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It’s a neat feature but on my panel I could do the same with the following button pushes: turn knob to nearest screen (choose suitable one), direct to, select IAS and NAV functions on AP.  

If Garmin isn’t trying to make additional money off the feature I’d think it wouldn’t be that tough to update the software to do this.

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Interesting the G3X experimental doesn’t require the new GTN Xi.
Makes me think the Xi requirement is a marketing idea, not an engineering position.

I don’t think so, it’s saying it can be enabled on experimental with both the G3x touch and G3x autopilot - rather than the GFC-500 AP - “when properly equipped”.
They clearly say the functionality is in the GTN XI, so i think that was more about the experimental exception to the AP.


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I have the new software loaded in my Mooney. It’s an update to the GTN 750 Xi, G500 TXi, and GI 275.  Three new AFMS’s in the supplemental section of the POH, three new pilot handbooks downloaded…

Tested it yesterday. Works surprisingly well.  I’ll do an in flight video on it soon. 

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What does the system do in my situation - I have a pair of GI275 and a GTN650 (which I would upgrade if I think it is going to do something) but a KFC200.

If I would activate the new software feature - does it refuse to give directions and engage the autopilot?  So does it mean hand flying?

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28 minutes ago, aviatoreb said:

What does the system do in my situation - I have a pair of GI275 and a GTN650 (which I would upgrade if I think it is going to do something) but a KFC200.

If I would activate the new software feature - does it refuse to give directions and engage the autopilot?  So does it mean hand flying?

The brochure says that you will get annunciations on the GTN only on what to do, but no, it only integrates with the GFC-500 AP and the experimental G3x AP. See the brochure posted above.

But I know you wanted a new GFC-500 anyway, just needed more incentive!

Edited by kortopates
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I have the new software loaded in my Mooney. It’s an update to the GTN 750 Xi, G500 TXi, and GI 275.  Three new AFMS’s in the supplemental section of the POH, three new pilot handbooks downloaded…
Tested it yesterday. Works surprisingly well.  I’ll do an in flight video on it soon. 

How many menus do you have to navigate to get it working? Do you think the external switch is required?
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1 hour ago, kortopates said:

The brochure says that you will get annunciations on the GTN only on what to do, but no, it only integrates with the GFC-500 AP and the experimental G3x AP. See the brochure posted above.

But I know you wanted a new GFC-500 anyway, just needed more incentive!

So does the kfc200 go inop if that feature is launched?

yeah / clearly a gfc500 is on my radar soon.  
 

but I’m still running on the fresh install of the gi275 driving my kfc200 and it’s not likely I would do much for a year or so since it’s sort of a pain dropping the plane off for an extended install etc / I like to just have and use it for awhile,

I would however upgrade to the gtn650txi from my gtn650 - almost asap - if I think it does something good since I believe that’s just a slide in.  Like drive my kfc200 during emergency mode.  I wonder what it will do re my autopilot then in emergency mode? 

 

 

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How many menus do you have to navigate to get it working? Do you think the external switch is required?
If you don't have the button you just hold the direct-to button for a few seconds. I saw it demoed at OSH.

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12 minutes ago, Frank said:

If you don't have the button you just hold the direct-to button for a few seconds. I saw it demoed at OSH.

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Congrats on your first post Frank!

I think you may have won the record for longest time between Joining MS, and first post!

Glad you are out in the public arena!

Write something again soon.


Thanks for sharing your Garmin observation as well!

:)

Best regards,

-a-

 

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Congrats on your first post Frank!
I think you may have won the record for longest time between Joining MS, and first post!
Glad you are out in the public arena!
Write something again soon.

Thanks for sharing your Garmin observation as well!

Best regards,
-a-
 
Haha, thanks. Hoping to buy a Mooney soon so you'll probably see a bit more of me in the future. :-)

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Ask lots of questions Frank!

Search for the easy ones first…

Start a new thread for the tough ones…

MS is open just about 24/7, covering six continents….  :)

For some reason the Antarticans don’t ever check in…

Best regards,

-a-

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10 hours ago, carusoam said:

MS is open just about 24/7, covering six continents….  :)

For some reason the Antarticans don’t ever check in…

Best regards,

-a-

It's the whole FIKI issue--not many Mooneys have it, and the Ross Shelf is a really long flight . . . .  :D

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11 hours ago, carusoam said:

Ask lots of questions Frank!

Search for the easy ones first…

Start a new thread for the tough ones…

MS is open just about 24/7, covering six continents….  :)

For some reason the Antarticans don’t ever check in…

Best regards,

-a-

See, that's why I've never posted. You've all already answered every question I've had! 

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11 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said:


Doesn’t list G3X as one of the compatible boxes, guess it requires software update not available at time 20.20 was printed?

Somewhere on Garmin's labyrinthine website, I saw G3X availability listed as Q4.

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On 7/21/2021 at 12:19 PM, ArtVandelay said:


Garmin needs to have a “trade-in” program, like they did for old 430/530s.

I talked with a Garmin sales manager at OSH and he was pretty clear; there will not be a trade in on GTN series for the Xi upgrade. He suggested talking to retailers/installers about trade ins.  

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3 hours ago, Unit74 said:

I talked with a Garmin sales manager at OSH and he was pretty clear; there will not be a trade in on GTN series for the Xi upgrade. He suggested talking to retailers/installers about trade ins.  

Really?  I thought they were in the business of selling product.  That seems to be a hiccup in their otherwise excellent sales strategy.

When the 650 txi first came out they were offering an upgrade from the original 650 for something a little under 3k.  I wasn't in the mood to get it since I had just gotten the 650 and I just didn't see the point.  Oh well...

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Garmin seems to do quite well without providing a lot of upgrade incentives. By not making the 650/750 plug compatible with the 430/530, it let Avidyne grab a chunk of the retrofit market. It would be interesting to know how many GTNs have been sold compared to IFDs. Maybe some of our avionics shop owners have an idea.

When you are the market leader, you don't have to provide as many incentives. Some customers are primarily cost sensitive. Some are feature sensitive. Some are brand loyalists and will buy whatever you make. Garmin has been very successful at mining the most profit from the entirety of the avionics market leaving other players to target niches.

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7 minutes ago, PT20J said:

Garmin seems to do quite well without providing a lot of upgrade incentives. By not making the 650/750 plug compatible with the 430/530, it let Avidyne grab a chunk of the retrofit market. It would be interesting to know how many GTNs have been sold compared to IFDs. Maybe some of our avionics shop owners have an idea.

When you are the market leader, you don't have to provide as many incentives. Some customers are primarily cost sensitive. Some are feature sensitive. Some are brand loyalists and will buy whatever you make. Garmin has been very successful at mining the most profit from the entirety of the avionics market leaving other players to target niches.

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There’s definitely a point, though, where it’s in Garmin's interest to get rid of the old stuff. The GTN series came out 10 years ago, and sooner or later it will become a major pain point to keep back-porting software updates to an older/slower platform. 

If the GNS series is any indication, I would expect the original GTNs to be fully supported for another ten years. But somewhere along the way, it wouldn’t surprise me at all for them to offer an attractive incentive just to reduce their own total cost of support. 

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3 minutes ago, PT20J said:

Garmin seems to do quite well without providing a lot of upgrade incentives. By not making the 650/750 plug compatible with the 430/530, it let Avidyne grab a chunk of the retrofit market. It would be interesting to know how many GTNs have been sold compared to IFDs. Maybe some of our avionics shop owners have an idea.

When you are the market leader, you don't have to provide as many incentives. Some customers are primarily cost sensitive. Some are feature sensitive. Some are brand loyalists and will buy whatever you make. Garmin has been very successful at mining the most profit from the entirety of the avionics market leaving other players to target niches.

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I agree. Garmin avionics add the most appeal to new buyers as well. Its also what new pilots get trained on in the rental/school fleet. I don't have any numbers but IFD's are extremely rare compared to the GTNs; at least compared to the cockpits I've flown in. Far more IFDs discussed here on Mooneyspace than what I ever see in the wild! Although I am not a fan, I would have expected to see more than what I have seen simply because they are cheaper than replacing 430Ws with GTN's. But with one exception I've seen all the 430W replaced with GTN650's. 

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2 hours ago, toto said:

There’s definitely a point, though, where it’s in Garmin's interest to get rid of the old stuff. The GTN series came out 10 years ago, and sooner or later it will become a major pain point to keep back-porting software updates to an older/slower platform. 

If the GNS series is any indication, I would expect the original GTNs to be fully supported for another ten years. But somewhere along the way, it wouldn’t surprise me at all for them to offer an attractive incentive just to reduce their own total cost of support. 

I've played that game trying to incentivize customers to move to a new platform. You can lead them to water, but it's hard to make some drink. When a new product comes out, early adopters will jump on monetary incentives to upgrade. The next user cohort sees little advantage for the cost and is not easily incentivized until the cost of ownership nudges them to move. Garmin's flat rate unit repair policy encourages rethinking the fix versus replace calculation whenever a unit needs repair. Then, there are the never adopters who will only change once a product is declared EOL (End of Life) and no longer supported, and they can no longer find used replacements at reasonable cost to replace a busted unit.

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