Artemis Launch

[MooneyMitch]

Orion on its way to the moon!  Wow!!!  And know we know what those young brilliant minds were doing locked away in their bedroom on their computer!!

[MooneyMitch]

A view not seen for 50 years since the final Apollo mission.  From a new generation….. the Artemis generation! 
Photo courtesy of an iPhone 14 

[flyboy0681]

I was 120 miles south and this is what it looked like. I was able to watch it until Mission Control stated that it was 450 miles downrange.

 

 

 

 

[carusoam]

Nice pics gents!

I was watching on the YouTube…

Nothing but dark sky, and rocket exhaust….

Really looking forward to the continuation of the Moon work!

Rocketry today looks more like a walk in the park, than 50 years ago…

Much fewer unknown unknowns….    

Our handy calculators today… are connected to the internet, and come with videos of how to download the data using the touch screens…. And double as inflight entertainment devices….  
 

+1 for EarthRise in HD!
 

We have come a long way… in 50years…

Best regards,

-a-

[MooneyMitch]

Around the moon today!  So awesome !!!

[1980Mooney]

On 11/17/2022 at 12:24 AM, carusoam said:

Rocketry today looks more like a walk in the park, than 50 years ago…

We have come a long way… in 50years…

 

6 hours ago, MooneyMitch said:

Around the moon today!  So awesome !!!

More like a yawn in the park today. In 1969 everyone was watching. Today I bet 99% couldn’t tell you what “Artemis” is if asked.  

[A64Pilot]

I know I’m always the Debbie downer, but Artemis is the perfect example of why NASA is dead.

Years late and HUGELY over budget. Seriously years ago when it was postulated Nasa looked into building the F-1 engine from Apollo and decided they literally didn’t have the skill set to do it, made lots of noise they were going to design a better motor. I’d give links, but if you have time just google why we can’t build the F-1, it’s interesting reading. 

So what is Artemis? It’s four Space Shuttle engines pulled out of Storage, honestly look it up. The Solid rocket boosters are, you guessed it Shuttle SRB’s, with five segments instead of the four used on the Shuttle.

The second stage is a stretched Delta IV second stage

So Artemis is made from pre-existing motors and parts, which makes sense to cob something up from the parts bins as it should be quick and relatively cheap, this stuff is proven, man rated and since it’s all been tested etc ought to be pennies on the dollar compared to a clean sheet design.

But years past due, and hugely over cost and even built from used existing parts ( one of the first stage motors had 12 shuttle missions on it) it ONLY costs over 4 Billion per launch.

IF, and it’s a BIG if, Starship flies, Musk says it will be 10 Million per mission.

Well we all know how optomistic Musk is, but better more reliable sources predict between 150 to 250 million. Lot of money, but compared to 4 Billion it’s a steal, plus we are going to run out of Shuttle engines throwing them away, where Starship is supposed to be fully re-usable.

My prediction is when Starship flies we will see mankind’s largest firework display, at least a couple, the environmentalist will have apoplectic fits about the pieces all over the place

Then Artemis is going to get the first Woman of color to the moon, but how is she going to get down to the surface? If she gets there as planned in 24, she won’t have any clothes to wear outside, cause we can’t build suits before 2025 at least.

NASA’s plan is to contract Space-X to build a lander and it will probably be a Starship, just recently the Government has given NASA enough money to try to second source a lander, but seriously who else but Space-X even has a shot at building one? 

[1980Mooney]

2 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Years late and HUGELY over budget. ..So what is Artemis? It’s four Space Shuttle engines pulled out of Storage, honestly look it up. The Solid rocket boosters are, you guessed it Shuttle SRB’s, with five segments instead of the four used on the Shuttle....The second stage is a stretched Delta IV second stage

So Artemis is made from pre-existing motors and parts, which makes sense to cob something up from the parts bins as it should be quick and relatively cheap, this stuff is proven, man rated and since it’s all been tested etc ought to be pennies on the dollar compared to a clean sheet design.

But years past due, and hugely over cost and even built from used existing parts ( one of the first stage motors had 12 shuttle missions on it) it ONLY costs over 4 Billion per launch.

You forgot to mention that Boeing is the lead/prime contractor for the core stage, avionics and upper stage.....flawed MCAS  737 control software and flawed software controlling Starliner botched launch and near disaster in flight. 

Edited November 21, 2022 by 1980Mooney

[hubcap]

Quite honestly NASA is just another bloated government bureaucracy. 
 

Elon Musk has shown that private industry can crush the results of NASA for far less money and much quicker.

[Fly Boomer]

10 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

You forgot to mention that Boeing is the lead/prime contractor for the core stage, avionics and upper stage.....flawed MCAS  737 control software and flawed software controlling Starliner botched launch and near disaster in flight. 

Probably not the same team.  Just like the people who work on our airplanes — it’s the person, not the company that matters,

[1980Mooney]

1 hour ago, Fly Boomer said:

Probably not the same team.  Just like the people who work on our airplanes — it’s the person, not the company that matters,

Actually that’s looking at the world through 19th century “job shop” goggles.  It’s the same team at the top. It’s the same business philosophy that picks leadership top to bottom   It’s the same business systems that manage and control the workflow.  There are centers of excellence which guide the philosophy and structure of technology, software, and avionics - there are chief technology officers, and there are leaders for technology and software integration.  

They are not letting every person reinvent the wheel …. 

Companies do matter. 

[Fly Boomer]

1 hour ago, 1980Mooney said:

Actually that’s looking at the world through 19th century “job shop” goggles.  It’s the same team at the top. It’s the same business philosophy that picks leadership top to bottom   It’s the same business systems that manage and control the workflow.  There are centers of excellence which guide the philosophy and structure of technology, software, and avionics - there are chief technology officers, and there are leaders for technology and software integration.  

They are not letting every person reinvent the wheel …. 

Companies do matter.

Sounds like you have experience in these matters.  

 

[carusoam]

7 hours ago, hubcap said:

Quite honestly NASA is just another bloated government bureaucracy. 
 

Elon Musk has shown that private industry can crush the results of NASA for far less money and much quicker.

 

Go capitalism!

Use government agencies to start up some good ideas that are too expensive to get started privately…

Go Pony Express!

Go local fire department!

Go local library!

Go local airport!

Go USAF!

 

You do know…

Artemis1 is NASA driven…

Do you also know… the greatness of Elon and SpaceX are Artemis3..?  

https://www.nasa.gov/press-release/as-artemis-moves-forward-nasa-picks-spacex-to-land-next-americans-on-moon

 

Keep an eye on the greatness of Gwynne Schotwell…  she is in charge of SpaceX while Elon is hanging out around Twitter…. (Speaking of bloated programs…)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gwynne_Shotwell

 

Everything has been going well for Artemis for days… must be headed home soon….  I was watching last night while their speed was 60mph… while cruising in retrograde, around the moon…     Nearly standing still, while the moon was passing it…

Anyone want to go to the moon?

How about Mars?

 

That other government program…  the James Webb space telescope…. Not real good news there either…

If we have to leave earth… there are not a lot of good planets… anywhere near by… to go shopping for a house…   

 

PP thoughts only…

Best regards,

-a-

 

[MooneyMitch]

32 minutes ago, carusoam said:

Anyone want to go to the moon?

Oh, yes!  I would have loved to have gone on this Orion trip, returning near San Diego on December 11……. maybe taking a tour of the San Diego Zoo while there 

[A64Pilot]

I figure, actually hope that if Starship becomes viable, the SLS will be canceled.

Musks plan as I understand it is to get Starship in orbit, then refuel it with Falcon 9 flights, refueled it can take 100 tons to the moon.

I believe those are metric tons, so 220,000 lbs, with that kind of payload and a re-usable rocket, a permeant presence on the moon is possible.

‘At over 4 Billion per launch, no landing vehicle and a payload of half of Starships, I think we would run out of money trying for a moon base.

Of course Starship has yet to fly, will it be a Spruce Goose?

[Fly Boomer]

47 minutes ago, A64Pilot said:

Of course Starship has yet to fly, will it be a Spruce Goose?

Possible -- especially if Musk loses interest or needs the money elsewhere.

[A64Pilot]

I was watching a program a few years ago where a young girl who wanted to become an Astronaut was asking a current US female astronaut what she should do.

Her answer? Learn Russian.

Without Space-X the US would have zero presence in space and would still be paying exorbitant rates to the Russians for rides to the Space Station.