Is the passenger yoke required...

[Jocbay]

for our Mooney's to be airworthy?  If not so, are there those that fly without one?  Would make ingress and egress easier and open up access and the view to that part of the panel.  Though in an emergency it might hamper the efforts of a passenger pilot... abit.  No real plans to do so, the question just happened to pop into my noggin today.

[carusoam]

John,

Expect that an STC would be needed to define the change...

The annual goes through the process of making sure the plane is as designed and built....

Having the parts removed... probably wouldn’t change a thing...  except WnB...

 

It sure would be crummy to be the first person to have a Mooney yoke failure, after you removed the other side.... 

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic...

Best regards,

-a-

 

[RLCarter]

Removing the Yoke leaves the shaft which might as well be sword

[kerry]

I really don't see how removing the yoke would impede the view of the panel or make it more difficult to enter or exit the airplane.  It even seems like the yoke being present can help in that matter.

[Skates97]

9 minutes ago, kerry said:

I really don't see how removing the yoke would impede the view of the panel or make it more difficult to enter or exit the airplane.  It even seems like the yoke being present can help in that matter.

I just always run the trim all the way forward and that puts it well out of the way for whoever is getting out. As far as the panel goes, I don't even notice the yoke over there when I'm looking at the right side, after a bit the brain just tunes that out and focuses on what you want to look at.

[Seth]

That's a neat idea. I don't see why not. But likely, there needs to be an STC delete. It could be an easy STC delete dollars wise as it will be mostly paperwork, unless the shaft requires a ton of work to plug or cut.

-Seth

[Hank]

Why would removing the yoke require an STC? Many people here fly regularly with the back seats removed, and some with the right front seat removed. 

Although I do agree that the shaft should be removed with the yoke.

[bradp]

You could remove it from its base presumably-but would need to be able to control the link ends so it doesn’t bind and make you dead. 
 

Or just remove yoke keep the shaft and install something like a permanent iPad mount that would stick out less than the yoke by a few inches and not be included in the sword category. 

[RobertGary1]

4 hours ago, Hank said:

Why would removing the yoke require an STC? Many people here fly regularly with the back seats removed, and some with the right front seat removed. 

Although I do agree that the shaft should be removed with the yoke.

The Mooney manual says you can remove the back seat. I haven't seen the same said of the yoke. 

[RobertGary1]

What will you do if you want to get a BFR or IPC in the plane later?

-Robert

[A64Pilot]

Removing weight from the flight control system effects the mass balance of the system.

‘I believe you would have to show that there would be no ill effect of removing the weight, but you don’t have to show there isn’t to clamp on a Garmin 696, a question I’ve often pondered and cannot come up with a reason why not.

I used to think the Beechcraft throw over yoke was a neat idea, until I flew in one, that cross bar really gets in the way of viewing the panel. I’m astonished no one has an STC for moving the gear switch to the top of the panel, where it can be seen, and can’t be misinterpreted for the flap switch.

Edited March 31, 2021 by A64Pilot

[David Lloyd]

My original equipment list shows dual controls listed at 3.5 pounds.  Wonder if any were produced with single controls.  Dual brakes are on a different line.

[Yetti]

14 hours ago, carusoam said:

John,

Expect that an STC would be needed to define the change...

The annual goes through the process of making sure the plane is as designed and built....

Having the parts removed... probably wouldn’t change a thing...  except WnB...

 

It sure would be crummy to be the first person to have a Mooney yoke failure, after you removed the other side.... 

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic...

Best regards,

-a-

 

I thought someone had a control shaft failure and had to use the other side to steer things.

[Hank]

6 hours ago, Yetti said:

I thought someone had a control shaft failure and had to use the other side to steer things.

I know someone who had a PTT failure and had to wear the copilot headset and use the right PTT button. I found out when I flew that plane once . . . 

[Seth]

On 3/31/2021 at 2:35 PM, Yetti said:

I thought someone had a control shaft failure and had to use the other side to steer things.

I know someone's yoke broke off and they used the other side. No a control shaft failure.

I personally broke the PTT switch on my yoke once, so mid flight I plugged my headset into the other side and reached over to the other side to press the PTT for communication the rest of the flight. Diverted to a trusted shop and sat there while the PTT switch was repaired.

-Seth

Edited April 2, 2021 by Seth

[Yetti]

10 hours ago, Seth said:

I know someone's yoke broke off and they used the other side. No a control shaft failure.

I personally broke the PTT switch on my yoke once, so mid flight I plugged my headset into the other side and reached over to the other side to press the PTT for communication the rest of the flight. Diverted to a trusted shop and sat there while the PTT switch was repaired.

-Seth

Generally speaking the PTT will work both headsets.   Now i have to go look at a pin out diagram.

[RobertGary1]

10 hours ago, Seth said:

I know someone's yoke broke off and they used the other side. No a control shaft failure.

I personally broke the PTT switch on my yoke once, so mid flight I plugged my headset into the other side and reached over to the other side to press the PTT for communication the rest of the flight. Diverted to a trusted shop and sat there while the PTT switch was repaired.

-Seth

I’ve always kept a backup hand mic. Try to remember to use it occasionally just to test it. 

[Hank]

14 minutes ago, Yetti said:

Generally speaking the PTT will work both headsets.   Now i have to go look at a pin out diagram.

Many times I've hit the PTT on my yoke while a rightseater was talking. Only my voice was transmitted. To send both mics at the same time would be horrible!

[Vance Harral]

25 minutes ago, Hank said:

Many times I've hit the PTT on my yoke while a rightseater was talking. Only my voice was transmitted. To send both mics at the same time would be horrible!

The radios that do the transmitting only have a single mic input (two wires, one for the actual audio and one for the PTT).  The behavior of a multi-input system is governed by the audio panel and/or intercom to which the headsets connect.

It's possible to set up a system where both mics transmit when any PTT switch is activated.  But that would be unusual, because as you said, it's almost always undesirable.  I've flown in airplanes with portable intercoms and PTTs which transmit both mics when any PTT switch is pressed, but this is usually an accident of bad hookup/design/PTT understanding.  Any panel-mounted setup installed by an avionics shop is going to have independent PTT behavior.

[steingar]

Airplanes started out with sticks.  The reason they moved to yokes was to make it easier to get into the airplane.

[bradp]

1 hour ago, steingar said:

Airplanes started out with sticks.  The reason they moved to yokes was to make it easier to get into the airplane.

Why do embaers and Concorde’s have yokes upside down?

[carusoam]

If having two yokes available to the one pilot were important... what would all those cub drivers do..?

 

Brad,

The answer to your question... can be proven on one level....

Just by holding your hands out in front of you...

in the most relaxed, comfortable way...

 

Close your eyes, Count to about 10...

 

When you open your eyes and look at your hands... are they oriented like they are holding a Mooney’s yoke... or the Embraer’s?

Ergonomics was probably invented in the 80s some time...

 

PP thoughts only, not a futurist...

Best regards,

-a-

 

These guys don’t look like they’re hand flying this thing much...  

Lots of zeros on the IP...