Need help identifying part and purpose

[PT20J]

1 hour ago, shawnd said:

Thanks but I don't think its that easy. Here's an article that sheds more light and that the FAR isn't the most clear cut answer:

https://pilotinstitute.com/pilot-logbook-time/#what-counts-as-flight-time

FAA links I found for fun reading:

https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/agc/practice_areas/regulations/interpretations/data/interps/2016/Johnson-ALPA_2016_Legal_Interpretation.pdf

https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/agc/practice_areas/regulations/interpretations/Data/interps/2004/Kania_2004_Legal_Interpretation.pdf

I would interpret this as me as a pilot turning on the master switch to prepare for flight with the intention of going flying and landing is flight time :-) (ducks and hides)

 

You cannot just turn on the master -- you must also move the airplane. 

Most noncommercial pilots desire to maximize the flight time they can log because it affects currency and insurance and bragging rights. The airlines on the other hand desire to minimize what duty time counts as flight time because the FARs limit commercial pilot flight hours by day, month and year, and the airlines want to get as much work from their employees as possible. The FAA's interpretations are geared to preventing commercial operators from reducing flight time when the crews are actually engaged in flight duties even though the airplane may not be airborne.

As a private pilot, it doesn't really matter. What is more important is the definition of time in service. You can save a lot of money by keeping the total time recorded as low as legally possible and the best way to do this is to have a recording flight time meter rather than one that records the time the engine is running.

[Fly Boomer]

2 hours ago, PT20J said:

FAR Part 1 Definitions:

Flight time means pilot time that commences when an aircraft moves under its own power for the purpose of flight and ends when the aircraft comes to rest after landing.

Time in service, with respect to maintenance time records, means the time from the moment an aircraft leaves the surface of the earth until it touches it at the next point of landing.

Makes sense if that was written by the FAA:  Time In Service is really flight time, and Flight Time is really time in service.

[shawnd]

3 minutes ago, PT20J said:

You cannot just turn on the master -- you must also move the airplane. 

True - I meant that my intent to turn on the master was that I am going to move and go fly   Not logging time for mx etc.

3 minutes ago, PT20J said:

Most noncommercial pilots desire to maximize the flight time they can log because it affects currency and insurance and bragging rights. The airlines on the other hand desire to minimize what duty time counts as flight time because the FARs limit commercial pilot flight hours by day, month and year, and the airlines want to get as much work from their employees as possible. The FAA's interpretations are geared to preventing commercial operators from reducing flight time when the crews are actually engaged in flight duties even though the airplane may not be airborne.

Heh, most of the FAA interpretations are definitely targeting what you mention above, but I think its meant to support the well being of the airline pilots more than how the bottom line is impacted for the airliners.

6 minutes ago, PT20J said:

As a private pilot, it doesn't really matter. What is more important is the definition of time in service. You can save a lot of money by keeping the total time recorded as low as legally possible and the best way to do this is to have a recording flight time meter rather than one that records the time the engine is running.

For airframe and engine total time, I am using the Mooney provided Hobbs meter (based on oil pressure) which I assume is the widely accepted standard? Not flight time?

[PT20J]

2 hours ago, shawnd said:

If you are tracking actual flight time, i.e., take off to a full stop landing, where do you find this information being useful?

Maintenance records. It will save you money over time.

When I flew for a Part 135 operator, we had air Hobbs. That was what was used for maintenance. They had worked it out with the FAA to use that time plus 0.05 hr. per takeoff and landing for pilot flight time. It was a seaplane operation so we generally landed pretty close to where we docked.

Most airplanes have a recording tach for maintenance because that is easy to install. The Mooneys with B&D electric tachs had a meter that looks like a Hobbs but is really connected to the tach and calibrated 1:1 at 2500 rpm. Flight schools and rentals usually use a Hobbs meter connected to an oil pressure switch because that maximizes billable time. But they will invariably keep track of both "Hobbs" and "Tach" because they use the Hobbs for billing and the Tach for maintenance. When I installed my G3X, I set the hour meter to flight time. For a while, I also hand the engine time set (calibrated to 2500 rpm) and I noticed about a 8% difference. But, it depends on the ratio of ground time to flight time. I eventually eliminated the engine timer because it confused the mechanics.