glafaille

Bonal: Yes, I have. And sent several emails to two of the sellers. No response. I think the ads are old, they haven't changed in a couple of months.

Concerning my second choice (Barnstormer Ad); I found out today, after driving 6 hours each way this weekend to see the plane, while offering to buy at his asking price, that the seller is not willing to repair any squawks whatsoever, airworthiness or otherwise. Either now or after the pre-buy. Strictly as-is, where-is. He said he recently dropped the price and now there is no room to fix anything. Wish I knew that before blowing a weekend and the gas and hotel. Oh well, part of the game! Guess I'm still looking for a plane.

Jetdriven: Thanks for your observation. You may be right, but after looking at the wingtip in person it appears to be resticted to the tip plate and not to the wing structure and only very slightly to the aileron. I am a little concerned about it, but I think it is still worth pursuing the sale and finding out what Don Maxwell thinks about it. I have alerted the seller that it may be a problem.

It wasn't a total re-seal, it was a repair but it has held for 5 years now so maybe it will hold a while longer. GSXRpilot, you are correct, Don Maxwell did the tank repair in 2010.

Already talked to Don. The annual in 2010 was extensive. Replaced all the shock disks and 1 cylinder in the engine, fixed multiple fuel leaks, seat track bearings, and a bunch of little stuff. Almost an entire logbook page of typewritten items. I have a few more questions for Don, waiting on a call. Anyone know the cost to comply with SB 208B?

What do you guys think of this one. Went to see it last weekend. I like it and am seriously considering tendering an offer, but it does have a few minor issues. AD on prop hub, 22 year old overhaul, single nav/comm, SB 208B not done, dent on the right tip plate (minor), and the rudder trim tab is tweaked a fair bit to the left. Something a bit off somewhere with the rigging, although Don Maxwell rigged it in 2010. On the other hand it went to Maxwell's for an annual in 2010 and has a nice working tracking autopilot with altitude hold, recent shock disks, nice paint, fair interior, VFR GPS, no visible corrosion, no visible fuel leaks and an attractive price. It has flown regularly over the past few years. Oh, yea. Comes with a pair of Bose headsets and a Stratus 2.

Here are my thoughts with the green C model in Spring Branch- 1. No prop strike inspection per the Lycoming SB 2. The panel needs re-arranging $2000 3. The price is very high considering 1 & 2 above 4. I don't NEED GPS and don't want to pay for it. Nice to have yes, but would rather have a solid engine. 5. Top prop and speed mods are certainly a GOOD thing. 6. 1964 and earlier have a different cowl, engine access is more difficult 7. Multiple cylinder replacements over past 5 years, about 1 per annual. Why?

The green C model that experienced the gear up landing DID NOT have the engine torn down and inspected per the Lycoming prop strike SB. I'll pass on that one.

I went to Spring Branch last week and saw David. I didn't have a lot of time as we got there about 4:00 and they stayed late for us till about 6:00. I didn't see anything in the current inventory that met my requirements at my price point. I enjoyed the visit though.

Gentlemen- I just received the following email from the seller: Mr. LaFaille,The owner does not want the plane to leave Lubbock for inspection. Please advise your intentions at this point, thank you.Vice President/General ManagerLubbock Aero I'll certainly pass on this deal and keep looking. Thanks to all for the comments.

When I win the lottery I'm going to buy one of these so all of us can go look at the plane, anywhere, with our families, and take mechanics, and parts! Who wants shotgun?

Bonal- No worries buddy! It's all good. Just me a bit tired from all the driving over the weekend with little to show for it. To find a suitable 50 year old airplane is not an easy task. One must learn many skills related to online shopping of airplanes and telephone shopping. You have to learn exactly what to ask, how to ask for it and how to ask for it again and again. Then when you think you have enough info, you have to drive to where the plane is, and know exactly what to look for when you see it, and know bad stuff when you see that. It's a skill set that is not easily acquired or inexpensive. Trial and error is a big part. Plus the more you learn, the more difficult it becomes to find airplanes that meet your new standards. A tedius process indeed. Thank you for your comments and I apologize to you and everyone if I seem a bit "testy" from time to time.

Carusoam- I am a 59 year old professional pilot so not new to aviation. I am new to aircraft ownership, this will be my first and probably only aircraft purchase. My son is out of college, it's just my wife and I, so we have some spare change. We live in a small town and want to do some traveling together as well as visit my son who lives on the East Coast and other family living in Denver and California. My job allows me a bit extra time off for travel, but no free airline passes. I am not a mechanic but am familiar with maintenance of corporate jets, which is part of my problem. I expect "corporate jet" record keeping with 50 year old Mooneys. Not going to find it! My total experience with flying Mooneys is a 10 minute re-position of a 201 for a friend who needed his plane moved to an avionics shop. Seemed to fly nice. I think my biggest problem learning to fly a Mooney will be in flying 80 mph on final, anything less than 130 knots makes me nervous! I'll keep to LONG runways for a while! I didn't start at the lowest price, I sort of ended up at Walmart because I couldn't find what I wanted at Macy's. Nothing out there that met my requirements in my upper price range so I'm looking elsewhere, digging through the "bargain bin". You never know!

The process is much like walking through a minefield. Proceed slowly and with great care, your next step could hurt! Carusoam: The plan is much like you listed as option 1. Find out as much as possible, negotiate the pre-buy terms, establish a price range, go see it, purchase agreement, escrow some dough, seller flies it to Maxwell's, pre-buy, negotiate, insure, pay money, fly with instructor. Almost forgot. Take pictures and show my friends on mooneyspace! Ask for more help from you guys when stuff breaks! The good news is I work across the runway from Don Maxwell. If I ever score a plane, you guys have someone with a plane to fly you home after you drop your plane at Don's.

Bonal- I can't afford to spend $200,000 on an airplane, heck my house is worth less. I'm glad that you can afford the nicer stuff though. However, I have no problem spending up to $55,000 on the right airplane. The problem is, over the last 4 months I haven't seen an airplane in that price range, meeting my requirements, without significant issues like missing logbooks, 25 year old overhauls, obvious corrosion, wrinkled fuselage skins, obvious damage, run out engines, extensive owner performed maintenance, etc. Sometimes the problem is that the plane is located in a difficult to reach area of the country, or just too far away. Sometimes the owner is the problem, they don't know how to email pictures, use drop box etc. "Just come see it, you'll love it!". Often owners don't have a clue about their airplane. Not a clue what's in their logbooks, and they neglected to perform a pre-buy or had one done by a local A&P without Mooney experience. Found some corrosion on a plane with a well documented corrosion repair of the spar cap. Found more in the wheel well and tail. The owner swore there was no corrosion on the plane and no history of corrosion. Guess he never read the logbooks or 337s. Drove 450 miles each way to see that! Being the kind of person that leaves no stone unturned, I'm now forced to explore the lower end of the market in the hopes something can be found and improved to my needs without exceeding my budget. Sure, the real answer is to buy a new one. It's quite possible that owning a plane is beyond my financial resources.

It's my understanding that the airplane was based at or near Lubbock Aero who did the last two annuals. Lubbock Aero is a Mooney Service Center and acquired the listing for the aircraft. So at this point the listing broker is the maintenance facility that performed the annuals. Not the best situation. I guess it comes down to whether or not they were representing the aircraft when they did the annuals. All the more reason to do a pre-buy somewhere else. I do not have the workorders from the last two annuals but I will try to get them.

gsxrpilot Great advice, thanks! You have given me my marching orders. Tomorrow I'll be asking a few new questions that you provided, some I haven't considered. I think the first question will concern the pre-buy at Maxwell's. If he won't agree to that, there isn't much point in further discussion. Hopefully, I'll have some news tomorrow. Thanks also for the transportation offer! I'll buy lunch and gas!

I live in Tyler, Texas about 45 miles West of Don Maxwell and 100 miles East of Dallas. It's probably almost as fast to drive to Lubbock as it is to drive to Dallas Love, get through TSA, and do the entire airline thing. No deals on Southwest anymore, $230 each way to Lubbock! I can fly to Boston for half as much. I remember when Southwest sold tickets for the last flight to Houston from Love Field for $15.00!

MB65E Just looking for advice from those more experienced. Buying any 50 year old airplane is a financial gamble which I am prepared to take, but at the same time I don't want to be foolish. Sometimes I get "Tunnel Vision" and need a reality check. I just spent a weekend driving over 1000 miles looking at 2 airplanes, one of which was nothing like it was described. The other was generally as described and is a contender though lacking in a couple of areas. It's not a cheap or pleasant process (I hate to drive). It seems that most planes are located in the most remote areas of the country, I guess thats why folks have planes. I feel like I should leave no stone unturned, but at the same time, my funds and time are limited. I ask for advice to help me decide which prospects I should investigate. Most of the time it's easy to decide but this particular case begs for the opinions of others with more experience. Thanks to you and everyone for your comments. I read them several times over, and pick up on different points each time through.

Thanks guys - Keep the advice coming. I'm hearing a guarded "Go for it" but be very careful as voiced by Yetti. I don't mind a 6 to 12 month period of above average squawks, but I sure don't want a project. At the right price, a more detailed pre-buy might be prudent, something closer to an annual. Certainly I'll pull a cylinder, stick a boroscope in the engine and look hard at the cam. Plus send in an oil sample, maybe the whole filter! I guess, like every airplane deal it all comes down to condition and price. Hopefully the condition is as it appears.

I've been looking for an M20C or E for several months now and found an interesting prospect. It is a 1965 model and flew as normal with an engine overhaul in 1997. It flew about 500 hours up through 2002 and then was parked in a hangar until 2013. No annuals were performed during this time but it was parked in a dry climate area. In 2014 and 2015 annuals were performed by a Mooney Service center but the airplane has still flown less than 10 total hours since 2002. The interesting thing is the airplane appears in the pictures to be a "Time Capsule". The interior looks excellent, the panel clean and obviously updated before it was parked. The flight instruments are in standard 6 pack order, decent late 1990's avionics, even an early Garmin GPS. Easily the cleanest looking Mooney I've seen thus far although I have not seen it in person. It's 450 miles away from my home, so quite a drive. I have not seen the logbooks but the broker says they are complete except for the propeller logbooks prior to 1988. It appears that some 337s may be missing and maybe an STC for the one piece windshield. Here is the listing: http://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/1298375/1965-mooney-m20c-mark-21 I know the price is too high as it stands now but I'm pretty sure he'll take less. So what do you guys think, can I trust the engine or should it be overhauled immediately? How about the airframe? I don't see a trim knob for the PC system so I don't know the status of it at this time. I would insist on a pre-buy at a nearby MSC, hopefully Maxwell's in Longview which is 450 sm away, maybe a closer MSC. Worth driving 6 hours each way for a look or should I pass? Thanks to all!

I get the hassle of flying the airplane somewhere for the pre-buy, but lets not forget the even greater hassle the buyer may have endured to go visit the airplane. I just drove 400 miles to see an aircraft that may or may not be as represented. Then I get to drive 400 miles back. Seems like a relatively small matter to FLY the aircraft an equal distance for a pre-buy.

OK. Thanks gents. I will plan for one day maybe an overnight. I hope something works out soon, I'm getting tired of driving!

Been looking for a Mooney for several months now. My wife and I have been taking road trips to look at anything within a days drive from our home in East Texas. I'm looking at a couple of propects this weekend, both are 400 sm away from me. My preferred pre-purchase maint shop is near me (Maxwell Avn) and about 350 sm from sellers. If I schedule a pre-purchase "inspection", how many days will it take? If the buyer flies in first thing in the morning, is it expected he will wait for completion and then fly the airplane back home or airline home and leave the plane? Thank you for the help gentlemen.