OP ED-"Little Timmy Wants to Know Why Nobody Likes Airplanes Anymore?

[scottfromiowa]

If THAT leader wants to balance a budget by cutting across the board, I am down with that. If THAT leader wants to take and redistribute more of my money. NOPE.

Social programs...Don't care.

Look at the budget, there should be outrage at the money spent on "do gooder" items...Outrage? NOPE.

I will forfeit ALL my SS to stop having to fund it for last 10 years of my working life. Let me take my SS money with an employer match and invest it.

Old folks...you enjoy my 28 years of donations to ya. ENOUGH.

Kiddies...you take over supporting the "Greatest Generation"....Enjoy!

[rob]

I have. Looks to be imploding rapidly. Surprise, surprise if you don't tax businesses, they just pocket the money. The big business boom, with lots of new jobs doesn't seem to be happening. I think in part because it's Kansas. Not a lot of people really want to live there. Particularly if the infrastructure is going to crumble around them.

Really? So Koch Industries, Cessna, Beechcraft, Garmin, Spirit Aerospace, etc are just outliers?

[flyboy0681]

What leader would this be? We are now two rigidly divided camps with largely opposing views. If there is any deviation from the "values" of either camp, out comes the name calling and slander. We can't "come together" because there is very little anyone agrees on with regards to policy. There is no magical leader that is going to bridge that gap. The only thing that tends to unite us is going to war and that is very fleeting and non permanent.

 

The truth is, both the left and right are full of crap on some issues and correct on others, but neither is willing to see that, or concede that. The vast majority of Americans are moderate and in the middle, but because they have a distaste for politics, (Gee, I wonder why?) they are apolitical and don't get involved or vote. This is why a tiny, tiny minority of our population actually gets to decide what is to happen to us.

 

If there ever was a great leader that were to swoop in and change the course of the country, it would likely be a flip flopping, on the fence moderate that somehow energized the disengaged, non voting moderates to vote and take over.  Neither the Liberals or the Conservatives would be very happy with this outcome.

 

I think the two sides are closer to issues than many think, and have been in the past under previous administrations. I still contend that the GOP hated Obama so much from the start (my evidence of this was Mitch "Turtlepuss" McConnell's remark) that they started down the road of being uncooperative and it stuck.

 

In addition to that, the right seems to be greatly influenced by religious fanatics and once you pull religion into the mix, anything can and will happen. My evidence of this was Romney, when Governor he was pretty much a middle of the road Republican, but when he started rising in the polls he had to kiss up to the people that run the GOP, the religious right, and we all saw the result. He quickly changed his stance on long established beliefs in order to make it fit the mold of his new handlers.

[BorealOne]

It's a fair point, Dave.

 

US military spending is much higher as a % of GDP than any other Western nation, and as a percentage of government expenditure, much more (11.7%) than the 3.4% OECD average in 2011.

 

I understand there are many domestic reasons for high military expenditures in the US, not just national defense. 

 

While perhaps not the subscription service you have in mind, NATO was envisioned as as a mutual defense and protection alliance among the Western nations, and there is a 'pay to play' expectation among NATO allies. Each member is expected to contribute at least 2% of GDP to military expenditures within the alliance, which means that countries with larger economies are expected to spend more in actual dollar expenditures than countries with smaller economies. 

 

It's not worked out that way - the US continues to spend far more, while many other countries, including Canada, spend appreciably less than 2% GDP.

 

I think that this should change and that Canada and others should pull our weight within the alliance. But I doubt that >10% public expenditure on defense is necessary, even for the US. 

 

Here's a nice graphic showing expenditures by country/year within NATO:

 

http://blogs.cfr.org/davidson/2014/09/04/explainer-this-graph-shows-how-natos-military-capability-has-evolved-since-1949/

 

 

 

 

[flyboy0681]

If THAT leader wants to balance a budget by cutting across the board, I am down with that. If THAT leader wants to take and redistribute more of my money. NOPE.

Social programs...Don't care.

Look at the budget, there should be outrage at the money spent on "do gooder" items...Outrage? NOPE.

I will forfeit ALL my SS to stop having to fund it for last 10 years of my working life. Let me take my SS money with an employer match and invest it.

Old folks...you enjoy my 28 years of donations to ya. ENOUGH.

Kiddies...you take over supporting the "Greatest Generation"....Enjoy!

 

You should care about social programs. Imagine what the streets of this country would look like, crime wise, if what little some people do get from the government was taken away entirely.You don't have to look at what goes on in some countries where there is little law and order due to extreme poverty. Just look to some of our most crime ridden cities.

 

This whole notion of Obama redistributing the wealth is another myth. Give me evidence of this actually happening and I'll reconsider my position. And don't give me a canned response like "he takes money from the rich and gives it to the poor". Maybe in his writings and thinking Obama wanted to do that (which is open to interpretation), but in order to follow through he would need to get the legislation passed through both houses.

 

Old folks. You and I have battled this one out many times and I've come to the conclusion that you would have no problem forcing an 85 year old woman onto the street in order to save (the current SS contribution) 5% of your salary - which you will get back in its entirety when you start drawing (assuming you live long enough).

 

This feels like Groundhog day and Deja Vu all over again.

[BorealOne]

On tax cuts in Canada:

 

Most of the tax cuts have been for corporations, rather than individuals.

 

Government revenue in Canada is now highly skewed towards personal income taxes, accounting for 4 times the revenue that corporate income taxes do. The balance comes largely from federal sales taxes, which have been reduced by 2% - from 7% to 5% - but again, are paid primarily by individuals, rather than corporations, who can pass on the sales taxes to the end consumer.

 

The marginal rates for corporate taxes (combined federal/provincial) have been cut from 43% in 2000 to about 26% today, while personal income taxes have been largely constant. Where personal income tax relief has been delivered, it's been highly targeted - home purchase credits for first time buyers, education credits for students, sports credits for putting your kids in hockey, that kind of thing. 

 

Here's a handy infographic on personal taxation in Canada from our public broadcaster, the CBC:

 

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/taxes/tax-season-facts-and-figures-1.2504140

[flyboy0681]

On tax cuts in Canada:

 

Most of the tax cuts have been for corporations, rather than individuals.

 

Government revenue in Canada is now highly skewed towards personal income taxes, accounting for 4 times the revenue that corporate income taxes do. The balance comes largely from federal sales taxes, which have been reduced by 2% - from 7% to 5% - but again, are paid primarily by individuals, rather than corporations, who can pass on the sales taxes to the end consumer.

 

The marginal rates for corporate taxes (combined federal/provincial) have been cut from 43% in 2000 to about 26% today, while personal income taxes have been largely constant. Where personal income tax relief has been delivered, it's been highly targeted - home purchase credits for first time buyers, education credits for students, sports credits for putting your kids in hockey, that kind of thing. 

 

Here's a handy infographic on personal taxation in Canada from our public broadcaster, the CBC:

 

http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/taxes/tax-season-facts-and-figures-1.2504140

 

Oh, you are asking us to believe the government run broadcaster. They can't be trusted with the truth any more than CNN.

 

(I'm just preparing you for the usual responses).

[rob]

I think the two sides are closer to issues than many think, and have been in the past under previous administrations. I still contend that the GOP hated Obama so much from the start (my evidence of this was Mitch "Turtlepuss" McConnell's remark) that they started down the road of being uncooperative and it stuck.

In addition to that, the right seems to be greatly influenced by religious fanatics and once you pull religion into the mix, anything can and will happen. My evidence of this was Romney, when Governor he was pretty much a middle of the road Republican, but when he started rising in the polls he had to kiss up to the people that run the GOP, the religious right, and we all saw the result. He quickly changed his stance on long established beliefs in order to make it fit the mold of his new handlers.

McCain is also evidence of this. He was, by all measures, a Moderate Republican who lost the presidential nomination to Bush. He then "shifted" further right and was nominated. After losing, he has basically returned to his moderate views and is often ignored by his own party leadership.

[scottfromiowa]

[flyboy0681]

 

 

 

 

The two biggest unknown's from the past decade are 1) what would have been had we not invaded Iraq, and 2) what would have been had the stimulus package not been implemented.

 

I will be the first to admit that I don't know the answer to either one of these questions. However, any economist worth their salt has gone on record as saying that if the stimulus was not passed, the economy would have suffered a depression not seen since the likes of 1933. Many of these economists have studied that era and have concluded that the depression was deepened because the feds actually cut spending at the time. 

 

Until the time that an accurate computer modeling system comes along which can predict economic trends based upon input, we will never know. But I do know this, I'd rather have the economy in the condition that it is currently in than a repeat of the 1930's. Your opinion may differ.

[scottfromiowa]

Romney wanted to address the SS shortfalls by protecting ALL benefits for existing recipients and those over 55 years of age.

He wanted to stop the system from collapsing. NOTHING has been done.

We have a bunch of gutless leaders and recipients that vote for them.

%$& it...Just let it go as is until the money is gone.

What do I care?

[flyboy0681]

Romney wanted to address the SS shortfalls by protecting ALL benefits for existing recipients and those over 55 years of age. So did Al Gore in 2000

He wanted to stop the system from collapsing. NOTHING has been done. True 

We have a bunch of gutless leaders and recipients that vote for them. True squared.

%$& it...Just let it go as is until the money is gone.  It won't be gone, could always print more.

What do I care? Beats me.

[DaV8or]

Really? So Koch Industries, Cessna, Beechcraft, Garmin, Spirit Aerospace, etc are just outliers?

 

Those businesses were there before the "Brownback Experiment". The idea was to make such an attractive business climate by getting rid of business taxes and such that businesses would move to Kansas. From what I read, this is not happening. The businesses you mentioned took their tax breaks but failed to hire any new employees. I guess the Brownback folks claim the program just needs more time to really kick in, but it sounds like the state can't take much more it. I guess we'll see what happens, but it is interesting to see what actually does happen when there are no taxes collected.

[carusoam]

David,

I have missed the point of most of this thread. I'm probably not alone.

I see a much rosier picture.

Economy improving.

Employment improving.

Cost of living/gasoline declining.

Stock markets improving.

Strength of the dollar improving.

Stress in the Middle East declining

Ebola, as scary as it is, is a well known entity and is not secretly spreading amongst a silent community.

Y'all make the current president look brilliant. Not sure if that was your intention.

All of this is helpful to most.

The issues are incredibly complex. It has become clear to me that watching a single source of news on TV doesn't paint an accurate picture.

Watching the news in Europe then comparing to the news in the US was enlightening.

Still can't tell where the truth is. But you can tell how it is portrayed.

I appreciate you guys going into deep details and supporting your arguments. Especially the ones from outside the US.

I am wondering if you are in agreement with each other and don't know how to show it or if you all are practicing being mean to each other because you can.

It doesn't seem possible to change S from I's mind. What could you gain if you did?

One of the things that makes MS strong is the various backgrounds that people bring in.

SFI brings a strong background in safety and OSHA related issues. Tying him down here getting him thrown off isn't going to help me any.

Insulting each other doesn't make MS a place anyone wants to visit or share.

The internet is full of useless places where people insult each other like its high school. Would we want that here?

We are the only, open access, everyone is welcome to discuss Mooney related issues place on the web. Real life and death issues and how to avoid them in some cases are revealed, discussed and shared.

I haven't learned anything about the safety or dangers of flying a mooney from this thread. I've seen a safety expert with years of experience get tossed from the site.

I recognize adult behavior when I see it. It is truly missing here.

I wouldn't want the behavior of this thread to spread. The community has nothing to gain and everything to lose.

I hope that helps.

Best regards,

-a-

[rob]

You make it sound just a little like people are t responsible for their own actions on MS. No one gets someone else thrown out; anyone who's been thrown out more than once has done so on their very own. Quite an accomplishment, really. Little Timmy would be proud.

All involved in this thread did so willingly and all behaved as is their true demeanor. Thats important to remember. I would imagine that the way one carries themselves on a thread such as this would translate to piloting skill in a stressful situation. It's quite interesting to see the way that different members handle themselves, some so upset that they have to go take it out in the gym with others calmly stating their opinions or points of view.

[rob]

Hey Tattle Tale- FUCK YOU

.... My point exactly.

[scottfromiowa]

Mine too! Look common ground. Victory!

Bye bye...

[scottfromiowa]

Pavlovian

[Cyril Gibb]

Canada:

 

 17.7% employed by government vs 14.4% in USA.

 

Close to balanced budget (surplus expected in 2015) (-1.8 % deficit vs = -10% deficit in USA).

 

Government debt 83% of GDP vs 103% of GDP for USA.

 

No current information on health or education spending as % of government revenues [our current government doesn't really like statistics...]

 

Personal income tax rate of 29% vs 35% USA.

 

Public satisfaction with government 52% in Canada vs 35% in the USA.

 

sources: http://www.oecd.org/gov/GAAG2013_CFS_CAN.pdf

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/

 

There are always many other considerations when considering taxes...

Although the Federal govt reduced sales taxes from 7% to 5%, most provincial govts immediately bumped up their sales taxes to "fill the gap".

In Ontario (which doesn't have the highest sales tax rate) sales tax is 13%.  And that's on essentially everything including services, not just items.

Want your roof/car/whatever fixed? 13% tax

Want a haircut? 13% tax 

Want to buy a used plane/car/boat privately from an individual? 13% tax (by the way, that's not just once.... but each time the ownership is transferred)

... and to answer one potential question, the taxable value of a car is the HIGHER of the invoice amount or the blue book value

And in Canada, your mortgage is NOT tax deductible.... for most middle class people that's a biggy

 

I'm sure public health coverage will be added to the discussion.  In Canada, if you need an MRI, don't expect it today, or next week, maybe not even next month unless it's life threatening.

Example from current govt of Ontario cancer treatment stats: target time from referral to seeing a specialist: 2 weeks.  Target time from the specialist consultation to beginning treatment: 1 month more.  Unfortunately only 60%-70% of patients are handled within the target times.

 

I've often wondered, but don't have the time, to compare the real tax/health situation for a middle class Canadian vs. American

 

...the grass is always greener....

[flyboy0681]

 

 

I'm sure public health coverage will be added to the discussion.  In Canada, if you need an MRI, don't expect it today, or next week, maybe not even next month unless it's life threatening.

Example from current govt of Ontario cancer treatment stats: target time from referral to seeing a specialist: 2 weeks.  Target time from the specialist consultation to beginning treatment: 1 month more.  Unfortunately only 60%-70% of patients are handled within the target times.

 

I've often wondered, but don't have the time, to compare the real tax/health situation for a middle class Canadian vs. American

 

...the grass is always greener....

 

 

I'm sure public health coverage will be added to the discussion.  In Canada, if you need an MRI, don't expect it today, or next week, maybe not even next month unless it's life threatening. Life threatening is the keyword here, which means that a person can be taken in immediately if need be. Here in the U.S. some of those with coverage have to wait until the service is authorized. And in my case it was actually denied (I eventually negotiated with the practice to get a good price and paid for the MRI myself).

 

Example from current govt of Ontario cancer treatment stats: target time from referral to seeing a specialist: 2 weeks. When my wife was Dx with cancer it took her 2.5 weeks to get into a specialist, which was his first opening.

 

Target time from the specialist consultation to beginning treatment: 1 month more. My brother, who succomed to malignant melanoma, waited five weeks for his first treatment due to other obstacles (appointments, authorizations, etc). People are under the assumption that when a person gets the diagnosis that the gears start spinning quickly and you are in treatment within hours. For those that have not experienced the system, let me tell you, that is not the case.

 

Unfortunately only 60%-70% of patients are handled within the target times. Could very well be the same here.

 

I've often wondered, but don't have the time, to compare the real tax/health situation for a middle class Canadian vs. American. I'd be willing to bet that it's the same, or maybe American's get started slightly earlier, but for those that have coverage. For those that don't have coverage, well, you are on your own.

 

...the grass is always greener.... Amen brother.

[fantom]

 

Not a bad place to store this thread......

[DaV8or]

 

 

Not a bad place to store this thread......

 

 

Oooo... how seasonal. Nice tie in. I agree, little Timmy's passing is tragic and very sad, but we need to pull together and move forward as best we can.

 

RIP, poor Timmy...

[flyboy0681]

Oooo... how seasonal. Nice tie in. I agree, little Timmy's passing is tragic and very sad, but we need to pull together and move forward as best we can.

 

RIP, poor Timmy...

 

Thankfully he didn't pass on due to Ebola, which I hear is now rampant throughout the US.

 

Oddly, the only ones that didn't get infected are his family, which he lived in close proximity to and the healthcare staff that treated him in the ER. Maybe that's secret. Live with someone that's infected and maybe you won't get it! 

[flyboy0681]

I am going to believe what the healthcare experts say about the transferability of the virus instead of fear mongers and citizens that don't have a medical or biology degree. According to them, casual contact does not result in infection, and hasn't in the case of Duncan's family. To date, nobody that he had come in direct contact with him has been diagnosed and to me that speaks volumes. That doesn't mean that I would want to sit next to the nurse on the Frontier flight, but unless she popped a zit while at her seat and the passenger next to her wiped her hand through it and then went on to rub her eyes, I don't see any danger. However, if the virus mutates to the point where it could spread through the air, then we are all goners.

 

Additionally, it appears to me that for those who are infected, a viable treatment is available. It's no coincidence that Dr. Brantly and volunteer Nancy Writebol survived their bouts, and as of today Nina Pham is doing well as is NBC journalist Ashkoa Mukpo, all of whom received or are receiving the best care available. I suspect Amber Vinson will get through it as well. If all three leave the hospital alive, it appears that American's have a 100% survival rate when treated here.

 

Yes Scott, Atlanta - the same place where two infected people walked in on deaths door and walked out two weeks later under their own power after seemingly been saved by the staff at Emory University Hospital. Since they already took in two cases which did NOT result in additional infections, they must have better systems in place than that "other" place (even the infections are big in Texas?).

 

Scott, it's certainly your prerogative to not believe anything the scientific community has to say, but I think that would be foolish. And making up your own facts doesn't help either (how many "are" infected from the Frontier flight?). If we were to listen to you and your methods, it would set us back 125 years.

 

 

Nina Pham walked out of the hospital today,  a well woman - just as I said she would.

 

If you would listen to the science and remain calm and rational, you would see that its a treatable condition without the 60% mortality rate that it has in Africa, which is due to lack of facilities, equipment and specialists.

 

Oh, how many were infected from the Frontier flight, I haven't kept up with the news.

[John Pleisse]

Here's what you don't get Mike. Intellectuals and scientific know-it-alls can't predict, nor understand the human condition. People lie, evade, behave irrationally, etc. when faced with infectious disease and mortality. While we have a better health system here in America, we also, travel more publicly and intermingle in large urban centers. This is where scientific data ends and political thought begins. These people have been treated and survived because they enjoyed the luxury of flights on a Gulfstream 5 direct to elite medical centers. How quick will that last if we are overrun? Let me ask you, if the worst happens to our troops over there, will they receive the same care?

 

You strike me as smug and speaking way too soon. I hope nothing happens, but one can't argue the sad fact these virulent forms of African fever have never been on American soil. Now it has arrived and from a public policy stand point we did absolutely nothing to stop it. Science has shown fabulous incompetence in the handling of just a few cases, to the extent they had to devise new protocols. While every step of the way, they blamed underfunding, warmongering older protocols and the media. Everybody on this board knows the condition is treatable and how it is transmitted, few have confidence in our safety. My top clients (2 major cable news networks and TV affiliates in all of the top 5 media markets) are leading with the Ebola doctor in NYC, over a school shooting, etc. They don't seem to possess your overt "faculty lounge" type confidence. The greatest failure of leadership is vesting 100% in scientific expertise. I have 5 PHD's on my street who don't know how to start a lawn mower. It would behoove our fearless leader to perhaps scrutinize our public health with the same trepidation he does our military and world standing.

 

We are playing with fire.