EI CGR-30 C/P or single Garmin 275EIS?

[gmonnig]

I'm having a hard time deciding between these engine monitors or none at all. My Tach is probably original and its making a lot of noise. I know it's on its way out. I've been shopping and best i can tell, a single Garmin EIS or two CGR30s are going to run $5k. I'll probably work with my A&P to install these. Or maybe I should just replace the Tach. Ugh, airplanes... 

[0TreeLemur]

If you are considering two CGR30's, you should consider a single JPI EDM 900.  It clobbers two holes, but frees up a bunch of panel space too.  Probably for the same cost.

[McMooney]

i'm going with the single gi-275, seems so much cleaner and it's round.

[A64Pilot]

If your primary motivation is the tach is going bad, have it overhauled and buy I don’t know $4,500 worth of fuel

[carusoam]

Wait a second….

That funny noise you hear…

Is probably the cable driving the tach…  they wear out, then bounce the needle clean off the face of the instrument….

1) Get new cable…

2) Install new cable…

3) Expect the costs to get washed out of the AMU rubble…. IOWs decimals on the AMU scale…

4) The hard part is finding the right length cable…

5) On the scale of easy to hard…. Replacing the cable is wicked easy…

Hope you didn’t really want a GI275….

If you can’t determine which is better for you…. Our EI guy is around here often…. Ask him.  

 

PP thoughts only, not an instrument guru…

Best regards,

-a-

[C.J.]

10 hours ago, gmonnig said:

I'm having a hard time deciding between these engine monitors or none at all. My Tach is probably original and its making a lot of noise. I know it's on its way out. I've been shopping and best i can tell, a single Garmin EIS or two CGR30s are going to run $5k. I'll probably work with my A&P to install these. Or maybe I should just replace the Tach. Ugh, airplanes... 

Just an opinion from another owner of a '65 Mooney - You could replace the tach or its cable if that's the problem and fly on happily ever after. But then again after doing that, one of the other original 58-year-old engine gauges could (or most likely will) fail & then another, ad infinitum. Shoot me a PM and ask me how I know this. I have a CGR-30P & C on order. EI runs frequent $800 rebates & that will pay for part of the $1200 cost of two CiES fuel senders. Go big or go home, right? With a new monitor I'll be sending engine data to Saavy Aviation for analysis with the goal of catching very early indications of future, more expensive problems. That buys a lot of peace of mind. That was my solution but YM+$MV.

It's sort of like the old Fram oil filter commercial - "You can pay me now or you can pay me later." Uuuuggggghhhhh, airplanes ....... !!!!!
 

Cheers, C.J.

[gmonnig]

20 hours ago, 0TreeLemur said:

If you are considering two CGR30's, you should consider a single JPI EDM 900.  It clobbers two holes, but frees up a bunch of panel space too.  Probably for the same cost.

Very true but I actually have a ton of panel space. I have room for two CGR on the pilot side. That means the entire copilot side will be blank (already have it ready for install). Since I have a remote transponder, I still have room in the center stack for the GFC500 head. It might look weird with a completely empty copilot panel! 

[gmonnig]

17 hours ago, McMooney said:

i'm going with the single gi-275, seems so much cleaner and it's round.

It does look clean! I have two 275s already, so a third would look like I'm flexing a little. I was planning on this E model being my forever plane and have spent money to reflect that. But I must say, I've been thinking about going experimental. I think engine monitors and a GFC500 will put me at the top 5% of E's out there, and will certainly put me in the "call for price" category..... which sucks

[0TreeLemur]

34 minutes ago, gmonnig said:

Very true but I actually have a ton of panel space. I have room for two CGR on the pilot side. That means the entire copilot side will be blank (already have it ready for install). Since I have a remote transponder, I still have room in the center stack for the GFC500 head. It might look weird with a completely empty copilot panel! 

You could put a circuit breaker on every single piece of electrical gear.   I used that empty real-estate to mount the iPad using a RAM ball mount. 

[gmonnig]

57 minutes ago, 0TreeLemur said:

You could put a circuit breaker on every single piece of electrical gear.   I used that empty real-estate to mount the iPad using a RAM ball mount. 

I thought it'd be nice to put a glove box in. And definitely a mount for an iPad, maybe even fit the pro. I have a custom mount on the center of the yoke, but I hate having extra weight on a control surface. There aren't a lot of places in the Mooney for iPads. 

[0TreeLemur]

6 minutes ago, gmonnig said:

I thought it'd be nice to put a glove box in. And definitely a mount for an iPad, maybe even fit the pro. I have a custom mount on the center of the yoke, but I hate having extra weight on a control surface. There aren't a lot of places in the Mooney for iPads. 

We use an iPad pro:

 

[oregon87]

I'm here, y'all, catching up from the holidays with one sales/support staff member out of the office.  Suffice it to say, we busy!    If anybody has any specific questions, we will likely be able to answer them more quickly via e-mail at support@iflyei.com or phone at 541-318-6060.

[carusoam]

7 hours ago, oregon87 said:

I'm here, y'all, catching up from the holidays with one sales/support staff member out of the office.  Suffice it to say, we busy!    If anybody has any specific questions, we will likely be able to answer them more quickly via e-mail at support@iflyei.com or phone at 541-318-6060.

You are the best customer support person on the planet @oregon87!

Thanks for stopping in as often as you do.

Go MS!

Best regards,

-a-

[kris_adams]

go with the larger JPI or the garmin EIS on the 275...you'll be happy with either of those...the CGR is a mixed bag...some have been happy, some (like me) never go them to stop rebooting and don't even get me started about EI probes.   I've since pulled out my dual CGR and went with garmin EIS on a G3X...expensive lesson to learn doing it twice.

[oregon87]

11 hours ago, carusoam said:

You are the best customer support person on the planet @oregon87!

Thanks for stopping in as often as you do.

Go MS!

Best regards,

-a-

My pleasure!  

[oregon87]

@Kris_Adams You've mentioned several times on this forum that you experienced issues with your CGR system, which we sincerely regret.  Our records show that when you originally sent your instruments to us for repair, our technical department could not duplicate the problem and therefore we re-calibrated the units and returned them to you at no charge.  Later, when you sent your units to us, we performed a software update, re-calibrated and returned them to you, also at no charge.  We have no record of hearing from you again.  Unfortunately, had you told us that you would like to return the units to us for a full refund, we would have given it to you with no questions asked.  Neither E.I. nor any other manufacturer can claim to be perfect, although we make every effort to provide the highest quality products possible.  We're also sincere in our desire and efforts to provide exceptional customer service, including making every reasonable effort to rectify unforeseen issues.  Wishing everyone a very Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays!  

Edited November 30, 2022 by oregon87

[A64Pilot]

FWIW, Where I worked by the time I retired we had installed dozens of MVP-50T’s in new aircraft, without difficulty. I was product support for the company so I’m the one that would have been called. Biggest concern was what if the MVP failed? You wouldn’t have any instrumentation, not even fuel level, but I don’t think that ever happened. A big concern is most operators depaneled the aircraft and washed it daily, so the wiring etc pretty much stayed wet.

I spoke with Rob Roberts about that and they had to prove to the FAA that would be some really remote possibility. 

I don’t ever remember getting any complaints about probes, but E.I. put together a spares kit for aircraft located in away places like Ecuador or Africa for us as getting parts shipped there can be time consuming due to Customs in some countries.

[MMsuper21]

EI product support is great, love the round form factor and easy to read. But I have to warn you the more detailed information you get the more you think will need fixing. With these old planes and exact digital instruments it will lead you into rabbit holes. If you have 4 EGTs just replace the analog tach unless it’s a forever plane. 
 

Also single 275 and 375. Like to keep the retro look. 

[brantv]

Been a few years since this topic launched. 
Looking at cleaning up all my old analog, and putting in a GI275 or EI CGR-30. Any more opinions? 
thanks

[Steve Dawson]

I just sent in my spec sheet to order an EI CGR 30C. They're less money than JPI and definitely Garmin and have more functionality and gives more information.

One of the reasons was their ability to show items such as speed brake and pitot activation lights in a choice of colours.   

[jetdriven]

The CGR does not have more functionality or is better than a Garmin 275. For one thing it’s not touchscreen, for two it has this knob you have to select between four pages to see everything. And three it doesn’t even display all of the primary information on the page, you have to look at page 2 to see amps or oil temperature or whatever it is that you selected there. EI said it couldn’t be done, but Garmin has it. 

[Steve Dawson]

Personally I've not used a GI 275 in flight and I don't believe using a touch screen is a bonus. I haven't found the the total list of functions for the Garmin and I don't believe it compares to the EI CGR 30C. Either way you still have to go through multiple screen pages to get to your other information. I do like the 275 EIS front page because I could get a the TIT in a bar graph beside the other EGT. On the CGR C you could configure the second screen for more functions compared to the Garmin. For me I do like that I can have annunciator lights showing 6 running functions. I'm using mine for speed brakes, strobe, nav and landing lights, prop ice and pitot activation. Another issue I have is the cost for the Garmin which is approximately $3K more. 

I've had two aircraft with JPI's and even though I liked them, the form function is OK but their service is very poor. 

 

Here's the CGR 30C list:  

• CGR-30P Instrument
• CGR-30C Instrument
• EDC-33 Engine Data Converter
• Primary Replacement RPM
• Primary Replacement Manifold Pressure
• Primary Replacement Fuel Level (up to 4 Fuel Tanks)
• Primary Replacement EGT/CHT Bargraph
• Primary Replacement Oil Pressure
• Primary Replacement Oil Temperature
• Primary Replacement Volts
• Primary Replacement Amps
• Primary Replacement OAT
• Primary Replacement Fuel Flow
• Fuel Remaining and Fuel Used
• GPS/Fuel Flow Data
• Engine Time and Tach Time
• Flight Timer
• Local Time and Zulu Time
• Pilot Programmable Checklists

Other Options (No Charge)

• Primary Replacement Fuel Pressure
• Primary Replacement Hydraulic Pressure
• Primary Replacement TIT
• Primary Replacement Carb Temp or OAT
• Second Amps Measurement
• On Screen Annunciators
• Return Fuel Flow Transducer (Pressure/Carb)
• G-Meter
• Horsepower

 

 

[ad5ut]

I haven't flow with it yet since it is being installed now, but I went with a pair of GI-275s. I've heard good things about the CGR-30 setup as well, but my eventual plan for this plane is go move to a G500 TXi (or next-gen replacement depending on when it happens) and figured I'd save some future labor by installing the GEA-110 interface and putting a GI-275 EIS in front of it for now. 

The second GI-275 will be configured as an MFD and Standby ADI replacing my current analog CDI right above the EIS GI-275. That way I can spread out engine instruments onto the second GI-275 similar to how you can with the CGR-30C but then change pages to have that instrument display CDI, Traffic, WX, etc and provide a backup to my vacuum-driven King ADI. I wasn't quite ready to spring for a primary ADI and/or HSI and deal with the autopilot wiring or the MFD GI-275 would have just been an MFD and much cheaper.

[67 m20F chump]

I have a 30p+c.  I didn’t spring for the CIES fuel sensors and wish I did.  It’s been in for a few years now.  The fuel pressure sensor went bad but so far that’s it.  Factory support is excellent.  I did the install myself and they were beyond helpful.  They also checked my pressure sensor for free when I was having trouble.  I don’t think garmin would be nearly as good with customer service.