Rick Junkin

I sent feedback to Foreflight this evening. I’m copying it here in the event anyone shares my observations and recommendations and also wants to send feedback. If we use similar words to present the same ideas the chances of our comments being grouped together increase and potentially raise the priority of consideration by the development team. Greetings, I’m sorry to say that the Dynamic Procedures implementation is disappointing, especially as compared to Garmin Pilot’s SmartCharts. I’m staying with Foreflight due to the superior aircraft performance features, but Garmin Pilot is catching up on that feature set and once they do I will be more compelled to make the switch to GP. I’ve subscribed to Foreflight since 2011, so this isn’t a decision I take lightly. I installed a full Garmin panel in my Mooney and while Foreflight does everything I need, the Garmin Pilot integration with my avionics is naturally cleaner and the SmartCharts implementation makes it more usable in a single pilot hard IFR environment. I do prefer the weather, filing, and aircraft performance functions in Foreflight but those are all primarily on-the-ground planning functions. GP is moving ahead in the inflight functions that reduce workload when ease of use and timeliness are critical. Specifics on Dynamic Procedures. 1. The disclaimer “Verify with chart” is a show-stopper. For a tailored SID/STAR/IAP feature set to be effective it must be a stand-alone simplified presentation of the applicable data in an easily digestible format. The disclaimer implies things may be missing or incorrect, and that’s not acceptable. I suspect the development team was constrained with a requirement to not produce anything that could fully replace Jepp plates. Garmin obviously had no such restriction and produced a superior product that can stand alone, and could become a standard or template for others to emulate. Recommendation: Drive toward a single page stand-alone presentation of tailored data. 2. The data overlay on an IAP plate, accompanied by the side bar data, is cluttered and feels kludged together. I know a lot of thought and good work has gone in to this feature set but the result has a sub-optimal feel. For instance the pilot must scroll the sidebar or refer to the IAP plate to see the missed approach instructions. The GP implementation makes the instructions available with a single button, and in the very simple graphic format used on NOAA plates. Recommendation: Reduce use of overlay/sidebar data to only supplemental or briefing data that flows and is easily digested. 3. The Dynamic Procedure presentation is only available on the Map page, and an approach must be either entered into the flight plan or sent to the map from the Airport page Procedure tab. This can be cumbersome in a divert scenario when identifying the best divert airfield. Recommendation: Make display of the Dynamic Procedure format available directly in the Airport page Procedure tab. This would require implementation of a single page stand-alone tailored procedure format. EDIT: At 11:30pm I received a personal response and request for more detailed suggestions from a Garmin Sr Customer Experience manager, 3 hours after I submitted my recommendations. They obviously are heavily engaged in refining Dynamic Procedures in response to subscriber feedback. Don’t be shy with your opinions, they want to know what we think!

Interestingly Garmin Pilot does the same, but going back to select circling mins is only two button presses. In Foreflight it takes at least four button presses and possibly some scrolling.

Not a YouTube video, but the latest Aviation Consumer has a Foreflight/Garmin Pilot comparison article. I heard echos while reading it, the author could have used this thread for some of his source material https://digital.emagazines.com/the_aviation_consumer/20250804/mobile/index.html?t=7bcd3f1e-e63a-404d-9cc9-06893ca0f55b&utm_content=email_cover&utm_campaign=aviation_consumer_file_1#p6

Thanks for the info. My expectations are too high . I was looking for communication from Foreflight saying something along the lines of, "Thanks for all of the great feedback we received at Airventure! We're taking the time to incorporate your suggestions before we fully release Dynamic Procedures." Or something like that. But I imagine the actual situation is closer to the development team needing to correct some discoveries identified before and during the Airventure demonstrations of the beta. I wholeheartedly agree the best path is to make sure it's right before release. However, having worked for Boeing for 22 years, I also have a cynical outlook on any communications from the company and its subsidiaries regarding "coming attractions" that include projected dates or even time frames. Now I'm just curious if the release will come before or after the webinar on the 6th. It sure would be nice to have the new software to play along during the webinar.

Thanks for all you do Craig! The content and info exchange here is certainly more than worth the minimum $25 a year.

Hmm. I'm guessing there were some discoveries and learning that occurred from the public hands-on opportunity at Airventure that prompted some revisions to Dynamic Procedures. Foreflight has officially missed the advertised July release. To be fair, I can't recall if Foreflight directly advertised a July release for Dynamic Procedures or if it was something stated in a third party article. But they have been doing monthly releases for some time now, and there wasn't one in July. And they did state a 90 day initial release period for all subscription levels through October. I haven't been able to find anything put out by Foreflight talking about what they're doing or offering an estimated release date for the Dynamic Procedures capability. Has anyone found any new information? I know it's probably early to be looking for info, but this isn't a good look for Foreflight. And the Dynamic Procedures webinar is still scheduled for August 6th. Have they released a beta beyond 17.7.2? @midlifeflyer? @daytonabch04?

My hangar is 60x50, but here it is with 3 airplanes in it. 2 Mooneys, one long body (Bravo) and one mid body (J), along with a CH2000 and a "work in progress" experimental. Plenty of room.

Push one into a back corner and you'll have plenty of room for the second airplane. As has been said, you'll need to reshuffle them when you want to get the "back" airplane out. I have a friend's V-tail Bo in my hangar with my Bravo, plenty of room.

Is this what you’re looking for? Lycoming-OH-Manual 2002 ed.pdf

Yup

Completely agree. I really wanted to like Garmin Pilot when I upgraded my panel a couple of years ago (dang, has it been that long???), but just couldn't commit to riding the learning curve to get proficient with it. Speaking of being a geek, I even bought a Garmin watch to go with the new avionics , another push toward GP. And now with the introduction of SmartCharts I have yet ANOTHER motivation to take a closer look. I think GP is the better app for inflight management, but Foreflight's flight planning and briefing functions are cleaner, in my opinion. It stands to reason, as GP started out primarily as a GPS and navigation app, and Foreflight started out primarily as a weather and planning app. Each still does best what it did first. My biggest issue is I've really grown to like the "Flights" page in Foreflight and all of the planning and performance data it presents on one page. I use the integrated W&B and takeoff and landing data (TOLD) buttons on every flight. I have the muscle memory on weather study and briefing, as well as filing and amending/cancelling flight plans. GP doesn't do TOLD, or at least I haven't figured out where yet. But the thing is I don't NEED my EFB to do that for me, I'm just used to it being available. It's things like that I'm looking at now with a jaundiced eye, along with making myself learn the Garmin way. I'm still struggling with liking the weather functions and briefing, but I can get them to work well enough. I really think Garmin took a leap ahead with SmartCharts, especially with the comparatively kludged-together implementation of overlays in Foreflight's Dynamic Procedures. Time will tell, but Garmin has designed what can be a stand-alone replacement for heritage procedure plates. I think the simplification and potential flight safety improvements SmartCharts bring will be the beginning of GP's rise in market share unless Foreflight refines their game. Less is more in this instance, and laying more stuff on top of already busy stuff isn't gonna win fans in the general aviation market. But maybe we aren't Foreflight's target consumer anymore.

It does, but you would be limited to Sport Pilot operating limitations. Get really familiar with those before you decide to drop basic med. For instance, you can't fly IFR as a sport pilot, you can't go above 10,000', and you can't fly at night without an endorsement. It may be a little fuzzy holding a PPL and operating to SP limits as to what documentation/endorsements are really required.

It won't fit through the baggage door so you'd have to load it in from the front and probably make it work in the back seat. The web site lists the weight at 42.4 pounds, and I have to assume that's empty weight. Add ice and water and the weight becomes more than I could manage without a lot of effort. It would work great in a Cirrus with its larger baggage door that would allow you to slide it straight in to the baggage compartment.

Just a hypothetical, but would the assertion be the same if the other aircraft was a Pitts legally doing aerobatics in Class E airspace?