Hillndale

Here’s our bird with chipotle glaze just out of the pizza oven...hope all are having a fine Thanksgiving!

I’ve had a Brompton specifically bought to go with me in my Mooney. Fits through the cargo door without disassembling and doesn’t completely hog the rear cargo space. I’ve been using it for 10 years and it’s been great ground transportation.

I was cautioned about this when being checked out in my first Mooney and routinely check the backside of the tubes preflight whenever the plane has been towed. Sadly this routine was strongly reinforced when I found damage after towing by my local FBO about a year into ownership. No collapse and the FBO repaired the damage (without involving my insurance)...but I was grounded for 3 weeks. Over the past 20+ years since I continue to check and have added politely warning line men of the limited turn radius for Mooneys prior to letting them go for it.

Agree! I would rather have been taking a pic of a C172 with M20’s on the STC list on the tail!

It does a bit in that photo, but they had more Mooney’s than tarmac space could accommodate...there for various maintenance issues big & small. Being there in person definitely did not feel like a boneyard, it was quite busy and gave the feeling that the Mooney community is very much alive and well. The shop has a “get it done” no-nonsense aura to it. Definitely a pleasure to visit!

Sorry, looks like the pic of the tail got rotated during upload...a little challenged on knowledge of how to correct

Well there are more than a few dreamers out here. I’ve been waiting since before Trutrak was acquired by BK. The M20 STC seems to remain “a few months away”. I haven’t entirely given up. The STC may ultimately be more than vapor ware. I ran across the test platform while stopping in at Don Maxwell’s a while back to pick up parts...and took a few pics:

Raul A friend and I are restoring an M20G. I could scan in the POH if you’re still in need.

Not quite on target but has anyone heard follow up on Mooney’s new owner’s plan to pursue weight increase STC’s?

The Ovation is a sweet engine/airframe combination, but I wouldn’t say better or worse...just different. My brother has owned an Ovation for almost as long as I’ve had the Missile and we compare notes quite a bit. Cruise speeds are hard to compare directly because my brother runs his Ovation full out and ROP while my habit over the past 15 years or so is to run LOP. We see similar cruise speeds but I burn less fuel. To me, it’s not worth the extra 3 gph to see a 5 kt increase. The tight cowl issues seem to be just as problematic in both planes. I mentioned in an earlier post that my brother’s Ovation shared the same issue with heat damage to paint over the #6 cylinder cowl blister. But getting familiar with how best to operate the planes took care of recurrent issues for both of us early on in ownership. Brother’s Ovation has AC & it is nice, but he has more trouble keeping the engine cool in summer than I do with my Missile (but to be fair, his Ft Smith summers can run a little warmer than Louisville’s). If that were important to someone, I’m not sure how easily a Missile could be outfitted with it...so WIN Ovation. Likewise, TKS is more available to Ovations and would not be as easily added on a Missile. I used to think I wanted anti icing, but after pondering it for decades while flying, I’ve come to realize that the best “anti ice” equipment a Mooney pilot can have on board is what’s between the ears. The perfect “do it all” airplane is a illusion. The Ovation also wins in extra space for passengers, but my brother’s long body airplane is not as fast to get off the ground and doesn’t climb quite as quickly as the Missile. Admittedly, the Ovation is still a class above a 20J in performance. But looking at my flying through the years, I rarely have anyone in the back seat...90% of my flight time is solo with most of the remaining 10% with my wife or a friend. My brother has other airplanes in his stable that he flies more than the Ovation. He’s offered to sell me the Ovation at a very fair price that could have been covered by the sale of my Missile & 20J. But for me, and the kind of flying I’ve settled into over the years, I honestly favor the Missile over the Ovation.

Luckily, those are available

Found a better one to show more of the panel, and one of the Aspen taken at 11,000 ft level cruise TAS 185 kts

An interior shot of the Missile taken when I picked up my mom’s sister in Biloxi, and a shot of part of the panel... Sorry, not the greatest pic’s to show the plane (I’m usually taking photos for some other reason)...but gives you an idea. Oh and I noticed on the panel shots, the Aspens are showing TAS 183 kt at 13000...illustrating that the numbers in our threads are if anything, conservative. Ive got better interior panel shots, but these were readily available on my phone.

Here’s a spherical photo of the Missile outside at the Potomac airfield in Wash DC...looking for a better outside shot.

Here’s a couple of shots of my Mooney’s in their hangar. The one on top is my straight ‘78 20J, on bottom is my ‘95 Missile (positioning gives a strong clue to what I fly most!). I’ll rummage around my files for some inside photos of the Missile. Dale

Scott, I agree that the Missile could get by without air brakes (your recount proves the point) and I typically hold off deploying them most of the time. But I’ve been in situations where ATC has kept me high until the last minute, then requested I cross an intersection at an altitude that would have been tough to comply with if not for speed brakes. They do give options that make operations easier on the engine & airframe and also allow the pilot to take advantage of the Missile’s speed/altitude into later phases of a flight. An interesting digression is that I’ve always assumed all Missiles came with speed brakes and extended tanks (& other standard goodies) in addition to the engine/prop/gear upgrade that is at the heart of the STC. I’m finding I’ve been mistaken! Until recent years I’ve not had the time to investigate the question. I’ll see if I can pull some photos up & post for you.

The Rocket Engineering Rocket & Missile conversions have been around for a while. My Missile has been my main ride since coming into my possession ~2003. This thread to me has 2 main objectives: 1. Try to get a feel for how many Missiles & Rockets are still active in the Mooney fleet. 2. Share experience regarding maintaining these planes, particularly on aspects unique to the conversions. Additionally, this string might be a good resource for those considering new ownership of one of these on those rare occasions where they reappear on the market. So...any with experiences owning/maintaining one of these?

Thanks!

After your pointing out just how long ago you posted your original lead to this string had been, I thought it would be fun to address the original question directly. There aren’t as many Missiles coming up anymore to consider...but there are a few, hopefully this will help a 20C owner take one on. I’d be curious to know how many Missiles and Rockets are still healthy in the fleet and how many hours per year they’re being flown.

Well the thoughts above were 10-11 years late, but I accidentally managed to post it twice...makes up some for tardiness?

My “straight” M20J is a ‘78 with 64 gallon tanks, Aspen driven K150 autopilot, G430W. My Missile 20J is a ‘93 Rocket STC’ed in ‘95 with 92 gallon tanks, 2 Aspens driving a KFC200 autopilot, G530 & Avidyne 440 (recently replacing a G430W...very happy). Both planes have a mid-continent Lifesaver installed and no vacuum instruments, good engine monitors (including fuel flow) and Gami-jectors (I routinely cruise at LOP in both planes). Both planes fly very similarly once in the air with the exception that the Missile climbs better at all altitudes and gets off the runway faster. The straight 20J does not have air brakes (& doesn’t need them if flown appropriately)...the Missile has them and needs them. Both airframes are clean but the additional mass/momentum for the Missile translates into a little more attention when descending or flying into shorter fields. Both aircraft have similar useful loads but the Missile performs dramatically better when at max wt. The Missile is smoother despite the additional power. I don’t know how much of this is 3 vs 2 blade prop and how much is 6 vs 4 cyl engine. Both aircraft are prop balanced to similar tolerance numbers. Both planes are getting new 1/4” windshields this winter while COVID and weather has reduced flying. I’ll be curious to see if this brings noise levels closer. The J is more “efficient” in a miles per gallon sense in no wind conditions but that advantage shifts to the Missile with significant headwinds. The Missile will still be moving along at 130 kts with a 50 kt headwind (72% of still air speed) while the J drops to 100 kts (67% of still air speed). I’ve set my J down and waited for better winds, but haven’t with the Missile. For a fair comparison I’d have to fly both planes at the same airspeed and altitude and fuel/passenger load, adjust to LOP and see what the numbers are...something I haven’t done yet. But in the real world it’s not likely that many pilots would resist the temptation to go faster, making straight J efficiency in the Missile “theoretical”. I’ve had my right tank leak on the Missile (patched without requiring a total strip and reseal). I’ve never had a problem with my 15 year older J. After the leak was repaired my research and discussion suggests that landing with heavier loads (lots of fuel in extended tanks) and older, stiffer doughnuts can increase the risk of leaks. I don’t keep the tanks full all the time now (but it used to give great assurance knowing I could fly 6.8 hrs @ 175-180 kts before running dry!). The Missile requires more attention to head temps on climb out. I am very conservative on this and try to keep the temps south of 380 (never allow >400). But this is more of an issue on hot summer days and not an issue at all in other seasons. Even cruise climbing at 120 kts (for cooling) the Missile climbs at sea level through ~6000ft @ >500 fpm with 2 people and full fuel. There are no cowl flaps on the Missile but for the additional workload of managing the cowl flap settings, the J offers a little more control of cooling than just “go faster to stay cooler”. The J is a little easier to keep cool in hot weather. I think the cyl head “redline” is 450 (I’d have to go look at the gauge to be sure), but I wouldn’t feel comfortable with temps that high even briefly for take off. Maintenance has been similar. The airframe firewall back practically is the same. The Missile landing gear has been reinforced but the doughnuts are the same. The cont IO550A in the Missile has 2 more cylinders to care for and the prop has an extra blade...roughly speaking this might work out to an additional 50% expense firewall forward. Both the J & Missile are tightly cowled...the Missile slightly more so. I developed some heat damage to the paint on the cowl over the #6 (left forward) cylinder many years ago. When the cowl was repaired and heat shielding in the area was replaced, it chafed that cylinder head cover and had to be reworked. Interestingly, my brother had the same issue with his Ovation. The exhaust system on the Missile is designed and built by Rocket. I’ve had the exhaust system rebuilt once by them ~15 years ago and this year had the muffler repaired by another shop closer to home to address a deformed spark arrester cone. The exhaust system in the J has required no significant work. The engine mount for the Missile’s IO550A is well engineered and sturdy, but requires attention where the support tubes are near the exhaust as the heat is hard on the paint and if neglected, corrosion could become a significant problem. Through the years, I’ve stripped and painted the lower parts of the support twice (while in place). High heat paint holds up better, & careful attention to inspecting and maintaining the heat shielding pays off. Hot starts are more problematic with the Missile. I’m installing a Surefly electronic ignition this annual. One of the claimed improvements with EI is hot starting so we’ll see. Surefly doesn’t have a unit that works with the dual mag single drive system in the J’s io360. Overall they’re both wonderful airplanes. Mooney support has been good through the years despite they’re ownership ups and downs. Rocket engineering support has been consistently good as well...and I’ve only rarely needed it! Ive had both from coast to coast and into south eastern Canada but I do seem to fly the Missile a little more, particularly on longer trips. My general thoughts after flying my 2 Mooney’s for 25 years... Don’t be afraid to buy a Missile if you come across one in good shape for a fair price, you won’t regret it. My wife and I flew back from Barr Harbor to Louisville a few years ago skirting well north along the Great Lakes to stay out of a hurricane blowing up into Virginia and never had to worry about running out of time in the air despite the weather related extreme course deviations. If a J comes up that is in good shape at a fair price, you won’t regret that either. Extended tanks can make a J’s legs as long as a Missile. It might not climb as well with the additional weight, and won’t be quite as fast...it’s performance is still very respectable. And from what I’ve seen so far, the J’s seem a little better at holding their market value. When avgas goes back up this may be more true. Hope this is helpful.

My “straight” M20J is a ‘78 with 64 gallon tanks, Aspen driven K150 autopilot, G430W. My Missile 20J is a ‘93 Rocket STC’ed in ‘95 with 92 gallon tanks, 2 Aspens driving a KFC200 autopilot, G530 & Avidyne 440 (recently replacing a G430W...very happy). Both planes have a mid-continent Lifesaver installed and no vacuum instruments, good engine monitors (including fuel flow) and Gami-jectors (I routinely cruise at LOP in both planes). Both planes fly very similarly once in the air with the exception that the Missile climbs better at all altitudes and gets off the runway faster. The straight 20J does not have air brakes (& doesn’t need them if flown appropriately)...the Missile has them and needs them. Both airframes are clean but the additional mass/momentum for the Missile translates into a little more attention when descending or flying into shorter fields. Both aircraft have similar useful loads but the Missile performs dramatically better when at max wt. The Missile is smoother despite the additional power. I don’t know how much of this is 3 vs 2 blade prop and how much is 6 vs 4 cyl engine. Both aircraft are prop balanced to similar tolerance numbers. Both planes are getting new 1/4” windshields this winter while COVID and weather has reduced flying. I’ll be curious to see if this brings noise levels closer. The J is more “efficient” in a miles per gallon sense in no wind conditions but that advantage shifts to the Missile with significant headwinds. The Missile will still be moving along at 130 kts with a 50 kt headwind (72% of still air speed) while the J drops to 100 kts (67% of still air speed). I’ve set my J down and waited for better winds, but haven’t with the Missile. For a fair comparison I’d have to fly both planes at the same airspeed and altitude and fuel/passenger load, adjust to LOP and see what the numbers are...something I haven’t done yet. But in the real world it’s not likely that many pilots would resist the temptation to go faster, making straight J efficiency in the Missile “theoretical”. I’ve had my right tank leak on the Missile (patched without requiring a total strip and reseal). I’ve never had a problem with my 15 year older J. After the leak was repaired my research and discussion suggests that landing with heavier loads (lots of fuel in extended tanks) and older, stiffer doughnuts can increase the risk of leaks. I don’t keep the tanks full all the time now (but it used to give great assurance knowing I could fly 6.8 hrs @ 175-180 kts before running dry!). The Missile requires more attention to head temps on climb out. I am very conservative on this and try to keep the temps south of 380 (never allow >400). But this is more of an issue on hot summer days and not an issue at all in other seasons. Even cruise climbing at 120 kts (for cooling) the Missile climbs at sea level through ~6000ft @ >500 fpm with 2 people and full fuel. There are no cowl flaps on the Missile but for the additional workload of managing the cowl flap settings, the J offers a little more control of cooling than just “go faster to stay cooler”. The J is a little easier to keep cool in hot weather. I think the cyl head “redline” is 450 (I’d have to go look at the gauge to be sure), but I wouldn’t feel comfortable with temps that high even briefly for take off. Maintenance has been similar. The airframe firewall back practically is the same. The Missile landing gear has been reinforced but the doughnuts are the same. The cont IO550A in the Missile has 2 more cylinders to care for and the prop has an extra blade...roughly speaking this might work out to an additional 50% expense firewall forward. Both the J & Missile are tightly cowled...the Missile slightly more so. I developed some heat damage to the paint on the cowl over the #6 (left forward) cylinder many years ago. When the cowl was repaired and heat shielding in the area was replaced, it chafed that cylinder head cover and had to be reworked. Interestingly, my brother had the same issue with his Ovation. The exhaust system on the Missile is designed and built by Rocket. I’ve had the exhaust system rebuilt once by them ~15 years ago and this year had the muffler repaired by another shop closer to home to address a deformed spark arrester cone. The exhaust system in the J has required no significant work. The engine mount for the Missile’s IO550A is well engineered and sturdy, but requires attention where the support tubes are near the exhaust as the heat is hard on the paint and if neglected, corrosion could become a significant problem. Through the years, I’ve stripped and painted the lower parts of the support twice (while in place). High heat paint holds up better, & careful attention to inspecting and maintaining the heat shielding pays off. Hot starts are more problematic with the Missile. I’m installing a Surefly electronic ignition this annual. One of the claimed improvements with EI is hot starting so we’ll see. Surefly doesn’t have a unit that works with the dual mag single drive system in the J’s io360. Overall they’re both wonderful airplanes. Mooney support has been good through the years despite they’re ownership ups and downs. Rocket engineering support has been consistently good as well...and I’ve only rarely needed it! Ive had both from coast to coast and into south eastern Canada but I do seem to fly the Missile a little more, particularly on longer trips. My general thoughts after flying my 2 Mooney’s for 25 years... Don’t be afraid to buy a Missile if you come across one in good shape for a fair price, you won’t regret it. My wife and I flew back from Barr Harbor to Louisville a few years ago skirting well north along the Great Lakes to stay out of a hurricane blowing up into Virginia and never had to worry about running out of time in the air despite the weather related extreme course deviations. If a J comes up that is in good shape at a fair price, you won’t regret that either. Extended tanks can make a J’s legs as long as a Missile. It might not climb as well with the additional weight, and won’t be quite as fast...it’s performance is still very respectable. And from what I’ve seen so far, the J’s seem a little better at holding their market value. When avgas goes back up this may be more true. Hope this is helpful.

Through the years I’ve followed prices for Missiles and 20J’s in trade-a-plane. They don’t come up as often in recent years, but the price differential between Missiles & 20J’s has decreased. Perhaps because people aren’t as familiar with the Rocket product? On the rare occasion that they come up, Missiles aren’t going for too much more than similar vintage stock J’s.

I’ve owned and flown a straight M20J (N4212H) since ‘95 and an M20J Rocket Missile STC since about 2003 (N1068R). They’re both sweet planes. Both cruise best at ~9-12k...4212H 150-155 kts @ 8-9 gph LOP, 1068R 175-180 kts @ 13-13.5 gph LOP. Useful load on 4212H is~920 lbs, and ~25 lbs more for 1068R. Typically I fly alone or with 1 passenger and light luggage. I have noticed a few kts bump in cruise at the end of long trips as the tanks empty. The straight 20J is more economical, but the Missile is not bad. Reliability, maintenance costs are similar. I have found the Missile is actually a little quieter than my straight 20J with less vibration. Both planes are prop balanced with good engine mounts. The Missile felt solid at 19k, while the straight 20J felt mushy at 17.5k (my highest altitudes in each). The Missile gets in the air faster than the straight 20J (particularly coming off of higher altitude runways). They’re both a pleasure to fly, VFR or IFR. The straight 20J typically has to stop for fuel to assure reserves on a Louisville to San Antonio flight, while the Missile usually can make the same flight nonstop with more than adequate reserves (my 20J holds 64 gal, Missile 92 gal). Rocket has put 55-60 Missiles in the fleet as best I can tell...I don’t know if they still offer the conversion. The last I saw posted for the STC was $130k, and I’ve seen Missiles on trade-a-plane for similar amounts. I think of my 2 Mooney’s as a “twin engine” that is rarely down for annuals or maintenance and I don’t plan to part with either until I’m finished flying but if I had to give one up it would be a coin toss...they’re both great planes with slightly different missions.