Skates97

Hey everyone, I'm just a "future mooney owner" working on my PPL. I do have a blog for family and friends where I am posting my adventures but if it's okay with everyone here I would love to share them with you and welcome any advice and encouragement you want to offer. I can post a link to the blog post when I make them or just paste the whole post here for easy reading. I'm fairly new to your forum, so if my posts are too long and laborious just say so. I know a lot of what is in them is basic info but it's mainly meant for family and friends with little to no knowledge of flight. (With the exception of my dad who was a pilot in the Air Force. So, here is my latest post from my flight last Friday: More Landings and Playing Around at Ontario International Another hot day of flying with the temperature at 95 degrees and the winds out of the West. Today we went up in the Cherokee 180 so it was nice to have a little more power than the 140's. I am comfortable talking with ground and the tower now, although I still stumble around and forget to include some things with my responses back to Air Traffic Control (ATC). Fortunately the folks in ATC are very patient and will continue to ask until they get back the response they are looking for. I must say that the controllers at Chino (KCNO), Riverside (KRAL), and Ontario (KONT) are great! More on that shortly. I requested a departure to the East and we were given clearance to take off. We made our crosswind and then turned downwind headed East toward KRAL. It was at that point that my CFI realized his iPad was on the fritz and he started trying to remember the ATIS frequency for Riverside from memory. I told him I had my Pilots Guide binder in my bag behind my seat but he fished around on the dial and found it. In the meantime I had made a turn to the South so we wouldn't end up in KRAL's airspace before contacting them. (He also got his iPad working again). We listened to the ATIS info and I contacted Riverside requesting touch and go's. My CFI laughed at me as I had reported my location about two miles away from where I really was, which doesn't sound like much but when you are only about 5 miles away and flying about 110mph it can make a difference. The tower told us to enter on the downwind and report when there so we did. We were the only ones in the pattern at the time so we came around for the touch and go. My landings are getting progressively better and I am doing much better staying on glide path and using throttle to make my corrections to rate of descent while maintaining the proper speed. We did the touch and go and were given "right closed traffic" so made our turn to the right and came around the pattern for another touch and go. The winds were from 270 degrees at 19 knots which was perfect for the active runway, 27. We turned to final and there was a helicopter that contacted the tower. The tower informed them of the "Cherokee on final (us)" and to "Maintain separation." The helicopter informed the tower that he "had the traffic (us) in sight" and would maintain separation. As our ground speed was fairly slow given the 19 knot headwind and our airspeed on final, the helicopter was actually overtaking us. This resulted in my CFI saying "You could get passed by a helicopter" and a friendly jab over the airwaves at us that was all in good fun. My CFI said the other day he was out here at KRAL and they were the only ones in the pattern so they were doing touch and go's in a figure eight pattern, first on runway 27, then turning to the left and coming around on runway 34, then turning to the right and back to 27. He said he recognized the controller as the same guy from the other day and said he was going to request runway 34 to get me a crosswind landing. CFI: "Riverside tower, Cherokee 9514J, can we get runway 34 after this touch and go?" Tower: "14J, you know winds are 270 at 19?" CFI: "Yes, we'll give it a try." Tower: "14J, cleared for touch and go on runway 34." CFI: "Cleared for touch and go, runway 34, 14J." We made the touch and go on 27, banked to the left and came around for the crosswind landing on 34. I crabbed in and touched down right on the centerline and then we were off again. My CFI said, "Great job, that was a 19 knot crosswind at about 90 degrees and you put it right down the middle." I must admit that I was nervous about trying a crosswind landing but the Cherokee handled it well. Next we were off to Ontario and that made me nervous. I hadn't been to a big airport yet, and Ontario, while still a Class C airport, gets airliners, cargo planes, and all sorts of traffic. My CFI handed me his iPad with Foreflight running on it and said "Check your position, call into the tower and ask for touch and go's." (My mind went me? Those are the big boys over there. But he wasn't giving me an option so I got my position and made the radio call.) I have to say that the folks in the tower at KONT are super cool. What we did next I can only describe as "Playing around on the runways at Ontario." Keep in mind that we are just a little Cherokee 180 and they have other big traffic coming and going. You will see that yes, they are super cool in the tower and willing to let the little kid play on their playground. We were given a straight in on runway 26R which surprised my CFI as that is the runway closest to the terminal and he said usually they bring the airlines in there and keep folks like us over on 26L. My CFI said "Just be ready because they may have us shift over to 26L", but they didn't and we touched down on 26R and took off again with right closed traffic. As we were coming downwind to our base turn there was a "UPS Heavy" that had landed on 26L and another big plane take off from 26L so we were advised caution for wake turbulence. However, by the time we came around and were on final enough time had passed that we didn't have to worry. As we were on base my CFI asked the tower if after we did our touch and go, if we could be cleared for a landing on 8R for a simulated engine failure. The tower quickly gave clearance (did I mention those guys are cool?) and after touching down and beginning our climb out my CFI said that we were going to have an engine failure about the time we would be making our turn to crosswind, 500 ft above ground level (AGL). We reached that point and as I got ready to start my turn, my CFI pulled the power and said "You just lost your engine." He then talked me through it, nose over to keep your speed, watch your bank, stay coordinated, keep the turn coming, watch your speed, over the runway and straighten out... We settled down about halfway down the very long (10,200') runway and then full power and back up in the air. The winds were 18 knots at 260 degrees so that helped a lot in making the turn. As we were climbing out my CFI asked the tower if we could make a turn and come right back for a teardrop entry to 26L for one more touch and go. Again the tower gave the clearance. After we were back at Chino I told him I was amazed that Ontario let us do all those things. He said that he has almost always received clearance from the folks in the tower there to do whatever he asked for. Like I said earlier, ATC at Ontario is awesome, and the only way I can describe it is that we got to play around on their runways. Anyway, back to the flight, we were heading for Chino and I called in for a landing and complete stop. The tower gave me clearance for 26R, but then my CFI had one more idea. He told me to call in and ask instead for a touch and go and then a landing on runway 3 for a simulated engine failure. ATC replied with something, which I didn't catch, I looked at my CFI and he said "Just say 14J" which I did and then asked him "What did he say?" He said the tower was basically taking it under advisement and they eventually came back with the clearance. We made the touch and go and started climbing out. The winds were 13 knots at 260 degrees. We got about 500' AGL and he said "You just lost your engine" and pulled the power. Same procedure as at KONT, watch the airspeed, keep my turn, stay coordinated. This time with the wind coming at an angle to runway 3 we didn't have it pushing us straight down the runway, but it was very evident as we came around that we were being pushed along. I settled it down fairly close to the centerline and we slowed down and turned onto the taxiway. I contacted ground and got the taxi clearance and we headed back to the hanger. The flight was a blast! One crosswind landing, one with a tailwind, one with a quartering tailwind, and my first experience talking with ATC and landing at a Class C airport. I was making the radio calls, except when my CFI started wanting to do the oddball landings at which point he took over the radios and I just flew the plane. Still a long way to go on my radio calls, but they are getting better all the time. Next up, I have to memorize the Emergency Procedures Check Lists, some more radio work, and get ready to solo.

You have some beautiful scenery to fly over up there.

We'll see, like I said in an earlier post I think I have an advantage in the availability of aircraft and VFR days. They have 4 Cherokee 140's and a 180 so I haven't run into any problems yet getting a plane. I have only been flying once a week but am going to start working in a late weekday afternoon flight as well as my Saturdays starting next week. My CFI still has a student at a different airport he was teaching and once he finishes up with that student he is going to be available on Sundays so then I will be able to get in my 2x a week without problems. I think your phrase "got my attention" describes my experience landing on the narrower runways. I didn't have a problem lining up, it was just the initial impression of how much narrower it was, and not really sure that I was ready for it. But, it all worked out just fine. It will be quite some time before I would think about a 30' wide runway. The 100' didn't feel much different than the 150', it was the 60' and 50' that were a huge step down. All in due time.

I'm having a blast! It wasn't the length of them that made me a little nervous, it was the width. One of the things I liked about learning at the airport I am is the very wide, very long runways. When you are trying to figure it all out it's nice to have the extra room. I just wasn't expecting to try landing on a narrow runway this soon but was able to put it down in the middle. When you've been landing on a 150' wide runway and you turn final and you are only looking at 50' it's a big difference. Yours sounds "challenging." I think it will be a bit before I would feel comfortable landing at a field like that. My dad has some good stories he tells about when he was flying C-130's and some of the places they put that bird down.

The runways I landed on Saturday got smaller and smaller. It was overcast and as we had run through all the maneuvers the last two flights my CFI wanted to go visit some other airports. He said that as I get ready to solo he wants to make sure that I am comfortable with other airports in the area in the event that something happens at Chino and the runway is closed while I am flying. If so I would be comfortable diverting to another airport. He also wanted to make sure we hit some non-towered airports to give me time on the radios there and another towered airport to give me experience talking to a different airport. The ceiling over Ontario to the north was a little low for us so he ruled that out for today. I was okay with that as I was a little nervous about going into a busy airport like Ontario with the jets they have landing there. Instead, the flight plan was directly south to Corona, KAJO (non-towered), Riverside, KRAL (towered), and then FLABOB, KRIR (non-towered). He said FLABOB, KRIR (non-towered) is his favorite airport to do pattern work and touch and goes at because of the downwind transition to base. As you are flying downwind you are flying directly at Mt. Rubidoux (not really a mountian but more a hill). However you fly right at it and when you make your turn to base you are very close to it. I mentioned smaller and smaller... I have been landing at Chino, KCNO with two runways to work with, 7000 x 150 and 4848 x 150. Plenty of room for a rookie to feel good about putting the plane down. First we headed to Corona with its runway of 3200 x 60. He had me making the radio calls and getting a good chuckle out of me mixing up the sequence that I was supposed to say things in. It all made sense and the other guy in the Cessna understood what I was saying, but I was obviously a rookie. Its still a good way to learn. I had landed as a passenger once before taking a ride with my friend in his Mooney, but as the pilot it is a different experience. But, I successfully made three landings there before we took off and headed to Riverside. (No touch and go's, it's not allowed on weekends and there are tall trees off the end of the runway so given my tendency to not put the plane down on the numbers it wouldn't have worked anyway. I contacted Riverside on our way in and he had me enter on the downwind and report in. We came around for the touch and go's. Riverside is interesting because as you are coming in there is a rise in the ground just before you reach the runway so it looks like the ground is coming up to you suddenly right at the end (it kind of is). KRAL's runway is 5401 x 100 so I was back to a wide runway. We did 5 touch and go's there and spent a few of the following a Cessna in the pattern. Good experience following someone. The first time I was behind her I was coming on the downwind and the tower brought her in on base and told me to follow her in. So I got to call out that I saw her and extended my downwind to come around behind. We then left Riverside for my CFI's favorite little airport, FLABOB. I mentioned small, well the runway at FLABOB is 3190 x 50. 50' wide does not look very wide when you've been landing on runways that are 150' wide. Sure enough, on the downwind we were pointed right at the mountain. Every time we turned to base we ballooned up a little because the winds pushed up the hill and carried us up a little too. We did three touch and go's there at FLABOB. On the last one we were coming in high so he showed me how to slip the plane to lose the altitude. We contacted Riverside again to transition through their airspace and then were back headed toward Chino. We had been talking a lot about stalls given some of the recent GA tragedies. He talked about how you can stall a plane out at any airspeed and wanted to show me. So I gave him the controls and he promptly stalled us out at 90 mph, well above our stall speed for clean configuration. That was followed by more discussion about the causes of stalls, warning signs, etc... We flew back and landed on the nice 150' wide runway at KCNO and the day was done. Another wonderful, fun, educational day up in the air. (I started up a blog to chronicle my training and future flights. Mainly so family can see what I'm up to but anyone else that's bored with nothing to do can follow along too . The link is in my signature.)

Fun times, I had my third flight on Saturday. (Hot, 95 degrees out and the plane climbed like a dog.) I had been listening to ATC at Burbank for a couple days in the office so was feeling pretty comfortable in trying my hand at it. I contacted ground for taxi clearance and then tower for takeoff clearance. During the flight my CFI called out everything over the radio when we were in the practice area but had me contact the tower on the way back in to ask for the clearance to do touch and go's. In the practice area we went through power on stalls, power off stalls, and steep turns. Much better on the steep turns this time. Next I told him I wanted to work turns around a point and s-turns so we needed to get to a lower altitude. He said, "Let's pretend you have an engine fire and go through those procedures" (ie: the quick way down...) I said "Ok, walk me through it." So we pulled power, put it in a 45 degree bank and pushed over heading down. He was talking me through the whole thing, I picked out a section of field that I thought we would reach and was clear of trees, power lines, etc... He approved so I rolled out lined up and stayed in the descent. He been talking the whole time about how the fire would be progressing and tells me "About now you probably won't be able to use your rudder pedals because if the fire hasn't made it through the firewall the heat has and your feet are going to hurt so bad you won't be able to use them." (I thought "Great...") We were getting close to the ground, I thought too close so started to pull back and he said "nope, not yet." Finally he said "Ok, level out, add the power back and bring us back up." He talked me through the whole thing again and the importance of getting on the ground as fast as possible. We did turns around a point, better but still needs work, and s-turns, again better but needs work and headed back for some landing practice. Landings were much improved. We did two and then he asked the tower if we could do a short final (I think that was the term). He said when we got even with the end of the runway on our downwind to pull power and I couldn't use it again until we were on the ground. I said "Ok" (and in my mind said "Seriously?") I went into a shallow bank and he had me head at an angle straight for the numbers, watch airspeed, straighten out and line up right at the end and touch down. Good experience. Power back in and up for one more time around the pattern. I put one notch of flaps in like normal at the end of the downwind but as we turned base to final he said "I want you to do this one without any flaps." So, flaps back up and we came in faster than normal but it wasn't bad, I just touched down further down the runway than normal but was still able to turn off onto the taxiway at the same place. Got my medical last week and we submitted for my student pilot license. By the time it shows up in the mail I should be ready to solo.

Most of you probably already know about this site, but http://www.liveatc.net/ will let you listen in to towers, ground, and approach for airports all over the world. I may be a bit of a nerd when it comes to this stuff, but it's pretty cool listening in, sometimes entertaining and often educational. KCNO where I am taking lessons from doesn't have a feed, but I have been listening to Burbank, KBUR, during the day off and on when I am in the office. They are a busy airport and have student pilots flying in and out too so you can hear the patience of ATC as they talk them through things at times. It helps me as I am trying to learn how to talk to ATC to hear the interactions, the cadence, what is and isn't said, etc... Richard

I'm just a rookie with a few hours under my belt so take this with a giant grain of salt. The first time I was doing steep turns going to the left was easy and going to the right was more difficult to hold my angle. I kept rolling back to about 35 degrees. My problem was looking too much out the right side which to me "felt" like I was banking too steep and I would shallow out. Yesterday I was back up and we were practicing steep turns again. This time I only glanced out the right side very briefly and spent most of my time looking out the front with glances down to my VSI and my attitude indicator to verify I was staying at the correct bank and altitude. Steep turns yesterday were spot on for me.

Hmmm... Are we talking by calendar date or hours? He has quite the head start on me. If we are talking hours I am putting money on myself just because after following his thread I have some advantages where I am learning. I have the advantage of having more VFR days at Chino than he does at Palo Alto. In fact Chino likes to boast they average 345 VFR days a year... Another reason I decided to go to Chino was I looked into all the schools around Orange County and into the Riverside area and the school out there has 4 Cherokee 140's and a 180 available so I can find an available plane just about any time. (Husky has been bumped a few times over plane availability and weather. Anyway, I'm just going to worry about myself and my progress. I wish him the best of luck and hopefully he will have his PPL sooner than later. If I can get there in fewer hours it just means more money left in the bank to shop for a plane when I am done.

Went back up Monday for my second flight and spent 2 hours working through power-on stalls, power-off stalls, slow flight, 45 degree turns, turns around a point, s-turns, and rectangular course. It was fun to get my feet wet on those different maneuvers. Some felt more natural than others, ie: 45 degrees turning to the left was not a problem but going to the right I kept decreasing the bank in my turn to about 30 degrees. I think it was the positioning of being visually higher up in relation to where I am sitting in the plane (left side higher up in a right hand bank than left hand). We did two more touch and go's followed by a landing to a complete stop. Much better this time when adding full throttle in the touch and go. I eased it in a little slower and compensated better with the right rudder. I still struggle with my visual reference on when to flare and want to flare too early. (All things in due time). Those poor landing gear struts on that Cherokee... Oh, and keeping my speed up on final approach.While pointing to my airspeed my instructor said "You might want to watch that so we don't end up in the field instead of on the runway..." Got my medical certificate today and going back up Saturday.

Yes, family was just along for the first flight which was going to be a discovery flight but turned into an actual training flight.

I have been afflicted with the ailment for probably close to 40 years. Grew up with dad in the Air Force, he was a pilot for many of his 20 years of service. The first symptoms showed up when I was about 5 yo. I was really sick and in an effort to cheer me up dad let me wear his flight helmet while I was lying there in bed. Yep, it put a smile on my face. Fast forward to when I was 8 yo and dad had been transferred to Elmendorf to fly HC-130's with the Air Rescue Squadron. It was then that my parents must have realized my affliction was terminal. We were staying in the bachelors officers quarters (funny having a family of 8 there) and from the window in one of the rooms I could see portions of the runway between the buildings. I would sit there for hours with a pencil and paper making tally marks to count up the types and numbers of different planes that would take off and land. It wasn't until my oldest sister had 7 boys of her own many years later that she said she finally knew how strange it was for an 8 yo boy to just sit at the window for hours watching planes take off and land. I had plans to go career Air Force but some political changes in the 90's changed my plans, that's a story for a different day. I played ice hockey as a kid in Alaska and roller hockey as an adult in Arizona, near your neck of the woods, there was a rink off somewhere around McClintock and Broadway if I remember right and one down in Chandler somewhere. Going back to my aviation bug affliction from my early years I have always loved call signs. So, the name Skates came about and the 97 on the end was Roenick's jersey number when he played for the coyotes (maybe my favorite player of all time). Never did inline speed skating but if you played roller hockey between about 1998-2002 there in Tempe we might have played against each other. Hoping to be a Mooney guy in the future here... I didn't know much about the planes until my friend who owns one introduced me. Went up on a flight with him and loved it, the more I read about Mooney's there more I liked them. What's next? Going flying again tomorrow. The plan is to get my license and then purchase an M20C/E. The typical mission will be my wife and I along with my youngest son going to Phoenix (275nm), Salt Lake (500nm), and Sacramento (340nm) to visit the family we have there. I think those planes would fit the mission well and looking at ones on the market right now would fit into the price range I am looking at. Thank you all for the warm welcome, Richard

Hello everyone, I've been wandering around your forums for a bit and registered a short time ago. First post, first flight. (I have a friend with a 1961 M20B that took me up for a ride with my youngest son a month ago, but I've never actually flown a plane). After a very long time waiting to begin flight training, it began today. It was going to be a "Discovery Flight" from Chino out to Catalina and back, but low clouds over Catalina changed that. Not wanting to wait another day (I've been waiting about 25 years) I asked if we could instead just fly anywhere... I had my wife and oldest son with me, they were coming along because it was again going to be a "Discovery Flight" and the flight school allowed them to ride along the entire time even though it was going to be an actual lesson. Let's say I had the time of my life! I have been flying flight sims on the computer since the first Microsoft Flight Sim back on a Tandy 1000. I was probably the only 12 year old that was plotting out where I was on a map in the back of the Flight Sim manual by using the VOR's in game while flying from New York to Martha's Vineyard. Anyway, I know computer flight sims aren't the real thing, but I think they helped some. First, steering with your feet takes some getting used to. (I will say that taxiing back to the hanger was a lot better than taxiing out to the runway.) I got to taxi and take off which was fairly uneventful. My wife was a bit nervous as we bounced around a little climbing out. I tried to prep her by telling her it wasn't going to be like taking off in an airliner, to think of it more that an airliner is the bus driving down the road and this would be more like a four wheel drive on a dirt road with some pot holes... Anyway, we went out over Lake Matthews and then down I-15 to Temecula. Straight and level all good, level turns, descending turns, climbing turns, all good. I felt pretty good after one turn, we were at 3,000' and he asked me to turn 180 staying at the same altitude without any gauges. He put his ipad over the gauges (you can see in one of the pics) and I began my turn. As I was leveling out coming out of the turn he said "You probably gained a little altitude and removed the ipad, I had only picked up about 50' and he said "Wow, that's spot on!" Yes I had a huge grin on my face. The whole time flying around he mostly just had his hands in his lap and telling me that I was going to make his job easy. We came back and did two touch and go's and then one more time around the pattern with a landing to a complete stop. The first two landings were pretty good, minimal input from the CFI. The only time I felt squirrely was after touching down, raising the flaps back up and pushing in full throttle. I have to get used to compensating the added power with some rudder (my CFI helped with that). The last landing we were coming in a little faster than we should so went to idle and he helped with bleeding off some speed. Felt pretty good to be told I was only the second student he has let land on their first flight. Take aways... My brain went backwards a couple times and pushed the throttle in when I was meaning to decrease power. That will come with repetition. Biggest take away... brake pedals are independent... CFI didn't have any brakes on his side, yep I was a little side to side as we slowed down after our last landing. I was not aware that the brake pedals were independent. I'll make sure I have even pressure on them next time out. Did I say before that I had the time of my life!? Going back up again Monday afternoon for my second lesson.