Controller brings C208 down safety

[kortopates]

3 hours ago, 201er said:

Definitely skeptical of the claim that the passenger had "zero" flight training. Perhaps someone that got 10 hours a bunch of years ago or perhaps a hoax. But, not something that goes this easily on the first try.

He even understood how to punch in a squawk code on the transponder.

He may not have any piloting experience but he may have years of sitting right seat listening and watching his pilot answer calls and learned enough to understand how to use the basic instruments. 

It wasn't clear at all if he was able to put in the squawk code. The controller never acknowledged being able to see it and apparently it was the KBPI tower controller that found him not the first controller that asked him to squawk. However lots of folks with right seat experience know enough on how to input the squawk code - but I doubt many can on a G1000 system if that's what it was. The tape is very compressed and I think we're missing a lot. 

He could have had a very good instructor guiding him in!

 

[carusoam]

How does somebody with no flight experience know…

1) There is a VSI…

2) how to read it…

3) what a good descent rate is…

4) how to achieve it…

5) be able to report it…. And…

6) keep the sunny side up the whole time…?

7) For a Caravan…

8) For this to work out so cleanly….   a great force guides the universe…. 
 

9) The plane appears completely re-useable…
 

Good story, there must be a few more details that need to be cleared up….

Best regards,

-a-

[A64Pilot]

15 minutes ago, carusoam said:

How does somebody with no flight experience know…

1) There is a VSI…

2) how to read it…

3) what a good descent rate is…

4) how to achieve it…

5) be able to report it…. And…

6) keep the sunny side up the whole time…?

7) For a Caravan…

8) For this to work out so cleanly….   a great force guides the universe…. 
 

9) The plane appears completely re-useable…
 

Good story, there must be a few more details that need to be cleared up….

Best regards,

-a-

A simulator, many many of the younger generation fly those things for hours and hours. They really do understand the instrumentation and what control does what, plus this may not have been his first ride in a Caravan.

My son learned to fly RC on a simulator and it’s pretty similar really, plus I don’t think I saw flaps down on the Caravan which I wouldn’t expect to see if someone really didn’t know, and due to trim change I wouldn’t tell them to do myself, but someone with just a little knowledge and or training would have dropped flaps.

‘So I think it’s plausible 

[ilovecornfields]

2 hours ago, aviatoreb said:

You know as I read this story of yours, and thinking about what a seven year old looks like - I bet he was short - too short to look out the windscreen and if so I bet he was flying entirely on instruments!  All the more impressive.

I let my son fly in IMC and was impressed he could hold a heading and altitude just as well as I can. I asked him why it was so easy and that was exactly his response - apparently he always flies on instruments because he can’t see over the cowling. 

[carusoam]

Simulation is a wonderful tool…

I used MSFS a decade before I got my license….

used it for the IR in concert with my actual IR training…

 

I messed up a simulated approach… too high/fast, the CFII remarked I couldn’t land from where I was….

Technically, I wouldn’t land from there in real life… but, chopped the throttle, crossed the controls, aimed for the threshold…. Done….  
 

Simulation is definitely a form of aviation knowledge…

Best regards,

-a-

[cbarry]

Either this passenger had some flight experience (at least as a right seat observer) or his guardian Angel was type rated in the make and model!

[flyboy0681]

Looking at the FlightAware Track Log, his decent was extremely smooth in terms of rate and speed.  Autopilot?

Would also have liked to have heard the entire letdown, not just highlights. 

[201er]

3 minutes ago, flyboy0681 said:

Looking at the FlightAware Track Log, his decent was extremely smooth in terms of rate and speed.  Autopilot?

Would also have liked to have heard the entire letdown, not just highlights. 

I have a feeling approach talked him down on a discrete frequency that does not normally get recorded by scanners.

[Schllc]

10 minutes ago, 201er said:

I have a feeling approach talked him down on a discrete frequency that does not normally get recorded by scanners.

ALL ATC communications are recorded.

No way this kind of interaction wouldn’t be recorded.
I have not heard enough to believe this was a stunt, but no way I believe the passenger had zero experience.  
 

[flyboy0681]

22 minutes ago, 201er said:

I have a feeling approach talked him down on a discrete frequency that does not normally get recorded by scanners.

Probably right.

[PMcClure]

And why were nav screens dead? NBC new interviewed the controller/instructor tonight. Says the plane defended 3000 feet in 16 seconds while they pulled the pilot off the controls. Reported giving power setting instructions etc which supports off recording discussions.

Pictures of the plane stopped  right on centerline on runway and saw a short video of the normal flare and landing. Maybe not a stunt but still doesn’t compute for me. 

[flyboy0681]

1 minute ago, PMcClure said:

And why were nav screens dead? NBC new interviewed the controller/instructor tonight. Says the plane defended 3000 feet in 16 seconds while they pulled the pilot off the controls. Reported giving power setting instructions etc which supports off recording discussions.

Pictures of the plane stopped  right on centerline on runway and saw a short video of the normal flare and landing. Maybe not a stunt but still doesn’t compute for me. 

Add to the mix a turboprop.

[201er]

1 hour ago, Schllc said:

ALL ATC communications are recorded.

No way this kind of interaction wouldn’t be recorded.

I don’t think ATC has an obligation to release those to the news or public and even if they do it could take months. I’m just taking about amateur scanners that post online like liveatc.net, they wouldn’t be recording a discrete frequency that’s isn’t normally used by local ATC.

[PeteMc]

11 hours ago, AH-1 Cobra Pilot said:

Is nobody else skeptical of that?

Well, there was zero flare and if he had any training I think he would have flared out of muscle memory and given it away.  So I'm still in the category that it is real.  The guy did say he had been in planes before, he's just never been at the controls.  So it's not like there was no understanding at all. 

Now I was a little bit sceptic on how he knew how to make a radio call.  But that also made sense when I learned he had been in planes before.

ADDED:  I hadn't really read the whole story and wasn't aware of the winds (which I read here, not official Wx).  But now I'm a little more skeptical that his friend didn't show him a few things.

Edited May 12, 2022 by PeteMc

[A64Pilot]

14 hours ago, flyboy0681 said:

Add to the mix a turboprop.

Turbo props are easier, literally all you need to worry about is the throttle

[A64Pilot]

10 hours ago, PeteMc said:

 But now I'm a little more skeptical that his friend didn't show him a few things.

I don’t think it ever said that, for instance my Mother could land their 182, 210, Mooney, but she never had any flight training as my Father wasn’t a CFI. She would not take any flight training, but recognized that with her kids in the backseat she needed to be able to get it on the ground if necessary. She never had a medical, logbook etc.

She was also the recorder if you will writing down whatever freqs, squawks ATC gave and could tune the radios, set the OBS, enter squawks etc, but never had any flight training. She was an excellent IFR CP actually, all he had to do was verify and fly.

So if she landed it after say my Father was incapacitated the headlines would have read “Woman with no flight training successfully landed airplane” and it would have been technically correct, besides this is the news, what do they know?

1960’s and 70’s they would have called out her sex as Women weren’t expected to have technical skills

‘Even a curious person would pick up quite a lot flying in the right seat. I know by the age of 10 or so I could have landed my Fathers airplanes as he let me fly them quite often dodging clouds and reintercepting the course on the OBS, I understood push the head and pull the tail as a 10 yr old, maybe 12 not sure.

I would be very surprised if they were on a discrete freq., if I were the controller I’d never ask him to change freqs for fear of losing him

Edited May 12, 2022 by A64Pilot

[kerry]

Here's the latest on this amazing story.

 

[A64Pilot]

So that’s some kind of movie advert, joke or what?

[kerry]

31 minutes ago, A64Pilot said:

So that’s some kind of movie advert, joke or what?

It's from the movie flyboys from a few years ago.  I haven't heard anything from the 2 passenger from the C208 and I was thinking they might have the same reaction as the 2 boys if they were interviewed.

[Raptor05121]

On 5/11/2022 at 11:34 AM, 201er said:

 

 

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N333LD/history/20220510/1515Z/MYAM/KPBI

Thats a damned good DME ARC!

Did he log the approach as well?

 

[LANCECASPER]

@Raptor05121 is Mooneyspace's resident C208 expert. 

[Raptor05121]

I miss that plane like a mother misses her children. Best damned plane I ever flew.

[Seymour]

On 5/11/2022 at 12:51 PM, aviatoreb said:

I wonder if the GFC500 engine out glide feature could be coaxed to be useful in a situation like this?

Sure, with some help.   If ATC can coach to an adequate airport, using a combination of Smart Glide and throttle should put the a passenger in a reasonable position for landing.  Here's the list I'll teach frequent passengers:

1.   Blue Button (Aviate - AP Wings Level)

2.   Nearest / Direct-To (Navigate)

3.  PTT  and Guard (Communicate - including frequency change if not already with ATC) 

4.  Red Button (Smart Glide)

5.  Throttle

6.  ELT

There's plenty missing (on purpose, in an attempt to keep it simple including gear because it's a J-Bar), but priority suggestions welcomed. 

[Fly Boomer]

10 hours ago, Seymour said:

Here's the list I'll teach frequent passengers:

I'm interested in developing a list like this, but I don't have a blue button, and the only red button is on the yoke and has nothing to do with Smart Glide.  Are those features of your new Aerocruze 100?

[Seymour]

1 hour ago, Fly Boomer said:

I'm interested in developing a list like this, but I don't have a blue button, and the only red button is on the yoke and has nothing to do with Smart Glide.  Are those features of your new Aerocruze 100?

No, we went with Garmin in the new panel specifically for these features (and others like it).

The GFC500 autopilot has a blue button that activates the AP in roll steering mode to immediately bring the plane to wings level and altitude hold (yellow circle in my panel picture).  When the GFC500 is paired with a GTN navigator (GTN650xi), a feature named "Smart Glide" (orange circle in the picture) does the following:

a.  Tunes COM1 on the GTN to 121.5

b.  Sets the transponder to 7700

c.  Activates the GFC500 AP to setup a descent at the aircraft's best glide speed to the best, nearest airport (if there is one).  

 

https://www.garmin.com/en-US/newsroom/press-release/aviation/garmin-continues-to-enhance-aviation-safety-with-the-introduction-of-smart-glide/

https://www.garmin.com/en-US/blog/aviation/five-reasons-your-aircraft-needs-garmin-smart-glide/

 

Edited May 13, 2022 by Seymour
Added Big G links that describe Smart Glide better.