[TheAv8r]

56 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

If you only need a few hundred hours, go with the cheap shop. They are still regulated By the FAA. You are still getting your cylinder cleaned, inspected honed and a valve job. Do you get anew piston? I would always get a new piston.

Yes, they mentioned piston and rings would be included. I’m just wondering if the cheap shop is misquoting me… seemed odd to be so low. But agreed, no need to go all out. 

[N201MKTurbo]

10 minutes ago, Alex M said:

Yes, they mentioned piston and rings would be included. I’m just wondering if the cheap shop is misquoting me… seemed odd to be so low. But agreed, no need to go all out. 

Actually, I heard a similar number from the local shop, but it didn’t include parts. With parts they said $1000 ish.

[Prior owner]

The last time I talked to Gibson, they were no longer interested in performing repairs on cylinders…. The status of all cylinders that leave their shop is now “overhauled”.  Has something changed?

[jetdriven]

I wouldnt put a Gibson cylinder on my lawnmower. Send what you got to Poplar Grove and let them repair it

[TheAv8r]

13 hours ago, jetdriven said:

I wouldnt put a Gibson cylinder on my lawnmower. Send what you got to Poplar Grove and let them repair it

Do they have a bad rep? I'd heard good things about them from several sources. I'll give Poplar Grove a call and see what they say.

[Ragsf15e]

Western skyways is another option but it’s further west.

[Jsno]

I am overhauling my IO 360 right now.  I could not find cylinder kits so I bought Nickel cylinder studs fro J&J.  I then bought new pistons, springs and valves.  I believe ti all came in under what a cylinder kit would cost by $100.00.  I just have to install the valves.  The seats were already cut.  

Be careful of low ballers.  They will use used parts which are fine but never use used exhaust valves.  The Lycoming work harden over time and become brittle, then fail. Definitely not worth the risk.  Gibsons will use any new parts that you request.  So I would definitely insist on new exhaust valves.  This will add about 100 bucks to the price.  Also I am a firm believer in Nickel cylinders.

[jetdriven]

9 hours ago, Alex M said:

Do they have a bad rep? I'd heard good things about them from several sources. I'll give Poplar Grove a call and see what they say.

Which sources did you hear good things about? And how long have they run their cylinders? All I know is is that they put half-inch valve guides and 7/16 valves in the whole set of cylinders and then lied about it when we called then out on it a year later and like 5 hours. And then several years later, I have one Gibson cylinder on An M20 K that they didn’t even paint but they managed it to paint a flange orange but put no tape dots underneath of where the nuts go on the cylinder base that are sitting on top of paint which will relax later, And the cylinder nuts come loose. And it’s a channel chrome cylinder but it looks like total shit with five hours on it and it’s swallowing oil.  Tons of oil dripping off the tail tiedown ring, with lots of blow by.   Now I’ve got to tell the client that you know even though the jug has five hours ago it probably is going to have to come off sometime.