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Reporting ELT signal


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I’ve occasionally had ATC ask about ELT signals that were reported as they (I assume) triangulated.  Today I was VFR and picked up a very localized ELT.....in other words....very strong in a one square mile area and then weak in all directions outside of that. Could not see anything  in the wooded area. I cold called the nearest local airport tower who passed it on to Approach.  I assume they call CAP or  try to triangulate.  Is anybody familiar with the formal process that occurs?  Are these reports always followed up by....someone?  Is there a way to determine what the outcome is...some kind of public CAP log or ???  

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If its a 406 combined with the 121.5 beacon you heard then the SATSAT folks called the registered phone number(s)  within 5 minutes to determine if its a false alarm or not. I've only seen it go for false alarms so don't know details beyond that, but after the emergency contacts are exhausted without learning the status of the plane, I assume they next check the airport where the aircraft is based and then go from there. Knowing the N number makes a big difference. 

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Think I have it sorted out.  Using FlightAware....I was able to track the aircraft I thought it might have been.  The reason iTunes 121.5 to begin with was because I was watching potential conflicting traffic who dropped off the screen and never appeared visually.  Thought we were going to same airport....we were not....he was doing a procedure turn to another.  Coincidentally, there was an off runway excursion by another aircraft the day before.  My theory is that the ELT was set off and not discovered and was emitting. I suspect the week signal from battery running down and my top mounted antenna made it appear it was off airport.  Can’t fully explain it, but best I can come up with.  I did follow up with the local tower and they informed me that they handed it off to Center controllers and they didn’t know more.  So, I’ll never know the full story, but I feel comfortable that there is nobody out there waiting on rescue.  Still disappointed that an ELT can be going off without much sense of urgency.  Guess it reinforces the 406 ELTs.  I may need to revisit this....but my old Narco 10 keeps going.....but maybe nobody out there to listen for it...

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4 hours ago, skykrawler said:

If it's anywhere near a control tower they know it because they always have a dedicated radio on 121.5 and the volume set high.  That's why it's courteous to call them before testing, even at the top of the hour.  Reduces the startle factor.

 

Totally agree. It is tough when flying a plane with Guard as a toggle-on and it going off due to a unscheduled test. Well worth the call to tower prior.

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3 hours ago, irishpilot said:

Totally agree. It is tough when flying a plane with Guard as a toggle-on and it going off due to a unscheduled test. Well worth the call to tower prior.

I spoke to the tower manager the next day and he mentioned the check on the hour.  In this case the signal was before the hour and it was going off for at least the 20 or 30 minutes I was in the area.  The nearest tower was about 8nm away and they were not receiving it.  What was ultimately disappointing is that i don’t think there was any proactive response to it....or none that I will ever be aware of.  Even if it was a false alarm, I would think they would want to shut it off.  I would certainly hate to think if this were a real accident and nobody came looking.

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3 hours ago, takair said:

 I would certainly hate to think if this were a real accident and nobody came looking.

Shouldn't be a concern if you have a 406, if so its only few minutes before Cospas-Sarsat is verifying and looking for you.

But there has been no surveillance since 2009 for the 121.5 ELTs and it'll take more than a beacon going off and at least several hours before any one starts looking.  A $500 406 ELT fixes that.

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I’m a former ELT chaser for CAP, and these are actually reported and worked thru USAF AFRCC at Tyndall AFB in Panama City, Florida. Typically most of ELTs that are heard are reported by pilots to tower, approach, departure or center, who (are supposed to) immediately notify AFRCC. AFRCC assigns a mission number and forwards to the local CAP wing’s operations, who assigns an incident commander. 406 ELTs are picked up by satellite by AFRCC and include a latitude and longitude which may not be precise.  Doesn’t always work as well as it should.  

After AFRCC contacts CAP, they assign a duty incident commander, who either dispatches a plane with a crew to do an air search, or sends a ground team if it’s a location such as on or close to an airport, or both.  All are volunteers.  I’ve worked all sides of these, and all I ever worked were accidental triggers or boats.  But they’re all checked out.  Most are in aircraft in hangers or tie downs.  We used hand held radios to track them down on airport property.  We weren’t allowed to shut them off (private property), but we worked with airport management and law enforcement.

if you do hear a strong signal in the air that lasts for more than five minutes, report it immediately while in the air.  You could be saving someone’s life.  Note on your chart exactly where you are, including any towns or especially airports nearby.  Be as precise as possible, including your altitude.  (The lower you are, the more precise your report becomes.)

Sounds complicated to chase and find these, but it’s not.  It can be a bit time consuming but CAP and AFRCC treat these as a priority.  I’ve gotten calls at 3 am, put together a small team and had them found and dealt with within three or four hours.  Some I’ve worked with were myself and one other volunteer on the ground with hand held radios using a technique called “body blocking”.   We have also found them by dispatching aircraft with a Becker RDF, and I have flown many practice missions and a few actual missions because these remain a real priority.  I do have a few interesting and amusing stories to tell around “finds.”

The newer ELRs are 406MHz and include a GPS position within their satellite signal as noted above, but they do include a lower power 121.5 signal as well to aid in finding them.  Easily tracked and found in most cases, as noted above.  97% of all ELTs triggered are false alarms, but 3% are indeed real.

 

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1 minute ago, Ross Statham said:

I’m a former ELT chaser for CAP, and these are actually reported and worked thru USAF AFRCC at Tyndall AFB in Panama City, Florida. Typically most of ELTs that are heard are reported by pilots to tower, approach, departure or center, who notify AFRCC. AFRCC forwards to the local CAP wing’s operations, who assigns an incident commander. 406 ELTs are reported by satellite to AFRCC.  Supposedly.  Doesn’t always work as well as it should.

The IC either dispatches a plane to do an air search, or a ground team.  I’ve worked all sides of these, and all have been accidental triggers or boats.  But they’re all checked out.  Most are in aircraft in hangers or tie downs.  We used hand held radios to track them down on airport property.  We weren’t allowed to shut them off, but we worked with airport management and law enforcement.

Sounds complicated but it’s not.  It can be a bit time consuming but CAP AND AFRCC treat these as a priority.  I’ve gotten calls at 3 am, worked a team and had them found within a few hours.  Others have taken longer, of course.  I’ve also found them by air, and been one of the CAP ops guys working with the Air Force.  

The newer ELRs are 406MHz and include a GPS, but they do include a lower power 121.5 signal.  Easily tracked and found in most cases, as noted above.  97% of all ELTs triggered are false alarms, but 3% are indeed real.

 

Thanks, great info.  Is there a way a civilian can find out what came of a report?  In other words, can I determine what came of my report?

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Good question. Yes, it’s public info, and it’s tracked by the CAP and AFRCC. You will probably get quicker answers from the CAP in your state. Google “[your state] Civil Air Patrol” and there should be website with a phone for wing headquarters for your state.  Look up operations or call and ask for the number for Wing Operations, the head of whom who will be a senior volunteer. Tell them you’re a pilot and you were inquiring about the ELT you heard and reported over X.  Most will try to answer your question or may refer you.

Anything like this involves paperwork and record keeping, and if you get stonewalled by some old grouch and can’t get what you need, ask to speak with the Wing Public Affairs Officer. It may take a few days, but you’ll get the answers you need.   Be patient, and be polite, because they’re all volunteers. 

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In addition to SarSat and ELTs, don't search and rescue also use ADS-B and cell phone data to localize missing aircraft?

Every month Google tells me all the places I've been, so certainly locating my crushed body in a swamp would be a no-brainer for anyone trying to target me with advertising.  :lol:

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1 hour ago, carusoam said:

Our missing Mooniac in Western Canada was too far away from cell towers to be found...

It required the spring thaw to reveal the plane...

Not sure why the ELT did give any help...

Best regards,

-a-

Huge difference in going down where there are cell phone towers, ADS-B receivers, and lots of people and flying in the wilderness.

I'm always impressed with how seriously Canada takes the search and rescue portion of every flight plan...especially when I forget to cancel!  :ph34r:

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