PierceM20F

Will do. I didn’t have too much trouble getting those bolts off. I have a plan for putting everything back together now that I know where everything is at.

Okay all, so I called sky tec technical support and after about a half hour, we determined that this particular starter was experience a known design defect of some sorts causing it to not engage the ring gear. It was manufactured in 2009 and I guess that year/design does in fact have a Bendix. I honestly can’t describe exactly why it was failing but the tech rep knew exactly what it was and is having me exchange the unit. Something with loose bolts/nuts inside the unit. Let’s just say, removing the lower cowl was not a pleasant time but I got it done. Also, sky tec technical support is fantastic. Hopefully will be back flying by the end of the week.

Okay this is what I’ve got. A sky tec. But I also took pics of the starter from what I can see. It does look quite dirty. I was reading on Mooney space someone else had similar issue and sprayed a dry lubricant silicone in this area. Thoughts?

I'm starting to have the same issue on my starter (I think). How/where do you apply this silicone to the bendix after every flight? I can see the gear that would connect to the ring for the prop but the rest of the starter is inside of the starter assembly. Maybe you could stick a small tube like WD40 can has and stick it further inside the assembly? Newer guy here so I apologize for not having the correct words for parts...

Yup, I think this is what is going on. Hopefully this isn’t too big of a deal…I’ll be at the hangar tomorrow and begin to take a look at this. I’ll report back any findings. Thank you all!

I believe I have a solenoid actuated starter? Sorry, I’m still learning all of this as I go. I believe the solenoid is on the firewall there on the right side. Shiny silver color. Which I believe means I don’t have a Bendix drive? At the same time though, the charging up noise would make sense regarding the starter spinning and then finally engaging. Something must be sticking somewhere!

Okay, I flew yesterday and made sure to twist first, then push in. I tried taking a video but of course the prop didn't act like what I described. Instead, something else happened. I had just landed to get gas and then start it up again. 1. Twisted key 2. SOS started with the buzzing noise 3. I pushed in 4. After pushing in, something sounded like it was "charging up" and prop did not spin at all. 5. After maybe 1-2 seconds of this "charging up" noise, the prop was almost "jolted" (it wasn't violent) into a strong starting rotation. 6. Of course it was a little finicky on getting started because engine was hot etc. BUT each time I tried starting it, I heard this "charging up" noise (not to be confused with the SOS buzzing) and the prop wouldn't rotating until that charge up noise was at its max or maybe some level of power was reached before engaging into the prop. Anyway, I got the engine started and after the charging noise, the rotation was very very strong. If you were watching from outside the plane, you would say there were zero issues with any starting at all. From the inside, I feel like maybe I've been operating the starting switch improperly all this time...assuming this charging up noise is normal.

Okay, before I go down a rabbit hole, I will go verify that it’s not ME that is the problem. Twist then push! Be back with updates in a few days. Thanks all.

I’ve been pushing and twisting at the same time. Maybe it’s something as simple as needing to push in harder and then twist. I think the starter solenoid is easily accessed with the cowling off…

That makes sense on the shower of sparks. The buzz only sound lasts for a half to 1 second or so until the prop starts spinning. Maybe it's my ignition switch? I'll grab a video next time I fly.

Hi all, recently I've noticed that my skytec starter doesn't engage to the starter ring right away (or so I think). I push the key and assembly in and turn clock wise against the spring (like I always have done for over a year) and I'll hear a buzzing noise for a split second or so, THEN the prop moves slightly, stop, then begin spinning like it normally does. When it spins like normal, I would consider it a strong spinning start. It's just that initial turn over. Once the prop gets spinning like normal, the engine starting is not an issue. Takes maybe 3-4 turns and it fires up. Basically, it seems like there isn't enough power to get the prop to start spinning, but then magically the power appears after a second or two of struggling. Condor battery from 2019. Any thoughts? Maybe I don't have an issue? Just different than normal.

Hi all, ever since I started downloading the new nav data from the fly garmin website (since becoming instrument rated), I will occasionally get an "Aviation database integrity error" right when the unit is started up. I will cycle the avionics switch and then it goes away and all is well. Right after I cycle the avionics switch, the 430 will show a different screen than on initial start up (a white computer text), then jumps to the "Garmin" logo. Any ideas what my problem could be? Once I cycle the avionics switch and the unit turns on successfully, I don't have any other issues throughout the flight. And like I mentioned, this only happens sometimes during start up.

I had a mechanic take a look and in his opinion it was overgreased. He said to just watch it and if it gets worse, re-evaluate. Time will tell!

I can confirm that changing the intake seal, and adding nut/retightening the exhaust manifold has solved the popping issue! Was a very quick and inexpensive fix.

That's what I used to get it to where it is now as far as tightness goes on one side. The other side can only be tightened by socket and it's tight as well but I would guess slightly less tight than the other side of the manifold.

I was able to replace the intake gasket relatively easily and torque it. However, the remaining exhaust manifold nut was stuck to the stud and the stud started to unscrew. So, I decided to just tighten the nut down instead of changing the gasket. I then added the missing nut and tightened the whole manifold back down. A problem I ran in to was the weld on the exhaust manifold. Someone must have welded a crack because it is a THICK weld. To the point where I could not tighten either nuts down any further because the socket wouldn't go over the nut due to the essentially zero clearance between the nut and the weld. The manifold is tight like the others so I'm expecting the issue to be resolved. I'll report back once I take it for a flight, most likely tomorrow evening.

I’ve got a basic detector on the panel. The firewall is sealed fairly well from what I can tell. Haven’t had any symptoms but then again I’ve been on relatively short flights recently. I’ll be ordering these parts ASAP! New owner so continuing to learn all there is about ownership and maintenance.

Hi Clarence. Thank you for the help! Is there an illustrated parts catalog in general for the engine? Both you and Andy got P/N information from somewhere! A Mooney IPC would also be handy I’m sure.

Thanks Andy! I did notice that there is a nut missing from one of the studs for the exhaust manifold. I’ll see if I can get a nut and tighten that back down. I’m thinking that’s why there is an exhaust leak in that spot. As far as the popping, that makes sense. I know when on the ground for a while on a hot day, the engine will “hiccup” slightly as in a drop in RPM for a half second or so due to fuel vaporization. Goes away when increasing MP. Looks like some new seals and a nut are in order!

Hi everyone! I’ve got a 1967 M20F / Lycoming IO360-A1A with about 300 SMOH. Noticed on my past few flights that going to idle either on the downwind leg or final produces some small, consistently spaced out “pops”. I wouldn’t call them backfires as they are not that strong at all. Will usually only last a couple seconds or so. I also noticed some light oil streaks coming from the #2 cylinder part of the cowl. So I investigated. I found what looks to be some oil leaking somewhere near the intake area OR could be the valve cover gasket. The gaskets are cork from around 2014 (previous owner barely flew the plane). Thoughts on changing out the gaskets to silicone ones in order to solve the problem? Engine does not run rough, and passes idle check during a ground run up. I also did not see any glaring cracks in the intake manifold. I will note, the #2 cylinder is always my “hot” cylinder on climb out but all cylinder temps even out once in cruise. I also put a quart of oil in about every 10 hours so I know it’s not a huge leak. Added pic of new silicone gasket to show what I’d purchase. Thanks all! Happy flying!

Well, it seems we have all had quite a few different experiences and outcomes. It's a very small amount and it only happens on some flights. I flew yesterday upwards of 4 hours total and I only noticed it show up on one of the flights after about an hour of run time. Since the prop is only 270 SMOH, I'm just going to monitor it. I'll bring it up at annual in August of next year (assuming everything continues going well). The plane had an annual/prebuy in Morganton, NC with AGL services Lynn Mace who seems to be quite popular among the Mooney community for maintenance. What I don't want to do is send it in for a re seal and then it continues to do the same thing. If it gets a lot worse where the grease starts coating a lot of the blade every time I fly it, I'll reconsider. Thanks all for the input, I've learned a lot!

Okay that’s good to know regarding the weather temps. I will note that the grease is not coming from the zirks (spelling?). I’ll be curious to see what Cody says.

The prop was overhauled in 2014 and I had a prebuy/annual when I bought the airplane in September of this year. Everything checked out then. I’m monitoring it but I’m just not sure if this is a huge problem or if the cold weather has anything to do with it? The plane only flew maybe 40 hours a year before me and I’m flying 20 hours a month now.

Hi all, I’ve got a 1967 M20F with an engine/prop at about 270 SMOH. I’ve put about 70 hours on it since September ‘21 when I bought it. The other day, I noticed what I thought to be a large bug splatter on the prop (I fly out of Tulsa, OK) so I cleaned it off. A couple flights later, I noticed it again, so I investigated further and saw it was about a 1” section of very sticky substance, gold ish in color, coming from the prop (see pictures). It happened to have been getting colder than anything I had flown it in so far this season. 40’s. I had assumed it was because I didn’t let the engine warm up enough before cycling the prop (I cycle the prop 3 times). Flew the airplane again for maybe 5 hours no repeat on the issue. After getting home tonight from a flight (high 30’s outside), I noticed the beginnings of the same type of streak on the prop. I let the engine warm up to 120 degrees F on the oil temp before doing my run up and prop cycle. Anyone have any thoughts on this? I’m concerned it needs a reseal but I’m also skeptical as it’s a low time prop (270 hours since overhaul) and it’s not oil coming out of the prop. Any help is appreciated. I’m also new to ownership to apologies if my understanding of the details of the prop is not up to par. Still learning. Thanks!