T. Peterson

Your comment is also right on target. Cowardly Congressmen shift their burden of responsibility to various bureaucracies and sub bureaucracies to avoid the messy job of real legislation. This allows them to dodge consequences by blaming some unknown and faceless bureaucracy when the citizen complains of an onerous and/or ridiculous ruling.

Well written and right on the money!!

Anything that works to restrain bureaucrats even just a little bit encourages me just a little bit.

I bet there are a lot of parts out there that would cause someone somewhere heartburn. Personally, I like the ingenuity of many on this forum. I just wish I had more of it!

Fascinating thread. Thank you for posting all this, and congratulations on reviving this airplane!

Thank you for contributing your comments. I am sure it will be a painful experience as almost every interaction with maintenance folks is a long drawn out expensive evolution. Oftentimes the results are less than optimal, but I just come to expect some degree of disappointment. There are exceptions for which I am grateful. I have decided to go with a Western Skyways engine and I am having it done by a shop that has so far done excellent work. I appreciate your comments and all the feedback I have received on this forum.

I very much appreciate all of your thoughtful responses. I will be re-reading all of them before making a final decision. Thank you so much for your input.

As you noted, the price difference between Remanufactured and new is about 7500.00, but the difference between Remanufactured and Overhauled is 21000.00!! My engine has leaked oil since I bought it and in spite of hundreds of dollars spent changing hoses, thru bolts, pushrod seals etc she just continues to leak. Last oil analysis was high in nickel. Blackstone said they thought that indicates worn valve guides. Other than that she runs beautifully and is an easy start even when hot. But I think the time is here to at least order an engine and I am really leaning towards Western Skyways even if they can’t get cylinders for several months.

The core is an issue with most rebuilders, but apparently not W.S. They will build me an engine but the issue is cylinders. The 12 week lead time you mention is now 16 weeks minimum. At least that’s my impression from various conversations.

Factory rebuilt is 76000.00. The lead time is the same as for the new. They will also overhaul my engine for 51000.00 plus installation labor, airport fees etc, but the kicker is that the lead times then become as uncertain as anyone else’s.

I have a 1979 231 with the TSIO 360 LB. ( I sure wish the Rocket STC was still available!!!) The engine is coming up on 1500 hours. It’s serviceable, but tired. It has also been in the plane since 1991. The cost of a new engine from Continental is over 81,000.00. Lead time is 65 days. The cost of an exchange engine from Western Skyways is a little over 55,000. The lead time is at least 16 weeks, and probably longer due to the shortage of cylinders. However that’s not a huge deal as I don’t have to send in my engine and will continue to fly until the exchange engine is ready. What I definitely don’t want to do is take my plane out of service by sending my engine out for overhaul having no idea when it will come back. My question of the forum, is do you think a new engine is worth 26,000.00 more than an overhaul? When factoring in the sales tax it will be even more. Thanks, Torrey

Due to all the limitations others have noted I would not install it as a primary Attitude Indicator. However I did have one installed as a backup AI, and I have been very pleased. Additionally I use it as an altitude reminder. When ATC clears me to a different altitude I can dial in the new altitude on the AV-30. It’s not an alerter, but I can just glance at it in case I start to wonder, “what was that altitude to which I was cleared??” I also use it to dial in the barometric altimeter setting. I find it easier to read than my round dial altimeter. It’s just a good cross check. Having a backup AI is critical for me. I am simply not comfortable with flying IMC on a single vacuum AI.

Wellll…….sort of…….

It’s just a bummer that Mooney didn’t survive and bring this airplane to market.

I can’t explain it either. I can only be grateful for it.

Ouch! Sorry about that! 3.74 at KRFI, 3.99 at KRWV and 3.90 at 4F2. A plethora of gas stops sub 5.00.

Looking at the Foreflight map it does look to me that avgas is trending down. There are even some airports that show less than 4.00 a gallon.

Hi Don, I would be very interested in what Don and Paul Maxwell think about you using Camguard. They are both mechanics and operators and have been for a very long time. They also do all my maintenance and have never mentioned Camguard to me one way or another. I never thought to ask about it, and it may be a moot point as my engine is a Continental? I don’t know. I have been told that the Continental cam sits in the oil and Lycoming does not, so that may be why no one has recommended the additive to me.

Very nice!! Thanks for responding! I could have used anti-ice/de-ice today! Fortunately I was able to climb above it, but that sure would be a nice little feature to have in my back pocket!!

I really like your simple approach. A lot on this thread just makes me dizzy! I very interested in the Ovations and am about to put up my 231 for sale, however I am very curious about the speed/efficiency gains and losses I can expect from such a move. What is your TAS at 13 to 13.5 gph? And at what altitude? One of the reasons I want a normally aspirated engine is because I never fly above 12000 feet, but I do want speed and efficiency (who doesn’t!) I think the IO 550 will give me the best performance compromises, but I assumed that it would cost me 15 to 16 gph to get 175 kts vs the 12.5 to 13.0 I currently spend to achieve 160 kts.

I don’t want to prejudice anyone against the shop, because the fault could very well be in my airplane.

Good point. I will email the shop tomorrow and query them.

Makes sense, but I never had a vacuum failure.

I’m at the mercy of the mechanic. Hopefully they know that, but I will make a point to remind them. I didn’t know about the filters you mention. I will ask if they were replaced. Makes me wonder if dirty air is exactly what has caused three failures in a row!

A wealth of wonderful information from you gentlemen! Thank you all. I have already ordered the rebuilt EDO and Maxwell will install it while I wait. I want to FLY my airplane, not have it sit for weeks on a maintenance ramp! So I really hope this one works well. If not, I’ll then be pretty much forced to go a different route. A great take away from your discussion is that I CAN install certain electric AI’s that will drive my autopilot! If push comes to shove I am leaning strongly toward the Garmin 275. Thanks again fellas for your time and excellent insights!