Bob_Belville

Yeah, my plane's owner, two before me, was a Delta captain and a stickler for details (the headsets and flash light were on his W&B form). He had the plane weighed but went back to the factory weight and recalculate with all the adds and minuses and use that as the new weight. The result of the actual weighing is nowhere to be found in all the many records I inherited.

I've lost 20 pounds since I bought my Mooney 20 months ago. Being able to switch tanks is about the best incentive to lose I've had in years.

I reduced weight 11.3 pounds with new panel. 18 items out weighing 40.6, added 7 items weighing 29.3. I can give you details if you'd like but look at before and after in gallery. FWIW, my empty weight is 64 pounds heavier than it was from the factory completely explained by 4 mods: O&N bladders 30 speed brakes 9 1 pc FG belly 10 other speed mods 16

The 500+ number is in the O&N ad in the latest MAPA Log, p. 25, in the context of promoting their add-on bladders for Mooneys that have the basic 54 gallon system to get to 64. I am no zealot but I'm feeling like a salesman again even though I have no personal interest in this matter. I have never even talked to the folks at O&N. I bought a plane that has the bladders and they are fine. OTOH, several on here seem to be willing to run down the bladders with unsubstantiated claims of leaking and worse that they do not back up with any data and I can't confirm on the internet. This medium seems to bring out the worst in some folks. If the bladders are really a serious problem I sure want to know it but vague and false innuendo are not very helpful. That wet wings leak is not at issue. Good grief.

+1 Plus you can store more than one aircraft profiles and flight plans which makes filing quick and easy. Pull up a stored FP, add a departure time, souls on board and go. You can let DUATS suggest routing based on airways or GPS direct and modify as desired. Print out a FP log with segment info, time, fuel, speed etc. Pretty slick. I generally put in the FP the night before the flight, DUATS sends it to FAA 2 hours before dep time. Until then it can be edited.

I went through several pages of google search results re Mooney bladder leaks. Found none. I did see a '66C advertised on 4/2013 Aviator Trader listing with 21 year old O&N bladders toted as a selling point: "O&N Bladders installed 5/92, per STC SA2350CE, eliminating fuel leaks..." There are now at least 500 Mooneys flying with bladders, probably many more than that. If they sometimes leak you'd think we'd see someone reporting it.

I'd read it to mean the former.

Hum, I have not talked to FSS since returning to flying. I really like all the resources available @ DUATS.

Tom, I use CSC Duats M20P should be what you need. Aircraft Type: M20P Aircraft Identification: Color of Aircraft:W/B/GY/M Aircraft Home Base: Aircraft Wake Turbulance Category: Light etc Your Wake Turbulance Category is chosen automaticly when you enter an aircraft type. All Fields Required Climb 115 Cruise 150 Descent 160 Units True Airspeed Knots or Mach Number Climb/Descent Rate 450 500 Feet Per Minute Fuel Consumption 15 10.5 10 Domestic Equipment: G ICAO Equipment(Optional) ICAO Surveillance Equipment: -No ADS-B Capabilites- B1 - ADS-B Capable - 1090 Out B2 - ADS-B Capable - 1090 In/Out -No UAT Capabilities- U1 - UAT Capable - UAT Out U2 - UAT Capable - UAT In/Out -No VDL Capabilites- V1 - VDL Capable - VDL In V2 - VDL Capable - VDL In/Out -No ADS-C Capabilites- D1 - ADS-C Capable - FANS/1 G1 - ADS-C Capable - ATN Both ADS-C S - Standard Equipment* N - None A - GBAS Landing System B - LPV (APV w/SBAS) C - LORAN C D - DME F - ADF G - GNSS/GPS GNSS Augmentation: H - HF RTF J1 - CPDLC ATN VDL Mode2 J2 - CPDLC ATN FANS 1/A HFDL J3 - CPDLC ATN FANS 1/A VDL Mode A J4 - CPDLC FANS 1/A VDL Mode2 J5 - CPDLC 1/A SATCOM INMARSAT J6 - CPDLC 1/A SATCOM MTSAT J7 - CPDLC 1/A SATCOM Iridium I - Inertial Navigation K - MLS L - ILS M1 - SATCOM M2 - MTSAT M3 - IRIDIUM O - VOR R - PBN Approved T - TACAN E1 - FMC WPR ACAR E2 - D-FIS ACARS E3 - PDC ACARS U - UHF RTF V - VHF RTF W - RVSM X - MNPS Y - VHF w/ 8.33khz Spacing Z - Other - Use Remarks Section and NAV/ PBN/ Check up to 8 Performance Based Navigation Types A1 - RNAV 10 (RNP10) B1 - RNAV 5 All Permitted Sensors B2 - RNAV 5 GNSS B3 - RNAV 5 DME/DME B4 - RNAV 5 VOR/DME B5 - RNAV 5 INS/IRS B6 - RNAV 5 LORAN C C1 - RNAV 2 All Permitted Sensors C2 - RNAV 2 GNSS C3 - RNAV 2 DME/DME C4 - RNAV 2 DME/DME/IRU D1 - RNAV 1 All Permitted Sensors D2 - RNAV 1 GNSS D3 - RNAV 1 DME/DME D4 - RNAV 1 DME/DME/IRU L1 - RNP 4 O1 - Basic RNP 1 All Permitted Sensors O2 - Basic RNP 1 GNSS O3 - Basic RNP 1 DME/DME O4 - Basic RNP 1 DME/DME/IRU S1 - RNP APCH S2 - RNP APCH with Baro T1 - RNP APCH with RF (Auth Required) T2 - RNP APCH without RF (Auth Required)

Hum, I was thinking it was just the reverse...

I have no direct knowledge of the newer sealants and the several name shops folks swear by but I would be careful to claim that something relatively new will last for longer than it has been in service. Maybe so, maybe no. I suspect there have been quite a few miracle solutions over the last 60 years that are being redone by new and improved stuff by new and improved salesmen. The real world is a lot tougher than the lab.

Hum, Jimmy Garrison's on line price calculator for an E gives a $1000 premium for O&N bladders. www.vintagemooneygroup.com/M20EValuation.html I really expect my 16 year old bladders to outlast me and my 70 year old bladder.

My friend here with a 67F has more spent resealing than a set of bladders cost. and while I generally fill the tanks, I am not sure that is more of an issue with bladders than with sealed tanks. Not talking dry tanks for months on end... just doubt that 1/2 full bladders in a hanger are at risk.

José, thanks for the info. Have there been cases specifically on Mooneys with O&N bladders with spar corrosion? Any SBs or ADs? (The O&N bladders do add ~30 pounds to the empty weight, not insignificant.)

KLNS has reasonable self serve fuel. At least as of last year. Looks like current is $5.97, not so great.

+1 for O&N bladders. Mine are 16 years old with zero issues. www.onaircraft.com/products-services/mooney-bladders/

I guess I should be ashamed to admit I bought my planes the old way. The seller agreed to fly the plane to Wilgrove. 2 hours, for an abbreviated PP inspect which I paid for, $220. The seller paid the gas coming down, I filled him up for his return home. $125. I made him a counter offer by email noting several items that would need attention, none airworthiness issues, rationale for my lower price. He accepted it the next day, by email. I did a title search and got a cashiers check. He got the Bill of Sale and FAA docs filled out and signed, flew back down where we exchanged the plane and papers for the check. We remain in contact, he's now a sailor.

I think the AOPA site has a good bit of helpful info...

Do you have digital fuel flow? What's you flow full power on climb out with mixture full in? I'm seeing 17.7 (91% power at my 1270' home drome.)

Background on Dr. Bill's post: www.donmaxwell.com/publications/MAPA_TEXT/Shower%20of%20Sparks/Shower%20of%20Sparks.htm It should not affect starting, but be sure the timing, 20 or 25 BTC, is set per the engine spec plate. Either could be correct depending upon when it last saw the factory, as I understand it. My factory reman from 2001 is 20 BTC.

Our modern camera phones come in handy. I was able to "see" the back of my ASI by reaching my phone up behind the panel and clicking the camera. It took a couple of shots but digital film is pretty cheap. The one picture shows where the ASI is in the top of the panel and the other the nice pic I got with my arm threaded up between obstacles.

Glen, our hydraulic flaps are really not designed (very well) to partially retract. I suppose you are not concerned with take off when you're dumping 15 deg and not much happens to pitch. When you are in short final landing configuration with 33 deg flaps you also have pitch trim near full nose up. Dumping flaps requires pushing the yoke firmly forward until you can reset the pitch wheel but very doable. Be sure to have enough speed before dumping flaps. No need to be a a big hurry, your C will climb pretty well with full flaps when you go full power. But finally, there is an adjustment to the bleed valve that your A&P can adjust to slow the flap retract speed.

standard operating procedure

I'm thinking leaner is better. I took up my M20E Monday for 30 minutes. I flew around some checking everything since we just finished an annual. I didn't get above 3000' because of some broken clouds. I pulled back the throttle and prop but I didn't touch the mixture. Normally I would but I was interested in other things. I was the only plane in the area when I headed back to the airport. I was high when I made the decision to land straight in so I pulled back the throttle got the gear out and even the speed brakes. On short final I pushed the prop in and turned on the boost pump. SOP. I landed started rolling out and when I was slow enough to push in the throttle to taxi the engine quit, prop stopped. I coasted as far as I could but could reach the turn off. The engine started right up and after I taxied in front of the maint. hanger I could not make it quit by pulling throttle back to idle which was about 650RPM. We're theorizing the engine just loaded up, flooded. So... SOP for landing checklist of mixture full rich, boost pump on in anticipation of possible go around needs to be taken in context. I seem to recall 40 years and 3000 hours ago in trainers that clearing the engine with a momentary burst of throttle was part on the landing routine.

Apology accepted.