urbanti

Rereading this thread, its amazing how much good info and experience can be found at MS. From an initial cost/cruise speed/fuel burn/engine overhaul standpoint, I would compare 4-cylinder Mooneys that cruise 140-160 KTAS with Beech Sierras, Piper Arrows and Cessna Cardinal RGs. IMO a nice four cylinder Lycoming powered Mooney absolutely crushes all competition at this price point. I would compare 6-cylinder high performance Mooneys with Beech Bonanzas, Piper Comanche singles, Rockwell singles, Cirri and that group of aircraft that are going to cruise @ 160-170 KTAS and in some cases carry more load, and have fuel burn 13-15 gph, and engine overhaul costs closer to $50k. Best Tim

We should start a new thread where somebody posts an ad for a 40-year old GA aircraft listed with “no damage history”, and the logbooks. In my experience we won’t have to look too hard in many cases to contradict that assertion, and that’s before looking at the plane in person. But, good points have been made about the importance of proper due diligence with experts to ensure that any repairs are made IAW factory data and such. Your mileage may vary, Tim

I should have said, “...be skeptical of the local guy on the field who brags about how much ice his plane will carry unless he flies a DC-3!” Tim

Congrats, and be super careful anytime about possibility of ice any time the temp at altitude may be near freezing. Be skeptical of the local guy at the field who brags about how much ice his plane will carry. Good luck! Tim

Sir I am sure you are a nice guy, and your planes are in great shape. That being said, you are cutting yourself off from a significant portion of the modern 2019 market if you are unable to share basic documents like logbooks electronically. Good luck Tim

FWIW, I have recently owned both a M20E Mooney and a F33A Bonanza (straight tail). My Bonanza insurance rate was between $1,000 & $2,000 /year, the Mooney a little under, but the F33A had a much, much higher hull value. I skimmed the thread and didn’t see a discussion of the size/weight of your family, but if you’re looking to fill the seats that could be a determinant... If you fly in both I am sure that one will obviously stand out as the right choice for you! Good luck! Tim

Congrats on really nice E! Yours is like my old plane, manual gear is the best! At first be super compulsive about keeping stuff on the floor away from where the Johnson bar sits with the gear retracted. Even a thin chart on the floor will keep you from getting the JBar locked on the floor in the receptacle. If you don’t already have one, make up a tool like a wood bar with a notch in it to help manipulate the fuel tank selector on the floor between your feet. And practice with it so you could quickly switch tanks in an emergency. Get your IR as soon as you can, that plane will cover ground quick enough that you will inevitable get into weather. Also, like others said be super careful about prop clearance while taxiing on uneven pavement, and if you have a imperfect landing remember whatever you do to keep the nose up and avoid porpoising! The long low wing and short gear will allow you to make great crosswind landings, have a Mooney-specific instructor show you how. good luck! Tim

Can 231s with -GB engine + intercooler + merlyn wastegate use the same numbers as -LB engined 231s w/ intercooler + merlyn wastegate? Thx Tim

I just wanted to jump in to say how impressed I am with the 157 KTAS M20F... That's awesome! Tim

Daver328 - No disrespect to the C models! I was solely looking at the cruise requirement of 150 KTAS. In all of the objective tests online I've never seen a C do that kinda cruise. Agree C's are very nice airplanes best Tim

I think you should be able to look at M20Es in that price range. Unsure if you'll get a modern autopilot with altitude hold. Call around to the bigger MSC's and tell them you're looking for a decent E and they may turn you on to a well-cared-for bird that isn't even on the market yet. If you want suggestions on who to contact PM me, best Tim

Haha flight2000 beat me to it.... the C model you're looking for is called an E or a J! Good luck Tim

I am intimately familiar with the ownership and operating costs of 172s, Mooney M20s, and Beech Bonanzas. IMO vintage Mooney's are a super inexpensive way to get 150'ish knots KTAS and complex hours in your logbook. In addition to the lower purchase cost than Cirruses, Bonanzas and many Commanches, the vintage Mooneys are going to have lower fuel consumption, and the engines will be significantly cheaper to overhaul/replace. good luck! Tim

Postscript: N79835 has 3-rivet pads installed

thanks for all of the replies! Tim

Think I found the answer Manual shows linings as 35-204 (two) and 66-30 (two) Tim

Does anybody know off the top of their heads the part numbers or other identifying info on brake pads for a 1965 M20E? I'm assuming that all the vintage planes would use the same pads. thanks in advance Tim

An initial place to start could be going onto the FAA website and downloading the PTS standards with all the updates (I think that they're up to update 5 or such). It can save you a lot of time and heartache to thoroughly review the prerequisites so that you know what you have to accomplish to be eligible to take the oral/checkride. It is also helpful to carefully review the prereuquisites so that you can ensure that your various logbook endorsements are complete. best Tim

Todd: You can get a nice vintage Mooney for much less than $60k. It will be difficult for you to get a nice M201 (J) for $60k. If you get a decent deal on a M20E, you will have the fastest of the stock vintage Mooneys, clearly outperform all other similarly priced aircraft (eg Arrows). You will also get awesome short field takeoff performance. To me, if you have $50k or less, and you want performance, the vintage Mooneys are a no-brainer. If you decide to move up to the J price bracket, i.e. $70-$120, you're looking at a super nice plane but there are also other nice planes you can find at that bracket that you should look at as well (e.g. Debonnaires and V-Tails, Commanches, etc). Good luck Tim

Passed my instrument rating checkride yesterday after lots of study and practice. It would not have been possible without the selfless safetly piloting, mentoring, and IFR kibitzing received from 3 members of our forum: Seth Myers, Alex Gertsen, and Chuck Swim. For months now I have been wholly focused on practicing IFR procedures, it's gonna be fun to be able to look out the window again best Tim

To me, trust is a huge part of the transaction. There are a lot of flakes/hustlers/crazy people out there selling airplanes. If the seller gives off too many counterintuitive/irrational responses, I move on. The vintage Mooney market is not booming, a patient buyer with cash can come up with a great plane, no reason to jump at the first plane you see... best Tim

I'd trade it in for a factory reman if that's an option. Seems counterintuitive to pay for all that labor to take apart and refurbish the case and end up with a 1,500 hour engine with a welded case. best Tim

For a first aircraft purchase you have the greatest chance of a good experience if you buy a plane that is in annual and has been flown frequently, with bonus points if the plane is well known in the Mooney community or at your home airport. The above-referenced plane may end up being a great plane for somebody, but it would be a mistake to plan around it costing you $22,000 when all is said and done. best Tim

Some of the work on Mooney's, like engine and avionics, doesn't seem to require a lot of marque-specific expertise. However, as a previous poster suggested, for anything regarding flight controls, rigging the manual gear, or structural issues, I find the Mooney significantly different from Brand C and Brand P airplanes that I will make the effort to take the plane to a Mooney expert. While there are a number of A&P's out there with sufficient Mooney experience that I would be comfortable going to them, I happen to live pretty close to Freeway MSC so they get the jobs like the annual and pulling out and refinishing the control tubes, etc. best Tim

Has anyone who flies both regularly ever compared the C/E short body airframe vs. an F or a J? I'm just wondering if the lengthening of the airframe affected the handling of the aircraft in terms of pitch? best Tim