TKS system on a 2008 Acclaim

[johnb1]

Does anyone have any experience with the tks system on a new acclaim?  I am having much dificulty getting the fluid level to register properly on the panel mounted fluid indicator.  Mooney has supported the effort 100% but we are unable to resolve the issue.  we have changed the sending unit twice and tried 3 new main controllers and still unable to get accurate level readings.

Any help will be welcome

John B

 N782JB

 

[Mcstealth]

Who are you working with at Mooney?

[johnb1]

Staphanie S

Stacey E and Paul Kehner.

John

 

[Mcstealth]

Quote: johnb1

Staphanie S

Stacey E and Paul Kehner.

John

 

[johnb1]

the plane is at ASI jet Center at the Flying Cloud Airport in MSP. 

 

[M20BE]

If possible I would take it up to there and let them fix it, ask for another exchange plane meanwhile.

[KSMooniac]

You might try having the shop check *every* connection behind the G1000 panels.  One of those might not be fully seated and could be causing havoc with a seemingly unrelated system like your fluid indicator.  A friend's Ovation had all kinds of issues and it was eventually traced to an audio panel input connector or something like that...

[johnb1]

You have struck a nerve.  Not just the tks but the fuel system and my manifold pressure are also a problem reading fluid level and correct mf pressure.  We are not looking at the connections and the engine data computer.  We have been working all these issues for some time and have thrown alot of parts without success.  With the fuel system we have changed the senders, re-calibrate and can not get the system to stay where we put it.  Mooney has done everything i have asked and TKS has stepped up also.  We have sent both ends of the tks system, (sender and controller) for their review and calibration on the test bench.  We expect to get it back overnight on Monday for reinstall.  All parties have bent over backwords to meet my needs with out reservation and concern for costs of warranty.

Regards

John

N782JB

 

[johnb1]

You have struck a nerve.  Not just the tks but the fuel system and my manifold pressure are also a problem reading fluid level and correct mf pressure.  We are NOW looking at the connections and the engine data computer AND ALL WIRING.  We have been working all these issues for some time and have thrown alot of parts without success.  With the fuel system we have changed the senders, re-calibrate and can not get the system to stay where we put it.  Mooney has done everything i have asked and TKS has stepped up also.  We have sent both ends of the tks system, (sender and controller) for their review and calibration on the test bench.  We expect to get it back overnight on Monday for reinstall.  All parties have bent over backwords to meet my needs with out reservation and concern for costs of warranty.

Regards

John

N782JB

[KSMooniac]

Good luck John.  Since you mentioned all of those other symptoms, I really suspect you have a wiring harness or connector issue!  My friends O3 was looked at first in a Garmin service center, and after they gave up it went back to Kerrville, and the loose connection was an accidental discovery that fixed his problem. 

I'm not familiar with the G1000 system enough to give you a specific recommendation, but if it were me, I'd power up the plane with aux power, and start wiggling every single connection behind the panel AND at the remote boxes in the tail, and look for changes in the displays.  You should probably wiggle the mechanical connectors as well as the wire bundles in case there is an insufficient crimp on a wire's pin, or a pin that is not fully seated in the connector.  Those things are still assembled and installed by humans, and out of a few hundred connections it wouldn't be too crazy to have one or two defective connections.

[KSMooniac]

I'll add that my friend's O3 is also a 2008 model.

[johnb1]

i think that is the next step for the guys at Modern Aero.  They are a certified Garmin repair center and a certified mooney repair center.  They should have what it takes.

Thanks

John

 

[KSMooniac]

Any good news from your shop yet John?

[johnb1]

Scott,

lots going on.  We sent the tks sending unit and the control unit back to tks for calabration and will get it back tomorrow forinstall.  we are all anxious to see how it works in the airplane.  We also found the fuel problem to be the R out board sending unit hanging up  in the full position on on of the nutplates on one of the upper tank access plates.  the only fix is to tweak the sending unit arm latteraly 1/4 inch.  We also have a problem with irratic manifold pressure after the engine is warm.  We plan to run a mechanical MP gauge into the cockpit and do some test flights and take offs and send the data TDC for advice on what to change or adjust.  More on that later.

back to the tks.  After talking to the engineers at CAV Aerspace they are not able to accurately display the fluid level on their tks tanks provided for the Mooney.  The shape of the tank is a problem in their minds so i will get a chart that tells me what the actual level is based on the readout value on the tks controler.  In other words when the controller says i have 1 gallon remaining i may not really have that amount.  I really can not undrstand why they can not measure 6 gallons any better than that.

John

N782JB

 

[randypugh]

Hey John/ I must say on my Ovation the guage reads acruate. A little different on the ground compared to in flight but only 10ths. When I fill it I  spill out the overflow on the bottom almost exactly where it says it will. 

[RobertoTohme]

Quote: randypugh

Hey John/ I must say on my Ovation the guage reads acruate. A little different on the ground compared to in flight but only 10ths. When I fill it I  spill out the overflow on the bottom almost exactly where it says it will. 

[johnb1]

I should have the data this week

John

 

[johnb1]

Well i finally have the information and resolution on my TKS reading accurately.  We sent the sending unit from the tank and the head unit directly to TKS.  They had problems getting it to read properly and with out explanation they sent it back working correctly and no charge.  I did learn one thing, each tks system should have an addendum in the POH and a graph that shows how much actual fluid is in the tank vs what is reading on the head unit.  They explained that the way the tank is shaped it is impossible to measure it accurately for full to empty.  Most of the way down the graph you have slightly more fluid than the readout.  I guess it is a safety factor.

Regards

John

N782JB

[KSMooniac]

Good to hear.  Too bad their unit had you do all of those earlier gymnastics and head-scratching. 

[johnb1]

I also have had my fuel sender issues resolved.  After dozens of hours at Modern Aero at Flying Cloud Airport we found the problem with the right tank fuel reading wrong.  As you all recall from a previous post i would top off and the right tank would continue to show full and sometime late in a flight the gauge would begin to move to empty.  After the third time we got the problem to stay a problem and the with the use of a bore scope they looked into the tank and saw the sender stuck in the up position.  It was  never the sender is was always the float catching on one of the screws that secure one of the plates on the top of the wing.  We tweaked the sender arm 1/4 away from that snag and all is perfect.  Just another way to chase an intermittent problem.

Glad it's fixed and glad to share my experience.

FYI-  Mooney Warranty was unwavering and stayed with me till the end.  Thanks Mooney, Your the Best.

John

N782JB