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or I think I am just going to pull up on the nose earlier than 60 knots - maybe 55 and lead the plane into the climb

201er - I flew at max gross for the first time this long weekend and I have had my plane for about 40 hours and was in for a surprise. The runway at my airport is a bit bumpy - so i normally maintain back pressure at around 60 knots - and I also do not use takeoff flaps because the runway is long enough and I dont like the pitch changes that take place when retracting flaps on this plane. Anyway, I was surprised at how flat of an attitude the mains lifted off the ground - then I tried to lift the nose and the stall horn started up - so I flew in a narrow band over the runway until I got a bit more speed and then went on my merry way. On the return trip I had takeoff flaps because the runway was a bit short (well not really - but 3000 feet). This time it took off just as quickly but tried to drop the nose on me this time. I am sure if I held the nose on the ground longer - the aircraft would be airborne on the nosewheel. Going to practise and see whats going on and head to Bridgeport to get some instruction from David (thanks tbrickey)!

before buying the mooney i was looking at lancairs seriously - have you looked at the ES? I remember going through the ntsb accident database for lancair ES and IVP and remember seeing mostly weather related accidents. The IVP might have landing accidents I think from the high approach speeds required but the ES has a low stall speed and is the same as a cessna columbia / lancair 350. I do remember a couple of lancair legacy stall spin accidents on approach from the ntsb databases. I am still inclined to believe its the pilots and not the planes

I am still experimenting with my technique - 40 hours on my mooney so far since Jan '11. I come in slightly hot at 80 knots and no power, aim at a point before the runway. At around 75 feet or less maybe (I think its less more like 50 feet), I reduce the sink rate and check the airspeed one last time - anything around 70 is good - otherwise its time to do something. If all is well - let the plane keep sinking without pulling on the yoke any more until in ground effect, then keep pulling back on the yoke and just wait - it lands like a charm. I think the Mooney is probably one of the easiest planes to land in ground effect despite all the horror stories about airspeed control. My smoothest landings have been in this plane Besides, I almost overshot a 3000 feet runway in a C152 with high enough airspeed - so I dont think its a problem unique to Mooneys. One might say I might have to modify my technique for really short runways - but I dont think there will ever be such a runway just because landing distance is prolly always smaller than required takeoff distance - so I will always land on a runway somewhat larger than the necessary landing distance required. In case of an emergency landing spot or something - i would ditch the roundout and just plop it down into ground effect and flare at the last second - and take whatever I get then.

some great suggestions - 93B runway is too small for me - rest look good. I think I like KTGI the best - love the sea and bicycles - awesome - thanks !

not really a mooney specific question - but I want to fly in to some nice airport that is close to a scenic area and stay there for a few days over this long weekend. Being in Massachusetts, I have already been to all the cape cod islands - so those are out. I was thinking bar harbor, maine (KBHB) - but I have been in that area by car before. Another one was Wiscasset, Maine (KIWI) near Boothbay, maine - that I havent been to - but dont know how scenic/good that place is. Any other place? Something scenic in Virginia or North Carolina - maybe? thanks in advance.

you'll find all the right power settings for your plane in no time or you should go experiment in VFR some day. Good luck with the training - it will be very rewarding Apart from the normal training make sure you know how to make quick descents or to scrub speed quickly - had a couple of times where I was told to keep my speed up on approach. Have your instructor give you such instructions on random approaches and see how you do at "abnormal" speeds and power settings - or have more than 1 ballpark approach power settings. Also forgot to lower the gear once on approach when the instructor overloaded me with "stuff" to do - even after I heard the gear warning horn !! (went missed and instructor knew about it - so was not a real issue) My gear warning horn sounds like a series of beeps - wish it shouted "stupid" or something - altho dont know if I would have paid attention to it even then.

shadrach - yeah i will need to do a high speed taxi test - but I am pretty suspicious that my brakes are not as good as they should be - e.g. on a short field take off my brakes dont hold as I reach full power. anyway its not that I am running out of runway - just that the stopping distance surprises me - I expect it to stop here and it goes and stops there - I thought txbyker was noticing the same thing - its could be because of the higher weight of the aircraft I now fly combined with maybe bad brakes. RJBrown - I agree with you - there seems to be no reason to not hold the nosewheel off - it doesnt brake - it gives a tiny amount of useless drag (induced drag and next t0 0 parasitic drag, compared to braking) - but I'll take it and it just plain feels bad when it goes over bumps at speed on my bumpy airport runway.

i guess over time i'll get used to the reduced deceleration so I'll know when to expect to stop.... or get my brakes bled and pads checked... i remember I used to be able to skid the tires with the brakes on the rental 172 (accidentally - when i stomped on them).

txbyker i am also new to mooneys and I think that the brakes are a bit weaker than 172s or it may just be my plane (recently flown 172 and arrows before buying this). I do maintain 90 on downwind/base, 80 on final, 70 over the fence and I take out the flaps once established on the roll-out. Gives me smooth landings and I dont care about the length of the roll out too much - but I also noticed the same thing you did - i will sail past some turn offs - and I dont feel too much of a deceleration with the brakes.

definitely not in IMC - when you are bored on a VFR day - and really I did this in a decathlon - on a mooney i think my arms and legs would give up before I did too many turns.

shadrach - i clearly had my falling leaf maneuver messed up in my mind - maybe its called some sort of roll. From what you describe - definitely not worth doing in IMC. But was just trying to point out that all you need is bank to lose lift and to lose it in a straight line you can bank left and right in VFR without rudder - and you dont need to take it to the extreme and stall a wing - because at that point you should spin - which is prohibited. i guess its more of an un-coordinated s-turn maneuver. and no - it does not relate to a 60 degree bank low AOA turn - but was just pointing out another way of descending without changing heading - i guess its a bit off-thread.

any amount of bank angle would work - just not as much as a 60 degree bank - you are basically dumping lift. a close cousin of this would be the falling leaf maneuver - bank left and bank right and repeat - maybe these were called dutch rolls by my aerobatics instructor - dont remember now - that will also give you an impressive rate of descent without changing your direction of flight. but again essentially you are not letting lift hold the plane up - you are losing it in a quick series of left and right banks - thus giving you an impressive rate of descent. This is not a good idea in IMC because it is not as stable as a continuous 60 degree bank. But fun to try on a VFR day with sufficient clearance from mother earth.

i am in the fill to 6 - wait till it drops to 5 camp. anything over about 6.5 gets thrown out. I bought mine recently - so dont have historical data but after about 34 hours I went through 3.5 quarts. I am using aeroshell 100w plus. sae 50 oil. Engine is at 1750 hours although cylinders were changed at 1000 hours by previous owner.

since the issue of slipping came up for short approaches, i thought I'd highlight this thread about not doing slips in 231's and later model mooneys http://mooneyspace.com/index.cfm?mainaction=posts&forumid=1&threadid=630

yeah degreasers into the hub would be a bad idea - thanks for the tips. still dont know what they mean by light oil - i guess i'll continue to coat it with light amounts of engine oil

how do you guys clean the prop? I washed and waxed the plane and left the propeller out because I am not supposed to get water into the hub etc - McCauley calls for cleaning it with light oil... what is light oil? I just rubbed a small amount of engine oil on it until it was all shiny Bodi

74657 - I am just thinking of repainting/powder coating my existing panel. I wont be changing the layout of any instruments/radios. I am going to wait until I upgrade avionics and re-layout the panel then - which wont be for a while. As for repainting - I am planning on doing it when my annual comes up in December. bgpilot1, alex and jlunseth - i checked out your albums and the panels looks as nice as I expected. Alex I especially like your exterior silver paint scheme - I always wanted painted one silver with red accents someday ..

any idea of price to powdercoat? maybe someone can PM me? nice pics Alex! I like the lighter color background just becuase the instruments seem to pop out at me - just my personal preference - I think secretly it makes me think I am in a later model mooney

My mooney has a panel that has a black background - but I like the looks of the off-white color background on the modern mooneys. Anyone re-paint their panel - any idea how much it can cost? Any shop recommendations? Is it possible to do the work on my own - with A&P supervision.. Thanks, Bodi

looks like people use 3/8 inch thick and 3/4th inch wide weather strips from MD. I cant find those even on MD's website. The closest they have is 5/16 inch thick and 5/8th inch wide. The thickness is close to 3/8ths - but its not quite as wide. I am wondering if the width makes much of a difference or whether I am okay with 5/8th inch width. 5/16 x 5/8 is 8mm thick and 16 mm wide - feel silly asking this but just thought I'd ask before I go and spend some time adding this to the Mooney.

I am a cheap pilot - I like free -so ADS-B/UAT is great for me instead of having dedicated traffic devices and weather subscriptions. I do not plan on relying on ADS-B at 2000 feet near thunderstroms and I do not plan on relying on XM for close-in avoidance like you might try with on-board radar. XM is for general area avoidance because of the delays in receiving data. So really both have limitations with the kind of flight you - and one is free.

i have also started putting in only 6 quarts of oil and no more. Anything over 6 quarts quickly gets thrown overboard across the belly by the engine. And the aircraft happily stays at 6 quarts until after about 5-6 hours of flying - when it goes to 5 quarts.

interesting - I only see 40F or 50F before engine startup for the CHT even after I have preheated for the whole night and outside temps are 20F (Reiff preheater system) - I dont have OAT or Oil Temp. I havent checked it in the summer though - because now I dont care. Although I'd better get the preheater checked out before fall/winter ..

so I know the concept of Va and higher the loading, the higher the Va with the max Va set at max gross weight. But you cant really keep going down to Va everytime there is turbulence - that would ruin the purpose of owning a Mooney that cruises at about 60 knots above Va I guess the defintion of Va says that below that speed, a full abrupt control deflection will stall the wing rather than exceed load limits - so it seems that above Va if you dont make full deflections you are okay? Thats why just turn off the autopilot when encountering turbulence above Va? I was interested in knowing what mooney drivers usually do - i think i get sharper bumps in this plane than others - mostly because I am flying much faster than the other planes I used to fly. Also the flap load limit of 0 negative Gs with flaps extended still worries me or is very hard for me to believe or is a mistake in my 1987 M20J POH.