Looking for used JPI EDM 900 or 930 - I have a 700 so don't need CHT/EGT wires

[sdflysurf]

I have the 700 so I don't need wires. But eventually will need the other wires to move my Oil/Fuel/Tach/etc

[carusoam]

8 hours ago, sdflysurf said:

I have the 700 so I don't need wires. But eventually will need the other wires to move my Oil/Fuel/Tach/etc

Technically yes,

legally know....  

The JPI900 uses different part numbers for the certified primary device... regarding the existing TCs...

Kind of an FYI in case you didn’t know...

You should be able to verify this pretty easily.

 

PP thoughts only, not a mechanic...

Best regards,

-a-

[gsxrpilot]

It's pretty rare to find a used 900 or 930 as that is typically the culmination of the journey to modern engine management. You might find someone pulling one out to put in a G3X, but again, it's rare.

When/if you do find one, you'll need the full kit including all the probes and wires. It can't be certified primary otherwise. 

JPI will also have to "recondition" the unit to match your airplane. Again, as it's certified primary and therefore the redlines on the tach, MP, FF, etc. have to match your POH/type cert.

I love buying used equipment. My first rule is "never pay retail". But one of the very few items in my panel purchased new was my EDM900. It was just too much trouble to install a used one.

[ArtVandelay]

The JPI900 uses different part numbers for the certified primary device...

The CHT and EGT probes are the same part numbers. So if upgrading you can use the existing probes and save yourself some time.

[LANCECASPER]

I bought a used JPI930 on Beechtalk from someone with a 6 cylinder Cessna who was going to pull it out and put it a G3X. I sent it into JPI to have it programmed for a Mooney M20M for $500. For what I paid plus what additional sensors I would I need I figured I would save at least $2000 so I went for it. When I sent it into JPI after some time went by I started checking on it. Finally they sent my a 930, but it was not my serial number and it was programmed for another airplane by the sticker on the back of the unit. I called and when we got to the bottom of it, mine had been shipped off to the Philippines by mistake. After realizing what they had done, that same day they programmed a brand new 930 (newer style than the one I had sent in) and did not charge me for the $500 programming/STC fee and gave me the additional sensors I needed for the M20M free of charge. They included 2 day return shipping at no charge as well and e-mailed me a label to return the one they had sent me. So I appreciate the way they took care of their mistake. That delay however cost me a time slot in an avionics shop in early 2020 and finally now just a few weeks ago I had it installed along with some other things.

All of that being said I don't think I've ever seen another used JPI930 for sale. I've only seen one or two 900s come up for sale. You might save $1000-$2000 but sometimes it's better to let the shop sell you a new unit and then they can stand behind it.

[sdflysurf]

Thanks for the responses - It isn't that much more to get the right one, on time....so might still go that route.  I'll check back.

[ZuluZulu]

4 hours ago, sdflysurf said:

Thanks for the responses - It isn't that much more to get the right one, on time....so might still go that route.  I'll check back.

If you end up buying new make sure you get a quote from @Jeev - he is likely to have the best possible price.  I thought about the 900 but I’m sticking with the 730 for now, probably adding Garmin EIS down the road, but when I added a few probes, his prices were the best I could find by far.

[J Bird]

On 3/21/2021 at 7:51 AM, LANCECASPER said:

I bought a used JPI930 on Beechtalk from someone with a 6 cylinder Cessna who was going to pull it out and put it a G3X. I sent it into JPI to have it programmed for a Mooney M20M for $500. For what I paid plus what additional sensors I would I need I figured I would save at least $2000 so I went for it. When I sent it into JPI after some time went by I started checking on it. Finally they sent my a 930, but it was not my serial number and it was programmed for another airplane by the sticker on the back of the unit. I called and when we got to the bottom of it, mine had been shipped off to the Philippines by mistake. After realizing what they had done, that same day they programmed a brand new 930 (newer style than the one I had sent in) and did not charge me for the $500 programming/STC fee and gave me the additional sensors I needed for the M20M free of charge. They included 2 day return shipping at no charge as well and e-mailed me a label to return the one they had sent me. So I appreciate the way they took care of their mistake. That delay however cost me a time slot in an avionics shop in early 2020 and finally now just a few weeks ago I had it installed along with some other things.

All of that being said I don't think I've ever seen another used JPI930 for sale. I've only seen one or two 900s come up for sale. You might save $1000-$2000 but sometimes it's better to let the shop sell you a new unit and then they can stand behind it.

.I’ve been back and forth with JPI all week on reprogramming my used JPI 930, I purchased my JPI 930 years back and it came from a Cessna T210 unfortunately the unit I have can not be reprogrammed but for $500 I’ll get the newest 930. $500 to program and $220 for the RAD. $1220 out the door for a new JPI 930 with my old unit. In couple months I’m 100% going the Encore conversion as I have 90% of the required parts and that means having the 930 setup for the Encore specs. JPI is saying they will not setup the 930 to anything other than the current 252 without an STC paperwork, I got the RMA number but damn they want me to fill out a lot of info and take pictures of the 252 POH. I really don’t want to pay $500 to program and then later this year pay another $500.

 

[gsxrpilot]

Just now, J Bird said:

.I’ve been back and forth with JPI all week on reprogramming my used JPI 930, I purchased my JPI 930 years back and it came from a Cessna T210 unfortunately the unit I have can not be reprogrammed but for $500 I’ll get the newest 930. $500 to program and $220 for the RAD. $1220 out the door for a new JPI 930 with my old unit. In couple months I’m 100% going the Encore conversion as I have 90% of the required parts and that means having the 930 setup for the Encore specs. JPI is saying they will not setup the 930 to anything other than the current 252 without an STC paperwork, I got the RMA number but damn they want me to fill out a lot of info and take pictures of the 252 POH. I really don’t want to pay $500 to program and then later this year pay another $500.

 

Who's doing the work for you? We just reprogramed my EDM900 because of the Encore conversion to my 252. Of course SWTA is doing the work, so JPI just sent them a file, upload it, and done.

[LANCECASPER]

2 hours ago, J Bird said:

.I’ve been back and forth with JPI all week on reprogramming my used JPI 930, I purchased my JPI 930 years back and it came from a Cessna T210 unfortunately the unit I have can not be reprogrammed but for $500 I’ll get the newest 930. $500 to program and $220 for the RAD. $1220 out the door for a new JPI 930 with my old unit. In couple months I’m 100% going the Encore conversion as I have 90% of the required parts and that means having the 930 setup for the Encore specs. JPI is saying they will not setup the 930 to anything other than the current 252 without an STC paperwork, I got the RMA number but damn they want me to fill out a lot of info and take pictures of the 252 POH. I really don’t want to pay $500 to program and then later this year pay another $500.

 

It makes sense. They are only going to program it as it is right now, not how it may be someday.

[J Bird]

4 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

Who's doing the work for you? We just reprogramed my EDM900 because of the Encore conversion to my 252. Of course SWTA is doing the work, so JPI just sent them a file, upload it, and done.

I understand the reprogram $500 cost going from a Cessna T210 which the box is currently setup for- to a 252 but! going from 252 to encore is a minor change definitely not worth the additional $500 for a reprogram of the RPM and Manifold pressure especially if it's as simple as an file upload.

I definitely know I want to switch my engine from a single alternator to a dual alternator setup during the overhaul so I haven't made the decision on who will do the conversion work just yet. Is there a gauge for dual alternators on the 930?

[gsxrpilot]

My point about asking who is doing the install, is that JPI as well as most manufacturers, especially as related to certificated equipment, prefer to deal with established shops rather than end customers.

I'm not sure about the 930, but my EDM900 has non-primary readouts for Voltage - bus voltage and Amps - Load and charge/discharge. The Amp load isn't specific to the Alternator. I have two alternators in my 252/Encore. They can be selected/deselected in flight. If at least one of the alternators is on, the Amp meter on the EDM900 shows a charging state. It doesn't change if both are selected on or one is selected on. If both are off, the Amp meter shows a discharge. I have an analog gauge in the panel that shows output per alternator. But the JPI doesn't show that.

[MIm20c]

29 minutes ago, J Bird said:

I understand the reprogram $500 cost going from a Cessna T210 which the box is currently setup for- to a 252 but! going from 252 to encore is a minor change definitely not worth the additional $500 for a reprogram of the RPM and Manifold pressure especially if it's as simple as an file upload.

I definitely know I want to switch my engine from a single alternator to a dual alternator setup during the overhaul so I haven't made the decision on who will do the conversion work just yet. Is there a gauge for dual alternators on the 930?

The wonderful CS at JPI treated my IA like a criminal when they shipped us a brand new 900 programmed for a bonanza with tip tanks.  In the end it just took a jump drive with the proper programming on it to switch it over.  Nothing harder than updating the firmware on a digital camera. 
 

The owner is pretty reasonable and a Mooney owner. See if you can talk with him to get a discount on the second reprogram. 

[LANCECASPER]

41 minutes ago, J Bird said:

I understand the reprogram $500 cost going from a Cessna T210 which the box is currently setup for- to a 252 but! going from 252 to encore is a minor change definitely not worth the additional $500 for a reprogram of the RPM and Manifold pressure especially if it's as simple as an file upload.

I definitely know I want to switch my engine from a single alternator to a dual alternator setup during the overhaul so I haven't made the decision on who will do the conversion work just yet. Is there a gauge for dual alternators on the 930?

I don't believe it is possible to switch a single alternator 252 over to a dual alternator version. I had looked at a single alternator version quite a few years ago and called Mooney and they said no. I held off on buying the airplane since I wanted that redundancy. Possibly some have done it though. 

[J Bird]

21 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

My point about asking who is doing the install, is that JPI as well as most manufacturers, especially as related to certificated equipment, prefer to deal with established shops rather than end customers.

I'm not sure about the 930, but my EDM900 has non-primary readouts for Voltage - bus voltage and Amps - Load and charge/discharge. The Amp load isn't specific to the Alternator. I have two alternators in my 252/Encore. They can be selected/deselected in flight. If at least one of the alternators is on, the Amp meter on the EDM900 shows a charging state. It doesn't change if both are selected on or one is selected on. If both are off, the Amp meter shows a discharge. I have an analog gauge in the panel that shows output per alternator. But the JPI doesn't show that.

Your absolutely right. I think also because of it being certified equipment. My beef was trying to avoid the second $500. Who knows there might not be a charge if I leave it up to the professionals. 

[J Bird]

5 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

I don't believe it is possible to switch a single alternator 252 over to a dual alternator version. I had looked at a single alternator version quite a few years ago and called Mooney and they said no. I held off on buying the airplane since I wanted that redundancy. Possibly some have done it though. 

I've been searching for pics of the dual setup just to get an idea of where the second alternator is located. I remember an old mechanic telling me that I would need to replace the whole case a couple months back. I thought that was just crazy cause if the same engine is in Gsxrpilot plane then why wont it fit in mines with same dimension, cowling etc?

[LANCECASPER]

One of the Mooney mechanics that used to write columns for MAPA, Joe Frisolone, mentioned once to avoid singe alternator 252's. He said they went through ship's batteries very frequently.

"If you are considering buying a rare 252 that has only one alternator (most had two), be careful. This aircraft will go through a lot of batteries. For those MAPA members that know Mr. Bill Lamb, just ask him, he will tell you. Bill is convinced that from the proceeds of the many batteries he purchased from East Coast Aviation, my son will be able to enjoy a Harvard education! "

[J Bird]

Just now, LANCECASPER said:

One of the Mooney mechanics that used to write columns for MAPA, Joe Frisolone, mentioned once to avoid singe alternator 252's. He said they went through ship's batteries very frequently.

I've also heard that before. I just replaced my Gill battery last month...... I'll see how long it lasts.

[Aerodon]

2 hours ago, J Bird said:

I've been searching for pics of the dual setup just to get an idea of where the second alternator is located. I remember an old mechanic telling me that I would need to replace the whole case a couple months back. I thought that was just crazy cause if the same engine is in Gsxrpilot plane then why wont it fit in mines with same dimension, cowling etc?

The second alternator hangs off the back of the engine and is driven by a belt drive off the accessory case.  Then you need the second voltage regulator and all the wiring back to the circuit breaker panel.  All feasible, but probably quite expensive.  And I would imagine you could get it signed off as installing a factory option, the details are all in the writing diagrams and parts manuals.

I have an engine that I am thinking of parting out, you could persuade me by giving me a large amount of money for the alternator, mounting brackets, accessory case (exchange) etc.  Send me a PM.

 

Aerodon

 

 

[carusoam]

Sounds like a rant...

I can add it to the list...

A) Gill batteries are terrible...  (hey wait... did you just buy another Gill battery..? )

B ) Champion spark plugs are terrible...

C) JPI customer service is terrible....

D) If you didn’t like the charges to reuse a technical AW related device... compare that to S-tec...

 

 

1) JPI is known for their customer service...  we use Jeev who lives in their neighborhood... and knows the nice people at JPI...

2) Using professionals usually pays for itself when the job is done... correctly.

3) Getting a JPI primary instrument on the used market is a great idea... the negotiations take the re-programming into account...unless you knew exactly what you were buying... and got a JPI from a plane with the same exact engine...

4) Its a primary instrument, have your mechanic deliver the needed information to JPI...

5) JPI may require that you send it to them for the update... some serial numbers are better than others...

6) If you are going with Cies fuel level gauges,  now would be a good time to let JPI know that too...

7) You can always sell this on CessnaSpace... and get an EI MVP....

8) EI has really good customer service right here on MS...

9) Minimize your mistakes, so JPI can’t take advantage of your situation...

10) There is a lot to know when buying used equipment... some people are pretty good with this... ask Alan...

Getting this done correctly is important for the health of that new engine...

JPI needs to get paid as if they were selling a new device...  kind of a cat and mouse game... 

PP thoughts only...

Best regards,

-a-

[Airways]

10 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

I have an analog gauge in the panel that shows output per alternator. But the JPI doesn't show that.

Is that why you kept that analog gauge ? I got rid of it but now I don’t know which alternator is doing what.  I selected the “alt 2” option when I ordered my EDM900 but unfortunately, this doesn’t give me a separate readout on the screen.  I kinda was hoping for this... 

[J Bird]

11 hours ago, carusoam said:

Sounds like a rant...

I can add it to the list...

A) Gill batteries are terrible...  (hey wait... did you just buy another Gill battery..? )

B ) Champion spark plugs are terrible...

C) JPI customer service is terrible....

D) If you didn’t like the charges to reuse a technical AW related device... compare that to S-tec...

 

 

1) JPI is known for their customer service...  we use Jeev who lives in their neighborhood... and knows the nice people at JPI...

2) Using professionals usually pays for itself when the job is done... correctly.

3) Getting a JPI primary instrument on the used market is a great idea... the negotiations take the re-programming into account...unless you knew exactly what you were buying... and got a JPI from a plane with the same exact engine... 

4) Its a primary instrument, have your mechanic deliver the needed information to JPI...

5) JPI may require that you send it to them for the update... some serial numbers are better than others...

6) If you are going with Cies fuel level gauges,  now would be a good time to let JPI know that too...

7) You can always sell this on CessnaSpace... and get an EI MVP....

8) EI has really good customer service right here on MS...

9) Minimize your mistakes, so JPI can’t take advantage of your situation...

10) There is a lot to know when buying used equipment... some people are pretty good with this... ask Alan...

Getting this done correctly is important for the health of that new engine...

JPI needs to get paid as if they were selling a new device...  kind of a cat and mouse game... 

PP thoughts only...

Best regards,

-a-

-A-, I was just being cheap and trying to avoid the charges for a second reprogram from 252 to encore conversion that's all. I currently have a UBG16 but it has been acting up so I figured "heck I have a JPI 930 let me see if I can have it installed along with the Microkit landing system" so I reached out to JPI.

 

[J Bird]

13 hours ago, Aerodon said:

The second alternator hangs off the back of the engine and is driven by a belt drive off the accessory case.  Then you need the second voltage regulator and all the wiring back to the circuit breaker panel.  All feasible, but probably quite expensive.  And I would imagine you could get it signed off as installing a factory option, the details are all in the writing diagrams and parts manuals.

I have an engine that I am thinking of parting out, you could persuade me by giving me a large amount of money for the alternator, mounting brackets, accessory case (exchange) etc.  Send me a PM.

 

Aerodon

 

 

I have your email.

[kortopates]

It's not the accessory case but a different model of starter adapter needed for the dual alternator. It's very costly. If you didn't already own a 252, it would be cheaper to keep looking. But good for you if you upgrade your bird!

 

You'll be changing the engine configuration (suffix after MB on data plate) but nothing hard about doing it.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[squeaky.stow]

12 hours ago, Airways said:

Is that why you kept that analog gauge ? I got rid of it but now I don’t know which alternator is doing what.  I selected the “alt 2” option when I ordered my EDM900 but unfortunately, this doesn’t give me a separate readout on the screen.  I kinda was hoping for this... 

I can help with that!