INA201

Hey guys, sorry for being slow on updating and thanks for all your feedback. I went out Sunday and pulled the engine through per Yetti's suggestion and everything was nice and tight. Monday my mechanic pulled the nozzles to clean and did a flow test with little glass bottles. The #2 cylinder was only getting 1/2 the volume of fuel than the others. He sent the nozzles and the flow divider(spider) over to Airflow Performance based at our field KSPA http://www.airflowperformance.com/html/site_html.html. Don at Airflow did spray testing on the nozzles and said that the nozzles are shot, need replacing. He is also going to rebuild the flow divider which should be done and installed tomorrow. The mechanics were describing how this could result in the cylinders going cold based on the changing of the mixture when flow stops or is restricted in one area making it lean while the others are going rich. I didn't exactly get an explanation on what went wrong in the divider but hope to find out tomorrow afternoon. I tried finding an event like this one in different forums but couldn't find a similar situation as this one. The strange thing is that my EGTs, CHTs, and other engine data have always been relatively normal until this situation came about. Hopefully, tomorrow, we can solve this mystery.

Yetti, I will pull the prop through this afternoon and see. Brown and Antares, I've had the fuel selector rebuilt, and replaced the engine driven fuel pump recently. Should I have the gascolator, servo, and spider rebuilt if all of the testing leads to ignition issues? Is the fuel distribution an on condition or go ahead and do it regardless situation? $1200 seems pretty reasonable. I was thinking it would be 3AMUs all in. Was that recent from a local shop or did you send it off? Dual mags BTW. Carusoam, I've got a JPI700. The JPI and touching the cylinder has really helped confirm the weird cold cylinder situation. Mooniac15u, It does appear that fuel is getting to the cylinders based on the backfiring and visible flame when it's dark. I'll post my cold prop pull through later on today. Certainly hope to have more facts on Monday.

Yetti, certainly could be valves. I looked through the SB and my logs and no mention of the tests being performed. Looks like a test that should be done regardless of my current situation. I have had no morning sickness or signs of sticking valves to this point which leaves me still open to ignition and fuel as well.

Thank you guys for your input on this. The other three cylinders operate in what appears to be a normal fashion while only one is cold during each individual run up. Each mag R and L will continue to operate engine even when one cylinder goes cold. Engine time is 800+- on a 2003 rebuild. Mag has 955 total hours (2002)and 270 since 500 hour(2010). Fuel servo rebuilt in 1985. Haven't done an OHM check on wiring harness, yet, but will regardless of other findings. One of the Champions had 54,000 ohms(cylinder 3), others tested fine. New Tempests now though. Engine ran very well prior to this, great power, smooth, etc. No visual airflow or intake restrictions. Hopefully doing leak down check, flow test, clean injectors, and inspect spider Monday. The thing that makes me predict ignition is that it will start and run normally then one of the cylinders goes down once the engine warms up. Could the mag be rigged up some weird way? It is definitely a strange issue.

After an hour flight doing touch and goes, and flying around the Blue Ridge Mountains on a beautiful severe clear day the story begins. I was on my way south descending into my home airport pattern when the EGT and CHT on cylinder #1 slowly progressed downward to zero, followed by a rough engine, and an intensified "close in final", and ironically the best of the six landings for the day. Taxiing in, the #1 remained cold until shutdown. Oh well, exhaust valve? Mag? Induction? A friend and I pulled the plugs on #1 to inspect, put them back in, and ran the engine. Doing a mag check as well, everything appears appropriate and normal initially. Now #2's EGTs begin rising while the other cylinders #s appear normal and then the #2 goes cold, engine begins running rough, a little backfiring etc., so we shut her down. My friend is thinking I'm crazy and that it was cylinder #2 that went cold in the first place. I begin thinking, hmmm this is quite possible because after all I was under duress. We find a mechanic and do a hot compression test with 78, 76, 74, 80 as the result. We pull the valve cover on #2 and all looks well and good rotating through a few strokes. Pull the injector on #2 and it is clean. Put good plugs on #2 and its time to try again. Same result, the engine starts up, runs smooth for a bit, mags work separately, EGT on #2 rises and then goes to zero. There's some backfiring with noticeable flames coming out of the tailpipe(it's dark by now). I'm done for the day! A couple days later we inspect for induction leaks, install new Tempests all the way around(recommended as a possibility) and go for another run up. Wow, quick start up, numbers coming up evenly, mag checks looking good, leaning raises EGTs appropriately, and then........#4 goes cold. Roll the plane in for a bit and try again later. Now #4 doesn't even fire off. Also cold to the touch. At this point I'm back to confirming that #1 was down in the first place. Done again for the day! Has anyone heard of such? "Random cold cylinder disorder?" I've looked at troubleshooting and can't find anything that resembles this situation. Fuel pressure is good btw. We have not checked timing, leads, or the fuel injection system other than the nozzles yet. It acts like a mag, which this one on the 78'J is the dual. The mag issue is that the whole cylinder goes down. Different cylinders go cold with both left and right mag settings continuing to run the "Hot" cylinders. My mechanic wants to check the fuel system on Monday. I will update this thread when we know more. Happy New Year!

Thanks for your input guys! I really like the .00736AMU price at McMaster. I will give it a shot but may bang on the old one first to see if it holds.

Will do, hopefully I can get to it in a week or so.

Thanks Don, I will order it.

Anyone know where to find this gizmo? The one on my left flap just comes off and the spring shoots out. Thanks

Im looking for opinions as to replacing the fuel pressure sending unit that sends info to the factory fuel pressure gauge. The front of the gauge where it mounts to a fuel line wobbles a bit but no leaks and seems to read accurately. Is the wobble a concern or should I just keep on trucking? My concern was that it's mounted on the end of about 15" of fuel line coming out of the servo. Thank you for any and all input.

Will a flat knock them out?, Ouch.... They are factory new bought through Lasar and were $745.20 each. I'm impressed with the quality of these as well, looks like really good craftsmanship. Fortunately the mounting brackets etc. are already on the plane or that sets you back another few $$$. I did ask about the wheel well liners and Dan at Lasar said not to bother with them that it wasn't worth putting them on, so I went with their advice on that one.

Thanks Carusoam, wilco. Just received the gear doors. Should I get them painted prior to installing them?

I don't have much oil on the belly, few drops under the breather after it sits a while(silver dollar size), and exhaust pipe is clean and dry. I guess mine is just burning it up for the most part with a little coming out of the breather. Typically I fill to six quarts but haven't tried running any less to see if that would reduce the breather blow by any.

Just my opinion but I consider cold when the plane has been sitting for 24 hours or more. I'm burning roughly a quart every 5 hours or so in a 1978J.

I'm thinking that when the oil is hot it's thinner and less thickness on the stick so it appears more clear. When the oil is cold the oil on the stick is probably twice as thick appearing darker.

Steve, thanks for the response. Temperature when I flew was pretty high, 15.7c at 7500. Do you think my MP was only 22.3 because density altitude was so high that day at 9300 feet for that altitude? I had what I think are actual hourly fuel numbers because I ran that one tank for 30 minutes while at the altitude and settings above then filled up afterwords to check it. I guess I will do it again and dial in the JPI to make sure I'm at the correct ROP setting. Should fuel flow be less or more than 9.74 at 22.3 2500?

I don't have fuel flow but once leveled off I switched tanks, set the timer, and switched back after running the tests. I maintained the same settings while timing on the one tank. The fuel flow part i think is accurate but I'm not so sure about my leaning the engine. What are your thoughts Steve on the fuel flow? Thanks

I took Carusoam's advice and ran four ways today at 7500 feet. Density altitude was 9301, MP 22.3, 2500rpm, CHTs 380s except 400(cylinder 4), egt hottest 1391, somewhere in the 25-50 rich of peak range I think, fuel burn 9.74 per hour, and OAT was 15.6C. I haven't mastered the JPI-700 yet so please forgive my leaning. Average speed was 152.5 knots for this run today. I'm thinking the plane was set up for 65-66% power based on settings, fuel flow and interpolating the POH. I had to crack the cowl flaps a couple times to drop CHTs as well. Anyway, hopefully this is decent data for a preinnergear gear door installarama. If I need more data please let me know, oh well then. I'll have to go up again! Oh, I've developed this new skipping bouncing landing technique after 3 months of excellent landings since owning the plane too. Any thoughts or opinions are greatly appreciated......to be continued.

Carusoam, I did 4,000 to maintain agl under 3,000 feet so as not to have to follow the regs requiring odd 500s east and even 500s west altitudes. I didn't think you could just fly around all different headings over 3,000 agl in level flight. Wouldn't I have to change altitude for the different headings over 3,000 agl or are the vfr cruising altitudes just recommended? Oops thread drift maybe. Thanks

I did a four way GPS run @4000 pretty much standard temperature running 25 25 and got an average speed of 151knots without the inner gear doors. Fuel burn was 11.8 running 100 rich of peak. I ran on one tank for the test run an included turns in the timing to get the fuel flow. I'll run it again to see what I get not including the turns since fuel flow is already calculated. Planning to record CHTs EGTs OAT next round at 5000 running 25 25 and 100 rich of peak and see what happens. Any other advice to get good numbers? Hopefully the doors will be installed in January and we can see if there is some improvement. I'll go ahead and wash up the plane and belly some too prior to the next round. Man this is fun!

Was it the shops tug that hit it? +1 for new skin

I bought my plane with receipts for items that were installed but no logbook entry but it all matched up for the most part. Hypothetically, what if logbooks were destroyed and you did a thorough annual/prebuy and had everything up to date are you covered? Can you be legal starting from scratch?

Hanger King??

M20Doc, they are the aluminum doors. If your disks are a little worn but within specs can adjustments be made to make it fit tight? Thanks for the input I hadn't considered the disks in the equation.

Just an update from my end. I ordered the doors from Dan at Lasar and he recommended not buying the wheel well liners as they weren't all that effective according to him. Dan recommended having someone with Mooney experience install and adjust the gear/doors. He recommended Causey aviation in NC. Anyone have experience there? I'm based at KSPA so Causey would be convenient but if anyone thinks differently please let me know. My current A&P at KSPA is very good as well. Thanks again everyone for your experience and insight.