mrjones30

Quote: fantom I'm talking lazy questions, not dumb ones. Hard to totally ignore them when I'm obsessive enough to skim over everything on MS. While we have lots of wrong answers around here, we don't have any dumb ones. Please don't trust our answers anymore than you do Google's....they all need to be judged by a lifetime in aviation, and I'm not so sure there are any totally wrong ones. Glad to know you're a computer guy (who can't figure out how to fill in a profile, or add his real name in the signature block ) because I was starting to worry you might be either a dentist, or a high school student. An excellent publication I suggested to you a while ago is Flight Sense, which will anser a myriad of the questions you have, and will, ask. You can download it here: http://www.faa.gov/library/manuals/aviation/media/faa-h-8083-19A.pdf It's all good, now go hit those King videos!

Quote: fantom Google is your Friend! Someone thinks you're too lazy to use Google before asking a question, at least until you start looking at those KING lessons. Sorry, but I couldn't help it.

Quote: Parker_Woodruff Yup. Don't plan on being able to take 4 people that far in an M20TN. You might get 1 or 2 pax that far on a good day. Otherwise, you're too heavy. That said, we don't know how far a Cirrus Jet will *really* be able to go with a full pax load... The good news is the Acclaim is actually an available airplane at this point in time...

For the record, I know these are entirely different airplanes but I happened to see an advertisement for the Cirrus Sf50 with a hefty price tag of 2 Million dollars so I decided to look at the performance specs of the aircraft and here is what I found: Cirrus Vision SF50 General characteristics Crew: one (pilot) Capacity: six passengers Length: 30.9 ft (9.4 m) Wingspan: 38 ft 4 in (11.68 m) Height: 10.5 ft (3.2 m) Powerplant: 1 × Williams FJ33 , 1,900 lbf (8.5 kN) thrust Performance Cruise speed: 300 kn (345 mph; 556 km/h) Stall speed: 61 kn (70 mph; 113 km/h) Service ceiling: 28,000 ft (8,500 m) With a 345 mph cruise speed I thought that was pretty impressive but I wasn't impressed with the range which is 1,000nm-1100nm. For 2 Million or more I thought the range would be much higher so I decided to compare it with a Mooney M20TN Acclaim. Here are the specs: Mooney M20TN Acclaim General characteristics Crew: one pilot Capacity: 3 passengers Length: 26 ft 9 in (8.15 m) Wingspan: 36 ft 5 in (11.1 m) Height: 8 ft 4 in (2.5 m) Wing area: 175.7 sq ft (16.3 m²) Airfoil: NACA 63-215 Empty weight: 2370 lb (1074 kg) Loaded weight: 3374 lb (1528 kg) Useful load: 1004 lb (454 kg) Max. takeoff weight: 3374 lb (1528 kg) Powerplant: 1 × Continental TSIO-550-G Turbo-normalized with twin turbo and dual intercoolers air-cooled, 6-cylinder, horizontally opposed piston engine, 280 hp (171 kW) Performance Maximum speed: 242 knots (278 mph, 448 km/h) Cruise speed: 237 knots (272 mph, 438 km/h) Range: 1445 nm (std tanks) (1662 mi, 2676 km) Service ceiling: 25,000 ft (7625 m) Rate of climb: 1240 ft/min (378 m/min) Wing loading: 19.2 lb/ft² (96 kg/m²) Power/mass: 12.0 lb/hp (0.11 kW/kg) I'm not going as fast as a Cirrus but the Mooney has comparable numbers with a 2 MILLION DOLLAR PLANE! Pricing this Mooney out you can get one for 500k. That is a 1.5m Dollar savings! I don't know about you but I would take the Mooney any day. If I needed to bring other passengers I could have them fly private back and forth and still it would not come out to 1.5M!! It goes to show you how incredible Mooney's are! (Now back to my studying :-)

Quote: jelswick I cracked up at Lew's post as well seeing it this morning. One thing fun MrJones once you have your IR and I think good practice is to flight plan yourself at an altitude that puts you into the clouds on days that the cloud layer is only a few thousand feet thick and not too low. In that way, you know you have an easy out up or down if you need it, but it gets you comfortable flying not being able to see outside and makes the days when you "need to" (shouldn't be days when too many of us really need to if flying isn't our living) when there are not such easy outs much less stressful. The other 2 cents I'd add is to buy something with weather for the cockpit even if just a used Garmin 396 or 496. People flew without them before for many years, but there's something very comforting seeing the weather yourself on that rather than relying just on your pre-planning and ATC to avoid it. Just remember that Nexrad can be many minutes old, so use it for strategic avoidance rather than tactical (e.g. trying to pick your way through). You're in for a lot of fun ahead. Enjoy it and best of luck!

Quote: 201Pilot One CFII told me, "More pilots have slept with Martha King than any other woman in America!" That was funny!!! I guess most pilots are into Cougars/Mature women :-)

Quote: aerobat95 I would go ahead and start on your instrument rating. Here is the catch....just because you have it doesn't mean go out on your next flight and fly to minimums. It is my opinion that flying under the hood while good is not at all comparable to flying in hard IFR. Its just not the same. So take it easy. The one good thing about starting your IR after you PPL is it will make you a better and safer pilot. The other nice thing is that you will have the knowledge and skill set to help you get out of the weather. Even though I am instrument rated I don't like to fly in hard IMC. Its just no fun. The nice thing though is climbing through the weather and flying at 10k or 11k in VMC above all the crap weather. Can't do that unless you have a IR. So I know I ramble...but I would do it. You will be a better prepared pilot. Just know your limits.... Exactly, I want to learn IR just in case, not because I want to fly in all of the bad weather I can find. Sometimes if you ask for trouble, you just might get it. I think the best thing you can do for yourself as well as your family and friends that go up with you is to know as much as you can, Just in case. What you don't know can and will hurt you, short or long term.

Quote: aerobat95 I would go ahead and start on your instrument rating. Here is the catch....just because you have it doesn't mean go out on your next flight and fly to minimums. It is my opinion that flying under the hood while good is not at all comparable to flying in hard IFR. Its just not the same. So take it easy. The one good thing about starting your IR after you PPL is it will make you a better and safer pilot. The other nice thing is that you will have the knowledge and skill set to help you get out of the weather. Even though I am instrument rated I don't like to fly in hard IMC. Its just no fun. The nice thing though is climbing through the weather and flying at 10k or 11k in VMC above all the crap weather. Can't do that unless you have a IR. So I know I ramble...but I would do it. You will be a better prepared pilot. Just know your limits.... Exactly, I want to learn IR just in case, not because I want to fly in all of the bad weather I can find. Sometimes if you ask for trouble, you just might get it. I think the best thing you can do for yourself as well as your family and friends that go up with you is to know as much as you can, Just in case. What you don't know can and will hurt you, short or long term.

So my plan is: #1 Throuoghly study and pass all of the King courses. #2 Read and understand my two pilot books certified by FAA. #3 Then take my PPL. #4 Immediately, start taking my Instrument Rating. It's a lot of work but I enjoy reading about Airplanes and flying.

Quote: Antares YES. And you don't have to do the cross country requirement if you go into a part 141 instrument program. Have you started your PPL training yet? I might also add that the IR may have saved my life one night I ended up in inadvertent IMC at night. You do not see clouds ahead of you at night until you're in them. The effect of pushing through broken clouds at 140+ mph when you don't see them coming can be extremely disorienting and you must trust your instruments. The IR gives you the proficiency to watch them. I haven't started the PPL training yet, I was going to go to BayAir down here in Saint Pete but they mentioned that they are having leasing issues with the city. If the city takes over Bayair will be no more. So I checked out Cams flight on Friday and I'm going to look at a few others this next coming week, (Plant City Airport comes to mind). In the meantime while I'm looking I ordered the King learn to fly courses and I have it with me right now...This is good stuff. The videos look a little outdated and yes, the jokes are a little cheesey, but how can you forget "Red and White and you're alright" :-)

Quote: DaV8or Good plan. Focus on the license for now. Learn to fly in somebody else's airplane. My only exposure to the Kings courses was a sample video I watched when I started and I met them once at an AOPA convention. At the time when I was going for the PPL, I decided I learned better from a book and chose not to use their tapes. I used the Jeppesen book (my favorite) and the ASA book. I never atteded any ground school to pass the writen, just used the books and the test prep book. However, today it wouldn't surprise me if somebody isn't offering an online course. That would be the best of both worlds. Kind of a book with videos. Have you looked into online courses? No I haven't but Kings videos are learn at your own pace so that will help me out even more. Also what I do is record the teaching on a CD and play it in my car so I can hear it over and over again.

The reason for IR is because I want to be a safe pilot and I want to know what to do in case of bad weather. I read somewhere that a lot of accidents happen because of bad weather.So I want to limit my risk. Flying is only a hobby of mine but I will take it very seriously everytime I go up. I just want to be as prepared as I can. Why not know as much as you can? Thank you

So I ordered the "Learn to fly" course from King Schools and it should arrive tomorrow. This will be the start of my training. I will study the courses and then I will read and study 2 FAA approved books and then I will take the full Flight training, (Ground School, 40 hours...etc). Has anyone taken the courses from King Schools...What did you think about it? (I decided not to go to Mooneymart as of yet, Instead I'm going to concentrate of getting my PPL first and then worry about buying a plane later) Thanks for that advice, you know who you are. :-)

Quote: sreid If you really want to use your instrument rating to fly IMC and use your airplane to go places in various weather conditions, I recommend flying for a period of time (~ a year or whatever it takes) to gain experience using a light airplane to travel. It takes a while to learn how to make critical decisions in real time when flying in various weather systems, going to new airports, operating in conditions that you just can't train in, in the 40 hours to get the private. In my opinion, this is the reason the feds require 50 hours cross country PIC prior to qualifying for an instrument rating. A lot of folks fly 50.5 nm cross country flights to buy a soda, turn around and come home, repeat 50 times, with the only goal of logging the required time for the instrument rating. This is one way of doing it, but in my experience if you want to be ready to fly IMC to go places when you get your rating, you're better off if you learn how to do it VFR first, without the added complications of not being able to see where you're going! Good point, My thinking was, take it all in one shot while everything is fresh in my mind. I love to travel and I will definitely take my plane across the United States, (I have family on the west coast). I will rack up the time but I'm just concerned that I might come across weather that I am not ready to handle as of yet.

So, I decided on not going to Mooney Mart tomorrow and sitting in a Mooney just yet. Right now my time should be better spent obtaining my PPL. I'm getting the King Schools course in the mail tomorrow and I'm going to absorb it like a sponge. Has anyone had any experience with Kings PPL course? What did you think of it? Thank you

I'm pretty much going to be asking a

Quote: 1964-M20E The IR is another minimum of 40 hours with a minimum of 15 with the instructor. The written is a bear and possibly the worst part of the training. Enjoy flying VFR for a while building some short X-country hours you will need them anyway. Start looking at the Low Altitude Enroute charts and the approach plates and learning the symbols Get flight following on your cross country flights, learn and work the system Make touch and go landings at towered airports in radar service areas, B, C TRSA etc. Find a pilot friend have him be your safety pilot and get used to flying straight and level under the hood (you should have done some hours under the hood already) and navigation by using radio fixes. I did a 2.5 hour X-country under the hood long before I started my official IR work. Learn to tell where you are with only the ground based VORs, ADF etc. first then start using the GPS. If you can find yourself with the VOR then you will never get lost with GPS or when GPS is not available. Get one of the video training series sporty’s or king and watch them with a pot of coffee Then when you feel you are ready start with an instructor I ordered the "Learn to fly" from King schools I should get it tomorrow. I will dive right into it read and study 2 FAA approved books, (278 pages each) and then I will take the training. Hopefully I will be up to speed

Quote: eaglebkh Go for the IR! Flying IFR can simultaneously be the most stressful yet rewarding thing you do with clothes on...

Quote: 1964-M20E Take a month or two off and enjoy flying for a while but by all means go get it. I got my PPL in 1987 and I'm just getting around to my IR. I started just before Christmas and it has put somewhat a damper on flying because of the work even though I took two long xcountry flights each about 480nm since starting my IR. I'm hoping to finish up my IR this weekend if mother nature cooperates. What is required to receive your IR? Is it a tough course to take?

Thanks guys, I asked this question because I just read the stats on GA accidents and most fatalities happen because of flying in bad weather. I'm just thinking of ways to limit risk, (You can't eliminate it all together). What do you have to do to be certified in IR? Thank you

As a beginner pilot is it a good idea to go for my instrument rating right after my PPL? I want to increase the safety for myself, friends and my family members that want to fly with me. I also understand that weather changes all of the time..sometimes very quickly and I would like to be ready for it. Thank you,

As a newbie pilot I haven't had that much interaction with Patrick on these boards but I'm sure he would've helped answer questions like everyone else on this wonderful site. Any GA pilot in my mind are like family members, no matter what we fly, we fly in one big sky together. When he passed, he passed away doing something he loved and that is flying. My condolences goes out to his family and friends.

Quote: Antares If you're in St. Pete and are dead set on a Mooney, unless Parker's willing to help you with your PPL, I would recommend Bill A. at Bay Air at Albert Whitted for primary instruction. He's an excellent pilot, instructor, and owned a Mooney M20J for quite a while, so he may be able to offer you some pointers and help you to transition. I did look into Bay air, they are having lease issues with the city right now so as of today I'm considering Cams at KPIE Thank you

Quote: M20F-1968 I spent the first 15 years of my working life as a symphonic clarinetist. As such, I had years on one on one teaching culminating in studies with my mentor from high school until my mid-twenties. I have also taught one to one myself. It is a wonderful thing when you find some one who can share and is willing to give of their time and knowledge. You become friends and learn better because of the relationship. My mentor had several ways to trick his students into feeling and experiencing what he was trying to impart. The study of a musical instrument is in many ways like flying. The skills must become a part of you and actual experience at each jucture goes along way. Find someone who is knowledgeable and who you click with. But, lastly, and most importantly, take his knowledge to allow you to grow and ultimately be your own teacher. Read alot about flying when away from the airport and let that knowledge become part of your long term memory. In that way it will unconsciously alter almost every aviation decision you will make. At always be safe. John Breda

Quote: Mazerbase An airplane isn't a car. The time and effort put into perfecting a mass produced product like a car is orders of magnitude beyond that for a limited production, limited market product like our airplanes. Things that "pop up" can be very expensive and a little extra isn't really enough. Flying can be done at a reasonable expense but it isn't ever cheap. For me, flying is definitely worth the time, effort, commitment, and money and I recommend it to everyone to explore and decide but I wouldn't buy an airplane until I knew I liked to fly, could afford to fly, and understood my mission profile. I'll take the same heat as xftrplt and advise you to slow down. Get an instructor, take a demo flight, get some flight time and then decide. I'll also agree with Parker that a non-turbo Mooney isn't beyond a proficient private pilot's capabilities with good transition training (I'd probably avoid the turbo models as they do take a lot more attention as does higher altitudes). I will also reiterate that going to Mooney Mart is a bad idea. People tend to incorporate information received even if they later learn that information was false. It is difficult to avoid once exposed. We get it everyday in the media, in advertising, on the web, and here but if you question the source before you are exposed and know that the source is unreliable, the best answer is don't read it or listen to it in the first place. Coy is as unreliable as a human being can get. Go see Parker instead. Come see me, I'm in Orlando.