jetdriven Posted June 5, 2022 Report Share Posted June 5, 2022 On 5/7/2021 at 3:47 PM, Chris Strube said: But Clarence, you are your own AME! For my plane that’s also true. Here’s the problem, if I crash the plane on the first flight after maintenance I don’t know who to blame….the pilot or the mechanic 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 5, 2022 Report Share Posted June 5, 2022 15 hours ago, SLOWR426 said: Can anyone confirm the Lycoming-approved method of adjusting power % during break-in of an IO-360 in a complex like my M20F? Manifold pressure vs. RPM? Any combo is OK to achieve 85%, etc. In the performance charts? Here is the link to the Lycoming SI. 85% power is higher than recommended. https://www.lycoming.com/sites/default/files/Lycoming Reciprocating engine Break-In and Oil Consumption.pdf Clarence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ned Gravel Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 On 5/7/2021 at 5:11 PM, M20Doc said: Take your AME with you. Clarence Says my AME. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yetti Posted June 7, 2022 Report Share Posted June 7, 2022 Still have not answered the question by page 2. This is what I do. Flashlight with visual and tactile checks. Check nuts and hoses pull and push on things gently. Start top to bottom on one side. Then move to the other side. Do a really slow Walk around. Then do a ground run. Then do several fast passes down the runway. Bring it back open it up and check everything again. Then a fast pass. Then fly up to 5-7000 feet above the airport. Come and land and look for leaks. Now you are ready to go fly/break in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildhorsetrail Posted June 7, 2022 Report Share Posted June 7, 2022 I've made some boo boos forgetting something while wrenching on an airplane. I've found it's essential for me to go back through all the maintenance steps I've taken. I check all the things visually as I mentally rehearse what I just did. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 7, 2022 Report Share Posted June 7, 2022 Break in flight is not rocket science, you guys are far overthinking it. The S/I lays out the procedure, what it doesn’t say is how to alter the power between 65&75% power, so one can conclude that it doesn’t matter whether is MAP or RPM. I prefer to change RPM as MAP is important to keep the rings in contact with the cylinder walls. Before flight the engine should have been ground run to find and correct any issues, like leaks etc. The first portion of the flight should be close to the airport just in case but after that the flight should be no more dangerous than any other flight. Clarence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fly Boomer Posted June 7, 2022 Report Share Posted June 7, 2022 1 hour ago, M20Doc said: The first portion of the flight should be close to the airport just in case but after that the flight should be no more dangerous than any other flight. You trust your mechanic more than I trust mine. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 7, 2022 Report Share Posted June 7, 2022 8 hours ago, Fly Boomer said: You trust your mechanic more than I trust mine. I am my own mechanic and about 130 others. Clarence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fly Boomer Posted June 7, 2022 Report Share Posted June 7, 2022 1 minute ago, M20Doc said: I am my own mechanic and about 130 others. I know. My sense of humor. I should have put a smiley with that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T. Peterson Posted August 13, 2022 Report Share Posted August 13, 2022 On 5/8/2021 at 11:54 AM, kortopates said: I hope any one that has previously picked up their plane after an invasive annual and didn't think much about departing IFR, and often on a weekend day after the shop was closed, takes your post to heart on the importance of both a thorough pre-flight (that wouldn't necessarily find the above issue) as well as a return to service flight above the airport! Stuff happens unfortunately and we're test pilots after significant maintenance. Forgive my ignorance, but doesn’t the mx shop do a test flight of the plane after an annual and prior to releasing it to the owner? I am having my first annual done the end of this month. Torrey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron McBride Posted August 13, 2022 Report Share Posted August 13, 2022 I had an engine failure just before rotation in a C310 post annual flight. IA had given me BFR a couple of weeks earlier. replaced a broken cylinder and had to do it again next week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PT20J Posted August 13, 2022 Report Share Posted August 13, 2022 34 minutes ago, T. Peterson said: Forgive my ignorance, but doesn’t the mx shop do a test flight of the plane after an annual and prior to releasing it to the owner? I am having my first annual done the end of this month. Torrey That’s pretty unusual due to lack of maintenance personnel that are pilots or meet insurance requirements for a lot of different airplanes. Even in two Part-135 operations I flew for the pilots had to do the test flight after maintenance before returning to the line. Skip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 13, 2022 Report Share Posted August 13, 2022 5 hours ago, T. Peterson said: Forgive my ignorance, but doesn’t the mx shop do a test flight of the plane after an annual and prior to releasing it to the owner? I am having my first annual done the end of this month. Torrey From the things I’ve read here, many maintainers are hardly qualified to fix these things, are you sure you’d want them to fly them as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T. Peterson Posted August 13, 2022 Report Share Posted August 13, 2022 9 hours ago, M20Doc said: From the things I’ve read here, many maintainers are hardly qualified to fix these things, are you sure you’d want them to fly them as well? I would certainly trust you to fix and fly my airplane, but that is not to say I would trust anyone to fix or fly my plane. I only know you from your posts and the reputation you enjoy on this forum, but if I was in Canada you are the one I would seek out to maintain my airplane. Fortunately I also have some excellent choices in Texas of which Don Maxwell is one. Torrey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T. Peterson Posted August 13, 2022 Report Share Posted August 13, 2022 14 hours ago, PT20J said: That’s pretty unusual due to lack of maintenance personnel that are pilots or meet insurance requirements for a lot of different airplanes. Even in two Part-135 operations I flew for the pilots had to do the test flight after maintenance before returning to the line. Skip Good point. If a shop has a good reputation I am fine with flying the airplane applying the caveats previously mentioned by the other posters. Fortunately the shop I have chosen is reported to do a post check flight. Certainly not a problem if they don’t, but definitely contributes to a “warm and fuzzy” if they do! Torrey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carusoam Posted August 13, 2022 Report Share Posted August 13, 2022 Offering a mechanic a ride after he works on your plane… Probably earns an extra thought about how well he completed his work… Flying the plane is not exactly how I would test to see how well the work was completed… But, if it is going to have an oil leak…. It will probably show up pretty quickly. Trust, but verify… Worst thing left incomplete on my M20C after an annual… the battery mount was removed and not quite replaced… Expect things to be done by the book…. It is nice if you can be there to review the work before things get buttoned up… (if that is your thing) Since it is your first annual with this plane… be there, take pics, learn where everything is…. Start planning how to make improvements for next year’s annual… PP thoughts only, some planes are in newer condition than my old 65C was…. Best regards, -a- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T. Peterson Posted August 14, 2022 Report Share Posted August 14, 2022 11 hours ago, carusoam said: Offering a mechanic a ride after he works on your plane… Probably earns an extra thought about how well he completed his work… Flying the plane is not exactly how I would test to see how well the work was completed… But, if it is going to have an oil leak…. It will probably show up pretty quickly. Trust, but verify… Worst thing left incomplete on my M20C after an annual… the battery mount was removed and not quite replaced… Expect things to be done by the book…. It is nice if you can be there to review the work before things get buttoned up… (if that is your thing) Since it is your first annual with this plane… be there, take pics, learn where everything is…. Start planning how to make improvements for next year’s annual… PP thoughts only, some planes are in newer condition than my old 65C was…. Best regards, -a- Thank you -a-. Solid advice as always. Torrey 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skykrawler Posted August 14, 2022 Report Share Posted August 14, 2022 Recognizing this is an old thread..... The annual checklist https://themooneyflyer.com/pdf/Mooney100HourAnnualGuide.pdf has a post maintenance operational check section at the end. Of course it also depends on what was done to you airplane. I've ferried airplanes after painting and always look over the flight controls very carefully. Engine replacement demands a look at fuel and oil lines, control connections and proper operation, tightness of magnetos as a start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 14, 2022 Report Share Posted August 14, 2022 Here is the new version of the Mooney inspection checklist. https://www.mooney.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/100-HOURANNUAL-Inspection-Guide.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 14, 2022 Report Share Posted August 14, 2022 On 8/13/2022 at 1:25 PM, T. Peterson said: Good point. If a shop has a good reputation I am fine with flying the airplane applying the caveats previously mentioned by the other posters. Fortunately the shop I have chosen is reported to do a post check flight. Certainly not a problem if they don’t, but definitely contributes to a “warm and fuzzy” if they do! Torrey No shop is perfect, any time a human is involved there is a chance for an error. When they fly your plane after maintenance is no guarantee that things are done correctly. It just means it didn’t fail on their flight. For example this nut on an aileron control didn’t fall off on the test flight or the next few flights, it’s waiting to kill you later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N201MKTurbo Posted August 14, 2022 Report Share Posted August 14, 2022 3 hours ago, M20Doc said: No shop is perfect, any time a human is involved there is a chance for an error. When they fly your plane after maintenance is no guarantee that things are done correctly. It just means it didn’t fail on their flight. For example this nut on an aileron control didn’t fall off on the test flight or the next few flights, it’s waiting to kill you later. There is a spare yoke on the other side…. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T. Peterson Posted August 15, 2022 Report Share Posted August 15, 2022 7 hours ago, M20Doc said: No shop is perfect, any time a human is involved there is a chance for an error. When they fly your plane after maintenance is no guarantee that things are done correctly. It just means it didn’t fail on their flight. For example this nut on an aileron control didn’t fall off on the test flight or the next few flights, it’s waiting to kill you later. Yikes!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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