Learning to fly in a M20K?

[Parker_Woodruff]

I'm a big fan of getting your private in a rental and then buying the Mooney.  The coverage options pre-private in Mooneys are not good.

[midlifeflyer]

5 hours ago, RobertGary1 said:

Those advocating getting another plane first and then selling it and buying the Mooney must not live in California where we have to pay 10% of the purchase price to the state on each purchase. 

Many states exempt private aircraft sales (not in the sales biz) from their sales and use tax. 

[BDPetersen]

We trained quite a few folks in the fixed gear, fixed prop M20D. I suppose those items could be kept out of the mix for early stages of training. Or not.

[skykrawler]

I know Air Force pilots that went from DA20 to Texan II in 20hrs and then to F22 at 250.   These are highly selected candidates.   It depends on your aptitude.  Can you fix a lawn mower or a car and understand complex systems?  Some people apparently gear up their airplane on the first flight home after purchase.

[Warren]

I am certainly not the average but I got my private in a Cessna and bought the M20K with about 65 hours.

I would absolutely recommend getting through your private while abusing a flight school plane and not your own.  Cessna's take the abuse better, are more forgiving and most importantly are not your problem long term.

I am an engineer (we can debate whether this is good or bad) with a background in engine and fuel system development.  The turbo management and temperature management as well as the complications of lean vs. rich, too hot, too cold,... came relatively easy to me -- probably a lot easier than most.  However, it was a handful to jump in and add propellor management, gear, cowl flaps, general temperature management, potential overboost (M20K 231), a much slicker airframe and the associated speed management as well as a plane that takes more finesse on landing.

I can also tell you that I wouldn't do it any other way and am happy with my decision based on my aptitude and experience.

Here is the time to be brutally honest with yourself:

1.  Do you have a natural aptitude for flying - did it come quickly or did you have to work hard.

2.  Did engine management, leaning, starting,... come easily.

3.  Do you have good spacial perception when flying around other planes, in the landing pattern, finding other traffic, general awareness of airspace,...  It is hard to transition to a faster airplane and stay ahead of the plane.

If you honestly feel like you have a good aptitude vs. have to put in the hours, struggle and learn the hard way, you could make it work as a low hour pilot.

I also learned the plane and soon started into Instrument training with an experienced instructor in higher performance airplanes.  This was a great way to also learn to fly the plane and get lots of supervised experience.

I also know one moderately experience pilot - went through learning the hard way and generally is in the "has to work hard to learn" portion of pilots.  He has had two prop strikes and the associated engine teardown/inspection and prop work -- this is a very expensive way to transition into a Mooney.  He is terrified of landing the plane, has spent a ton of money in fixing the plane, has spent lots on additional training hours and has generally had a miserable experience.

So, there is the good and the bad.  You will have to evaluate yourself and live with your choice.

Good luck with your choice, abuse someone elses plane while learning and buy a plane when you think it works for you.

[RJBrown]

Warren is right about aptitude.

To some people flying come natural..

My father in law was a B-52 jock from way back. When I met him he had not been in the pilots seat for over a decade. Smoothest stick I ever flew with, greased his first landing in my Rocket. Heading and altitude? You’d think the autopilot was on.

I was an experienced R/C pilot and flight instructor for the largest R/C club in Denver. Greased my first landing on my discover flight. My instructor was surprised at what seemed to come naturally.

Conversely I had a friend in my ground school class that I had to review every lesson with him so he could understand the basics of flight. He had to work really hard to get his license. He felt like if he took a month off he had to start over.

 

[Will.iam]

7 hours ago, skykrawler said:

I know Air Force pilots that went from DA20 to Texan II in 20hrs and then to F22 at 250.   These are highly selected candidates.   It depends on your aptitude.  Can you fix a lawn mower or a car and understand complex systems?  Some people apparently gear up their airplane on the first flight home after purchase.

When i was going through in ‘99 the screener program was grounded so they were taking fresh  candidates that for some had bever been in a plane and stuck them in the T37 tweet. Most got through the program but thats a steep learning curve and the jet engines literally took 13 seconds to spool up from idle to takeoff thrust. To say you had to think early to goaround was an understatement.   

[Gubni]

I have 40 hours and I am buying a M20K 252 next week. I'm buying it because it's an amazing deal on an amazing plane and comes with hangar space which is almost impossible to get here. My mission is long distance and this is my dream plane. Now with all that said I don't plan to train in it. I will sit in the seat and familiarize myself with the panel and learn everything I can. After I get my PPL I plan to do my IFR training in it. For insurance it won't be in my name until I get my PPL. To be honest I'm just so excited to get one of the best planes ever made and I hope you are too. How many hours do you have in your logbook?

 

Edited May 16, 2021 by Gubni

[Will.iam]

33 minutes ago, Gubni said:

I have 40 hours and I am buying a M20K 252 next week. I'm buying it because it's an amazing deal on an amazing plane and comes with hangar space which is almost impossible to get here. My mission is long distance and this is my dream plane. Now with all that said I don't plan to train in it. I will sit in the seat and familiarize myself with the panel and learn everything I can. After I get my PPL I plan to do my IFR training in it. For insurance it won't be in my name until I get my PPL. To be honest I'm just so excited to get one of the best planes ever made and I hope you are too. How many hours do you have in your logbook?

 

Congrats on the find 252 are rare, encores even more rare but you can convert your 252 to an encore later if you choose. Show pics when you get her. 

[Gubni]

6 minutes ago, Will.iam said:

Congrats on the find 252 are rare, encores even more rare but you can convert your 252 to an encore later if you choose. Show pics when you get her. 

I don't want to hijack this thread, but thanks you. It's really a 231 with a firewall forward 252 conversion and a few other speed mods so it's a 261 done by Modworks which is now out of business. Because of this I don't think it's eligible for the encore conversion, but still an amazing plane. I'll start a new thread when I have a bill of sale.

Edited May 16, 2021 by Gubni

[Schllc]

9 hours ago, Gubni said:

I don't want to hijack this thread, but thanks you. It's really a 231 with a firewall forward 252 conversion and a few other speed mods so it's a 261 done by Modworks which is now out of business. Because of this I don't think it's eligible for the encore conversion, but still an amazing plane. I'll start a new thread when I have a bill of sale.

Congratulations, and Welcome to the Mooney community!!  
You are going to love it!

It would be a great time to start working on your ifr as soon as the ppl is completed. 
you will develop all of your critical skills and habits in the airplane you intend to fly.

I was similar in hours to where you are, when I got my gx ovation.  
Insurance required me to get 25 hours dual, if I recall correctly, before solo and 50 before passengers. 
I flew probably 60 in the Mooney before I was comfortable taking non pilot passengers. almost all of that 60 was preparation for my ifr.  
It was the best decision for me, financially and for safety. 
Its not the best method for everyone I guess, and I don’t think the more common approach of flying a 172 for two years is bad.  All experience can be beneficial, but I really “know” my airplane. 
Personally, my opinion is it’s never too soon to buy a Mooney if you are committed to good training, set healthy personal limits, and get good instruction.

things happen quicker, but that’s why we all fly..

to go FAST!!!!

[BenLaw]

Thanks all,

I appreciate your thoughts, and now I know more of what "I don't know" than before. So I think I will wait a year before getting the Mooney and just concentrate on getting a license for now. But I will still put my name down on the 3-5 year waiting list for an open hangar!

cheers,

Ben

[carusoam]

Ben,

Keep hanging out here!

It isn’t a requirement to have a Mooney to be here...

You can learn a lot every day just by reading the headlines....

All of it will apply to where you are going...

So many steps to conquer...

No need to rush into things...

PP thoughts only, not a CFI...

Best regards,

-a-

[gsxrpilot]

27 minutes ago, BenLaw said:

Thanks all,

I appreciate your thoughts, and now I know more of what "I don't know" than before. So I think I will wait a year before getting the Mooney and just concentrate on getting a license for now. But I will still put my name down on the 3-5 year waiting list for an open hangar!

cheers,

Ben

Many of us who have hangars, got them before the airplane. A hangar is a lot harder to find than the airplane.

[Will.iam]

Be careful with getting the hanger before the airplane as the hanger will likely fill up with other items if you don’t watch out.