cliffy

There may have been people attending but the industry was absent by maybe 30% in the hangars Tuesday was quiet as a morgue You could walk up to any booth and talk to someone without waiting your turn Even wed was easy at the booths Every attendee I talked with who had been going for years aid it was very slow T-W compared to previous years.

I went there and I talked to "them" (anyone remember the movie "THEM!") (BTW S n F was less than inspiring this year with many booths empty) Lots of airplanes showed up however to camp on the field. #1 Yes they really do look at what is being said here on MS #2 Maybe things are happening that they can't talk about right now but might be good news in the not too distant future? I, too, have looked long and hard at the "progress" being made and maybe I am willing to give it a little more time BUT, then again, I don't have any reasonable option but to wait it out. I'm just a frustrated as anyone else I was assured though that my 64 D model is/was included in the continuing course of final certification. So the early cambered aileron airplanes will be covered by the STC. I did pass along (to which they agreed) that there were probably 50 or more immediate Mooney orders out there the day of certification so they had better be ready for the orders. And that's the way it is- April 19th 2021 (to paraphrase Walter Cronkite )

Has anyone ever tried to make a paper copy by tracing the exterior of the boards and making their own? Granted maybe not EXACT copy but close enough for government work. One can interpolate to one degree.

Hasn't anyone ever run a tank dry and changed to the other one? Same scenario. Its done all the time

At this point you'd be doing well to find the CORRECT wiring diagram for you switch/starter system and trace out the wiring to make damn sure everything is wired correctly It may have been wired backwards for some time and you didn't notice it because it started. Its just detail wire tracing Get it right. One of the hardest things to teach new airline pilots is how to write up discrepancies (and how to do it so they keep their butt out of the sling) Many A&Ps have very limited wiring and electrical ability. I know a couple that won't go near wiring or electrical.

If its a bad switch you can have the contacts changed out for a lot less than a new switch

Just double check that you are pushing the key into the slot real hard as you turn it all the way to the right Have the A&P come sit with you and try it Maybe he will have another good idea

HUH? Well you got me buried about the second equation Remember I'm trig and a little more it was my neighbor who had the math PhD :-) I think I understand your thoughts on zero angle of attack but in the flying wing glider example the "0" or even negative angles were constrained to the out 1/3 IIRC to eliminate adverse yaw tendencies allowing no vertical surface or drag rudders The study I was following was limited to flying wings IIRC again

I'm more interested in when flying on a long X country and you get hungry how does one find an airport along the way with food near by? ay apps or such to have the wife peruse while airborne?

What do you use to find airports with restaurants on the field or with in walking distance of the airport? I can see "some" airports that have courtesy cars also on AOPA Directory but it seems spotty. Planning a long X country with no particular schedule so just wanting to find something while in flight to stop at for meals

His models flown with data recording show a trust vector fwd INSTEAD of a drag vector from adverse yaw. Granted no free lunch but it seems the "winglets" remove the adverse yaw and its intendant rudder drag. His theory is that one can have a flying wing without adverse yaw in roll. maybe one "drag" polar replaces another but no adverse yaw is a move fwd in aerodynamics. He uses a lot of observational studies from birds in his research (overlapping wings in formation cruise to get the correct length of the outboard "winglets" etc. I have read a lot of his studies Its very interesting stuff.

I think what he is promoting is using the higher washout to produce a vector FWD so as to eliminate adverse yaw (especially in a flying wing). His models have been instrumented for years and he has gathered data to indicate such an outcome. Eliminate the adverse yaw and tip drag panels are not needed (weight savings) and the entire tail is superfluous.

Here's some food for thought for any higher math guys or aero dynamic guys on Tip Vortices I found this fascinating Maybe a new paradigm for aviation For nearly a century Ludwig Prandtl’s lifting-line theory initially points to the elliptical spanload as the most efficient wing choice, and it has become the standard in aviation. Research in bird flight has increasingly generated data in disagreement with the elliptical spanload. In 1933 Prandtl published a little-known paper presenting a superior spanload. We argue this second spanload is the correct model for bird flight data and we present a unifying theory for superior efficiency and coordinated control in a single solution. Specifically, Prandtl’s second spanload offers the only solution to three aspects of bird flight: how birds are able to turn without a vertical tail; why bird formations have wingtips overlapped; and why narrow wingtips do not wingtip stall. The latest research data from a Fiber Optic Shape Sensing system and a pressure measurement data system were used on the wing, results are shown. For more information on the Prandtl Wing project, please visit https://www.nasa.gov/centers/armstron...

Being the OP here I'm going to throw some more meat on the aerodynamics fire in another thread as this one has been very fun and most informative New thread- More New Aerodynamics

For those who need a refresher? I saw this several years ago GREAT presentation

Or an old style Bensen gyrocopter :-)

Lose not thine airspeed- Lest the earth come up and smite Thee ! To paraphrase someone we know- We all fly through the same air

HUH ????????????? They're coming to take me away, away, they're coming to take me away. :-) Gotta put my brown shoes back on I guess.

Agree and understand the above with respect to how the Mooney tail and bungees work. Including the elevator counter weights being on different sides of the stabilizer (in cruise) on later models. Ingenious. My question deals with the change they made when they changed the throws AND then changed the amount of up elevator on the bungees at the same time (at the same stabilizer depression of 3 1/2 nose down)They cut 9 degrees out of the up mode. I'm wondering what they "found" that let them lessen the angle and still have enough authority. I'm wondering what changed aerodynamically to allow them to do that just by changing the throws. Down angle shouldn't have affected nose up requirement at least in my thinking. That force requirement should have remained the same??????? I guess a bigger question would be What governs how much bungee UP a certain model needs? As there are different settings in the TCDS. If the pitching moment of the airframe combination needs 19 degrees how can just changing the DOWN throw change that pitching moment?

Well we need more dylithium crystals to power our airplanes!!!! Mine are burnt out.

I'm in full agreement with your postulation. More down = better pitch out of a spin Again memory fuzzy that far back BUT now that your mention it - some of the fuzz is falling away. It didn't make much news even back then and I think it was portrayed as "it just barely meets spec" so a change was made. Bill Wheat also told he got caught in a 5 turn spin from which he almost didn't get out of and said he'd never do that again but I don't know what year airplane it was in. I'm still left to wonder about the change to the bungee spring angle and what that meant to the trim drag as Mooney put that on to lessen trim drag IIRC. What affect would increasing the down elevator angle have on bungee setting? I can't quite visualize that one. My areo engineering is self taught by reading dry texts but mostly by designing model aircraft and playing with tail moments, tail feather area percentages, some airfoil work, decalage angles (geometric rather than aerodynamic), nose moments, CG settings etc. Rather simple stuff that I could "visualize" the air flow and forces at lower speeds. Some of the "higher math" aero stuff is out of my venue :-) The mechanics I can easily follow.

Louie the Lip will meet you and guide you down the block to where the money transfer will take place. Louie gets nervous so he'll probably pat you down for weapons and wires

Meet me at the corner of Poplar and Henry tonight at midnight and we'll discus it :-)

It just went "BOOM" :-)

If you ran the engine even at idle speed you may have toasted your starter Think of the RPMs you drove it to while the engine was running. If you went above idle its even worse, Be very careful working on it with a stuck relay as the mags might also be hot if its the mag switch problem AND the prop can KILL!