PTK

Go with the Aspen. Its a no brainer in my opinion. Cost is the same as G500 but functionality is way ahead of Garmin. The only thing the G500 can say is that it is bigger. So what?! The aspen is perfect, and not too big. GPSS is included in the Aspen too. I guess you wouldn't need it if you had no autopilot but if you fly a mooney that does not have an autopilot you are not doing any serious flying anyway so you don't need a g500 or an Aspen! People buy these things thinking they will add value to their plane. Fact is a good (King) autopilot prefereably with FD in my opinion adds more value to a mooney than any G500 or whatever, Go for FUNCTIONALITY. Aspen all the way.

What is wrong is that it has the critical components of the buy no buy decision process going against it. It is a 77 with a DATED 430 and facelift for a panel, MAJOR DAMAGE history, being sold by a used car (airplane) dealer, thusly OVERPRICED, who has to say "...as good as it gets for the money " !!?? Are you kidding me!! So it sits on the lot. Lot queen?! Oh it has that ugly red carpet! But you can change the carpet. You can never change the DAMAGE HISTORY. In my opinion I would never buy an airplane with major damage history at any price, and never from a dealer. There are plenty of clean airplanes out there. Deal directly with the seller. This is my opinion and it's worth more than you paid for it!

Our thoughts and prayers are with our friend. Get well and back in the air soon! Airplanes can be repaired/replaced.

Go with the J man! Go with the J.

Quote: scottaviation PK, if this is the mic holder circled in the pic your looking for I will have a look for you to make sure I didn't throw it out accidently when I removed my panels.

Quote: scottaviation PK, if this is the mic holder circled in the pic your looking for I will have a look for you to make sure I didn't throw it out accidently when I removed my panels.

Quote: Buster1 Velcro?

Quote: scottaviation I'll be home on Wednesday and when I get down to the hangar I'll have a look to see if it is still attached to my old side panel. I don't think I'll be putting it back when I install new interior panels. Chris

Quote: KSMooniac I have no idea why you keep calling the 400/500 series VFR boxes...they make single-pilot IFR an absolute breeze for this IFR pilot. I learned on VOR/NDB and if I was lucky, a DME. I used a KNS-80 for a little bit too, and there cannot be any sane argument that the 400/500 series are more difficult than old-school! They are/were a wonderful advancement for GA flying, and I know a buddy in the USAF (B-1 pilot) that nearly cried when I showed him what my lowly Mooney can do. I predict King might finally get ready to deliver the KSN770 later this year, and they will be promptly trumped by Garmin with their next-gen navigators that will do more, at a lower price to boot. OSH will probably reveal this... Much like King finally released their PFD, at the same price as the G500 (PFD + MFD).

Does anyone know where I can get a mic holder for the J. This little black colored holder which screws on the left front post with two screws and in meant to hold the mic. Some where along the way I lost it and would like to replace it. Any ideas?? I don't use a mic separate like this I use my headset mic but I would like to replace it. Thanks.

Quote: allsmiles I've now read several posts to the effect that the GNS-430 was designed as a VFR GPS. Is this opinion or fact? Can you post a link to the source of this information? Also, the majority of the reviews I've read, both in print and on aviation blogs, hail the GNS-430 as a tremendous advantage over the systems it replaced, including the KNS-80 and early King GPSes. I have read Mr. Greenspun's negative review, and even he admits in the end that the only alternatives are the GNS-480 or a full glass cockpit solution. What I read from most of the posst here is that folks agree that the GNS-430 is far from perfect, but it's the best value for the price. The KSN-770, at a suggested retail price of $14k, may be a reasonable competitor to the GNS-530W after it is released and has some time in the field to work out initial bugs. I had originally heard it was supposed to ship in 2008. Even if they manage to start shipments in 2010, it probably won't be until 2011 or 2012 that it can be considered reliable enough to go up against the Garmin products. I'm not trying to say that no one should bother competing. I'd be thrilled to see more competition in GPS mapcomms. I'm just saying that if I decided that I absolutely needed approach-capable GPS right now, I wouldn't wait around for two years just in case something incrementally better than Garmin might come out and might be similarly priced.

Quote: mjc I've now read several posts to the effect that the GNS-430 was designed as a VFR GPS. Is this opinion or fact? Can you post a link to the source of this information? Also, the majority of the reviews I've read, both in print and on aviation blogs, hail the GNS-430 as a tremendous advantage over the systems it replaced, including the KNS-80 and early King GPSes. I have read Mr. Greenspun's negative review, and even he admits in the end that the only alternatives are the GNS-480 or a full glass cockpit solution. What I read from most of the posst here is that folks agree that the GNS-430 is far from perfect, but it's the best value for the price. The KSN-770, at a suggested retail price of $14k, may be a reasonable competitor to the GNS-530W after it is released and has some time in the field to work out initial bugs. I had originally heard it was supposed to ship in 2008. Even if they manage to start shipments in 2010, it probably won't be until 2011 or 2012 that it can be considered reliable enough to go up against the Garmin products. I'm not trying to say that no one should bother competing. I'd be thrilled to see more competition in GPS mapcomms. I'm just saying that if I decided that I absolutely needed approach-capable GPS right now, I wouldn't wait around for two years just in case something incrementally better than Garmin might come out and might be similarly priced.

Quote: allsmiles I don't think that they have the 530 and 430 mounted in the same column. Scott (KSMooniac) has the 530/430 combo, and if I am not mistaken he reported some time ago that they would not fit in the same stack. They apparently have to be mounted side-by-side. Jim

Quote: JimR I don't think that they have the 530 and 430 mounted in the same column. Scott (KSMooniac) has the 530/430 combo, and if I am not mistaken he reported some time ago that they would not fit in the same stack. They apparently have to be mounted side-by-side. Jim

Quote: JimR I don't think that they have the 530 and 430 mounted in the same column. Scott (KSMooniac) has the 530/430 combo, and if I am not mistaken he reported some time ago that they would not fit in the same stack. They apparently have to be mounted side-by-side. Jim

How does it fit in other J's that have the 430/530 combo? Its the same structrure.

The x30 is a 13 year old box originally designed as a VFR box. With the exception of WAAS there have been no other improvements. According to some reviews, it is cumbersome to use and under the right circumstances can be dangerous. We would be doing ourselves a huge diservice if we discount the fact that Honeywell has a tremendous level of experience with sophisticated military and business jet systems. Honeywel, not Garmin, owns this arena. Do we not benefit from this when they bring it to us at GA prices?? Is there no value in this??? I think there is tremendous value in this!! We are all adults here and free to make our own decisions. The original question was to buy 430/530 or not. My opinion, and only my opinion, is to wait until the 770 comes out. It's nor vaporware as some have called it, it's coming. Honeywell did not develop it just to turn around and kill it. (Like Garmin killed the 480. They bought it and killed it. An awesome box it was and instead of improving upon it they killed it!!) Perhaps then Garmin will wake up and come out with something to answer to it. In the end we benefit. We the GA user benefits from the technology and possibly lower prices. This is only my opinion and its worth as much as you paid for it!

Quote: danb35 So, to do the same things you could do on your KNS80 takes more work on the 430W? That must be what you mean if you say that the 430W increases pilot workload, but I can't imagine how. Really, though, if you're satisfied with VOR/DME RNAV and have no need for GPS approaches, you don't need the 430W (nor do you need the 770). Seems you're awfully passionate about something you have no use for, though.

Quote: danb35 Again, the 430W does have a terrain database and an obstacle database. No, it won't do all of those things (though it will do some), but the answer to "how low can you go without notifying ATC" is 7000', your last assigned cruising altitude. Really, though, how can you say that it increases workload? Again, compared to what? There is no other product, or even combination of products, on the (light GA) market today that does what the 430W/530W does. If your workload is higher with a 430W than without one, doing the same set of operations, I'd like to hear what's in your panel and what those operations are--because my workload is definitely lower, and there are some things I can do now that simply weren't possible before installing it. It's worth pointing out that Garmin's "monopoly" exists only because nobody has chosen to compete with them in the 13 years that the x30 has been on the market, with the exception of the Apollo CX80. There are plenty of competing avionics manufacturers, but no competing products. Why is that? I suspect it's because nobody else has been able to come up with a superior product for the same money. If they had, they'd be marketing it, and eating Garmin's lunch, but that hasn't happened. King's "product" is vaporware, and has been for nearly 3 years.

I'd go to DUGOSH in Kerville. Wouldn't go to the factory. They have a bunch of inexperienced kids. Dugosh all the way.

Quote: allsmiles

Quote: MB_M20F

In the J its a non issue. The long bodies however do exhibit an aggravated negative angle of attack in the horizontal tail in the trimmed (almost full nose up) landing configuration. This is further aggravated by use of flaps and by the slip itself. At a safe altitude the airplane will nose down going through a phase of loss of control until the horizontal tail starts flying again. AFTER LOSS OF CONSIDERABLE ALTITUDE. Personally I don't want ANY loss of aircraft control and I cannot afford abrupt loss of altitude in the landing phase of flight!

Quote: danb35 I installed a 430W in '48Q almost 2 years ago. If I hadn't, the LORAN in the panel wouldn't work any more, so I'd be down to a 155 and a 170. Not the end of the world by any means, but far from optimal. Yes, the King 770 looks nice. If they ever get it to market, and the price they list on their web site actually holds, I expect it will be very popular. I'm somewhat skeptical of both of those contingencies, though--the product has been vapor for nearly three years (not four years, as I'd previously mentioned). I'm not a Garmin apologist, but I think it's pointless to call the 430/530 "overpriced" when there's nothing else on the market that does what it does--your only frame of reference for "overpriced" is what you feel like it ought to cost. I'd like to see some competition out there--it should reduce prices and improve the products. But for now, and until you can go to your local avionics shop and hold a KSN770 in your hand, if you want a WAAS GPS, you want a Garmin.

Quote: danb35 I don't agree that the Greenspun article is a particularly good review--the biggest hole is what is it compared to. There's simply nothing else on the market that competes with the 430/530 line. There was the 480, which I understand did a lot of things better, but it's long since discontinued. There's the King unit, but it's been "real soon now" for something like the last 4 years. Fact is, if you are looking for an IFR GPS/COM today, you're looking for a Garmin. If you want a WAAS GPS, you're looking for a Garmin. There's simply no competition out there. I think there should be, but wishing doesn't make it so. If King ever gets their product to market, hopefully that will benefit both of their products, and drop prices, but it isn't there yet.