aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 Hi All - I did something dumb - I lost my fuel cap. I can't be sure if it fell off, or if I didn't cinch it down enough and it fell off or if - gasp - I did the really extra dumb and just forgot to put it back on?! I am not sure which dumb thing I wish more. I sure wish they had leashes on them. Anyway I need a new fuel cap. Its to my Monroy LR tanks. I need help trying to figure what to order. Its the smaller silver one in the picture of flying - the outboard LR tank cap. Its a newton cap as you can see the photo from the other one. I have a part number on the paper work for the etc 531-001. I go to spruce and its not clear to me which cap if any there is right, even amongst the newton caps. The serial numbers are different. E.g. https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/pnpages/05-21999.php?gclid=CjwKCAjw8cCGBhB6EiwAgORey-ToTTsn9z2mSjOMTyvshTSiniq7i27YbyRZ0lActlwr2rJMrvJdVBoC08oQAvD_BwE looks visually the same but the part number is totally different. - 05-21999 Even at the newton website (a UK company in Essex England - they make fancy fuel caps for race cars, race motorcycles, boats, and airplanes big and small) - only the part numbers the are using are entirely different even in style of how the numbers are written - e.g. OB-ZA-025 for say https://www.newton-equipment.com/aero-300-range.html Help - does anyone know what I need to buy and here? Is Jose here? Anyone at a salvage yard have anything for me? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 Yep, the memory is the third thing thing to go..... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eight8Victor Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 Calling @Gagarin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 Statistically speaking… The cap is likely to be in a few different common places… 1) Near the pump… where you put it down to pay for the gas… 2) Near the taxi way… where it falls if you didn’t put the cap in place… 3) Near the center of the runway… where it lifts off when lift/vac gets created… 4) A call to the airport might result in finding the cap… 5) How did you end up with such a fancy cap? Was it Rocket related? 6) in a similar way… My M20C got plastic fuel caps related to some race car supplier… that wouldn’t sell to an airplane owner when I started asking a few questions… 7) Getting the right cap often requires knowing what the Insert inside the tank looks like for proper tab orientation… Good luck with your next steps… Wait a sec… @OSUAV8TER knows the most about caps around here… Best regards, -a- 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 4 minutes ago, carusoam said: Statistically speaking… The cap is likely to be in a few different common places… 1) Near the pump… where you put it down to pay for the gas… 2) Near the taxi way… where it falls if you didn’t put the cap in place… 3) Near the center of the runway… where it lifts off when lift/vac gets created… 4) A call to the airport might result in finding the cap… 5) How did you end up with such a fancy cap? Was it Rocket related? 6) in a similar way… My M20C got plastic fuel caps related to some race car supplier… that wouldn’t sell to an airplane owner when I started asking a few questions… 7) Getting the right cap often requires knowing what the Insert inside the tank looks like for proper tab orientation… Good luck with your next steps… Wait a sec… @OSUAV8TER knows the most about caps around here… Best regards, -a- I already trolled around at the fuel depot - its actually immediately across from my hangar. I didn't think of calling the airport manager. Good idea. The taxi way is now all torn up since last week to get resurfaced. If it flew off upon first taking off - that would be hard to find! I had a friend who put his cell phone on the tail of his wing (not me!) forgot about it - took off - and then later found his phone at the departure end of the runway maybe 200 yards off - probably fell a hundred or two hundred feet. Found it by calling it. The fancy cap is what was installed in 2015 (6?) when I did Monroy LR tanks. Jose are you here? In all likelihood I won't find the old cap and need to find out what I have to replace it. Are most of the lr tank caps the same? There is a M20M broken wing on eBay right now - with lr tanks and I emailed to them asking if they have the cap. Hoping they do and hoping the lr tank caps are all the same. Who is osuav8ter and why does he know about caps? help! :-) E Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 24 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said: Yep, the memory is the third thing thing to go..... Ok...humor me - I forget - what are the first 2 things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 20 minutes ago, Eight8Victor said: Calling @Gagarin Is that Jose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragsf15e Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 1 hour ago, aviatoreb said: I already trolled around at the fuel depot - its actually immediately across from my hangar. I didn't think of calling the airport manager. Good idea. The taxi way is now all torn up since last week to get resurfaced. If it flew off upon first taking off - that would be hard to find! I had a friend who put his cell phone on the tail of his wing (not me!) forgot about it - took off - and then later found his phone at the departure end of the runway maybe 200 yards off - probably fell a hundred or two hundred feet. Found it by calling it. The fancy cap is what was installed in 2015 (6?) when I did Monroy LR tanks. Jose are you here? In all likelihood I won't find the old cap and need to find out what I have to replace it. Are most of the lr tank caps the same? There is a M20M broken wing on eBay right now - with lr tanks and I emailed to them asking if they have the cap. Hoping they do and hoping the lr tank caps are all the same. Who is osuav8ter and why does he know about caps? help! :-) E AOPA Pilot mag had a story about someone whose door wasn’t fully closed and their wife’s cell fell out in the Arizona desert. They found that one with the find my iPhone app. Phone still working. This in no way helps you find a fuel cap, but I’d ask @Alan Fox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 1 hour ago, aviatoreb said: Is that Jose? Yes, that's Jose's newest name. @OSUAV8TER makes all kinds of hoses, gaskets and seals. He'll likely know your fuel cap. And what Orings / gaskets / seals it uses to keep the fuel in and water out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smwash02 Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 I also have the Monroy tanks in my K, but all 4 of my caps look the same, probably are all the Shaw #531-001 in your parts list. I know for sure they're not Newton ones like your photo. Regarding the part numbers -- 05-21999 is the A/C spruce catalog number for the manufacturer (Newton) part number A3L. It looks like Newton expanded their part numbers at some point. On the Aero 300 page, A3L correlates to CA-AA-005, which is their locking silver cap. Unless you have a locking one, I suspect you'd need the A3S -- if it's the right one. Perhaps you could email them some photos? A bummer the part number isn't stamped on it. The #531-001 is a 60mm diameter and the A3S is 57.7 center / 62.5 outer per the spec sheet. Might be worth the $100 gamble. I wonder if they're interchangeable with the Shaw caps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 9 hours ago, smwash02 said: I also have the Monroy tanks in my K, but all 4 of my caps look the same, probably are all the Shaw #531-001 in your parts list. I know for sure they're not Newton ones like your photo. Regarding the part numbers -- 05-21999 is the A/C spruce catalog number for the manufacturer (Newton) part number A3L. It looks like Newton expanded their part numbers at some point. On the Aero 300 page, A3L correlates to CA-AA-005, which is their locking silver cap. Unless you have a locking one, I suspect you'd need the A3S -- if it's the right one. Perhaps you could email them some photos? A bummer the part number isn't stamped on it. The #531-001 is a 60mm diameter and the A3S is 57.7 center / 62.5 outer per the spec sheet. Might be worth the $100 gamble. I wonder if they're interchangeable with the Shaw caps. Thanks all. Paul at weepnomore who did the install (talked to him yesterday) said that at some point the Monroy kits switched from shaw caps that match the original caps as in the oem inner cap to what I have. What I have looks and feels fancier and more modern, but I wish I had the original with a keeper leash. I mean since the start I was worried about this and wished I had a leash - and now more so. Does anyone else on here have the fancy Newton caps like I do? Unless I can get a positive definitive assertion as to what is the part number soon, I might just order that part from spruce based on caliper measurements. And take a shot. I am going to call Newton in England in a few minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smwash02 Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 5 minutes ago, aviatoreb said: What I have looks and feels fancier and more modern, but I wish I had the original with a keeper leash. I mean since the start I was worried about this and wished I had a leash - and now more so. Thanks for the info. If it makes you feel any better about yours, I don't have leashes on mine either and have the same worry. I briefly lost one on my 150 years ago, which turned up on a taxiway, and have been hyper diligent since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 9 minutes ago, smwash02 said: Thanks for the info. If it makes you feel any better about yours, I don't have leashes on mine either and have the same worry. I briefly lost one on my 150 years ago, which turned up on a taxiway, and have been hyper diligent since. Thanks for helping me feel better. I probably simply lost it the stupid way - and I am feeling pretty stupid. I have always been aware this was a possibility and I am annoyed it doesn't have leashes. I am going to do a new procedure for now on. If I take it off to refuel, I will immediately place it on the tks window spritzer (because it will stay nicely there) and then if I were stupid enough to forget it - it would be immediately in my field of view if I get into the airplane. Plus I am going to be even more hyper vigilant. And I am going to add it to my hold short check list. ...now back to - I need to find what it is I need to buy! Does anyone know for sure. E 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 46 minutes ago, aviatoreb said: Thanks for helping me feel better. I probably simply lost it the stupid way - and I am feeling pretty stupid. I have always been aware this was a possibility and I am annoyed it doesn't have leashes. I am going to do a new procedure for now on. If I take it off to refuel, I will immediately place it on the tks window spritzer (because it will stay nicely there) and then if I were stupid enough to forget it - it would be immediately in my field of view if I get into the airplane. Plus I am going to be even more hyper vigilant. And I am going to add it to my hold short check list. ...now back to - I need to find what it is I need to buy! Does anyone know for sure. E I'm not sure a leash is a good idea. Imagine that you get airborne with the cap beating on the wing until you land or it breaks the leash. The damage could be far more costly than replacing the cap. Clarence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 27 minutes ago, M20Doc said: I'm not sure a leash is a good idea. Imagine that you get airborne with the cap beating on the wing until you land or it breaks the leash. The damage could be far more costly than replacing the cap. Clarence Mooney used to put retainer chains on fuel caps for R and S, but seems they not only quit but issued an SB for those in the field to be removed. Was there a problem with the chain breaking and falling inside the tank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A64Pilot Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 34 minutes ago, M20Doc said: I'm not sure a leash is a good idea. Imagine that you get airborne with the cap beating on the wing until you land or it breaks the leash. The damage could be far more costly than replacing the cap. Clarence However the banging does alert you to a problem. It’s surprising how much fuel can be sucked out in such a short time. ‘I did it on my 140, that has a chain lease, I had no idea what was banging, but found that if I put it in a slip it didn’t bang. After landing it took me a while to figure it out as you can’t see it from the ground and nothing else was loose on the airplane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadrach Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 (edited) Don’t beat yourself up too much Eric. I did this once launching out of Frederick and I was still in my 30s. It was a busy day at the self-serve and I was feeling pressured to not waste any time. On climb out I looked left and down at the t hangers where a friend was watching me depart. I was mortified to see a big black hole where the fuel cap should’ve been. I return to land and during roll out saw the cap lying on the taxiway I had used earlier. Tower gave me permission to retrieve it and I was on my way with my tail between my legs... I would bet that your cap departed the airplane before you were airborne. If you’re able to, check the runway. I wouldn’t worry that the taxiway is torn up, I would check that thoroughly as well. I think calling the airport manager is a good idea. It’s not the kind of thing that ground personnel would just throw in the trash Edited June 22, 2021 by Shadrach 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtVandelay Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 I added it to my customized checklist when I forgot to close my oil filler door : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCarlton Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 Never lost one, but after 15+ years of flying my Mooney, I now carry a spare fuel cap in my luggage compartment. Just in case... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 2 hours ago, M20Doc said: I'm not sure a leash is a good idea. Imagine that you get airborne with the cap beating on the wing until you land or it breaks the leash. The damage could be far more costly than replacing the cap. Clarence The oem cap by shaw on my inner tanks has a leash and I really like it. Even though as you say...the damage of bouncing around. I suspect it didn't just come loose as I wish I could forgive myself but rather I just stupidly didn't put it back on. :-( Anyway there is no leash possibility so its all a theoretical argument. All I can do is change my operations to 1) double down on being careful with this item, 2) put it on my check list. 3) if I take it off then I will put it on my tks window spritzer so it will be in full view if my error breaks through 1-2 then hopefully 3 I will see it. Anyway after some input and knowledgable info from people at Wilmar and measurements, I think it is the Newton aero 300 cap which I ordered. Fingers crossed it fits! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 56 minutes ago, DCarlton said: Never lost one, but after 15+ years of flying my Mooney, I now carry a spare fuel cap in my luggage compartment. Just in case... You know what - that is a good idea. I think I should do that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy95W Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 The dumbest way to lose 5 gallons of 100LL? Forget to put the fuel cap back on. The dumbest way to lose 10 gallons? Do it twice (like me). Both times it was the pilot side. Now when I refuel, I put that cap on the cowling in front of my seat. Haven’t done it since. Found the first on the taxiway, the second time on the runway. I was lucky. I think Ross is right- call the airport where you lost it. Somebody probably found it on the taxiway going to the active runway. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 40 minutes ago, Andy95W said: The dumbest way to lose 5 gallons of 100LL? Forget to put the fuel cap back on. The dumbest way to lose 10 gallons? Do it twice (like me). Both times it was the pilot side. Now when I refuel, I put that cap on the cowling in front of my seat. Haven’t done it since. Found the first on the taxiway, the second time on the runway. I was lucky. I think Ross is right- call the airport where you lost it. Somebody probably found it on the taxiway going to the active runway. I tried but the guy I want to talk to is actually at the airport whereas the number just leads to the village that officially manages it and they say go talk to Bill...so I need to go to the airport and talk to Bill. I ordered a new one but I would be very please to get my old one to keep as a spare. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaylw314 Posted June 22, 2021 Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 20 minutes ago, aviatoreb said: I tried but the guy I want to talk to is actually at the airport whereas the number just leads to the village that officially manages it and they say go talk to Bill...so I need to go to the airport and talk to Bill. I ordered a new one but I would be very please to get my old one to keep as a spare. Usually on AirNav they list the phone number for the airport manager? FWIW, I lost a fuel cap last year I talked to the airport manager and FBO but they hadn't seen it, so I ordered a new one. I week later, they called and said they found it off the runway, so sometimes it turns up later. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aviatoreb Posted June 22, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2021 1 hour ago, jaylw314 said: Usually on AirNav they list the phone number for the airport manager? FWIW, I lost a fuel cap last year I talked to the airport manager and FBO but they hadn't seen it, so I ordered a new one. I week later, they called and said they found it off the runway, so sometimes it turns up later. I live in this town - its a small town. I called the number on airnav. It was the village head office - which is maybe 7 or 8 blocks from my house. There is a message with one of those numerical choices, press 1 if you want to talk to the village manager. press 2 if you need to talk to tax collection, press 3 if you have a problem with water, etc... None are about the airport. So I need to go down there - and its like cheers - everyone knows your name. They will assume I am there to pay for my hangar which I do in person every month. Then I will say I want to talk to Bill C - and they will tell me where he is (in town) and then I will need to go find him. We don't have phones here - I mean people have them - but we don't know how to use them because its still like 1949 here in smallsville usa. If it will be found - I will get it! E 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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